Russia Invades Ukraine 2022

[Szdfan]

So far, it's just taking forever to get out of the country. Some missionary acquaintances are still waiting after waiting multiple days at the border. They were 1½ miles from the border 2 days ago, they're 900 yards away today.

For whatever reason, the Ukraine doesn't want people (including refugees) to leave.

Or perhaps the border crossings are overwhelmed beyond capacity. It’s not just the Ukrainian border checkpoint people pass through, but the checkpoint for the country on the other side of the border as well.

[Ken]

So far, it's just taking forever to get out of the country. Some missionary acquaintances are still waiting after waiting multiple days at the border. They were 1½ miles from the border 2 days ago, they're 900 yards away today.

For whatever reason, the Ukraine doesn't want people (including refugees) to leave.

Why would they need to leave? Russia is just "defending itself" against Nazis in the Donbas is what you told us on the other thread. Here they are, your exact words:

Is it right or wrong to defend one's self against Nazis? Well, Russia is doing exactly that in Donetsk and Luhansk.

[Dan Z]

Wow! The sanctions now include expelling a number of Russian banks from the international Swift transfer system. In a global economy, the sanction stick is a huge one when the West is unified. I'm impressed with the extent of these sanctions against Putin and Russia. This will be devastating for the Russian economy - Putin may very well have overplayed his hand (and may end up with an ungovernable country on his hands in Ukraine when his assault is done).

[Soloist]

Wow! The sanctions now include expelling a number of Russian banks from the international Swift transfer system. In a global economy, the sanction stick is a huge one when the West is unified. I'm impressed with the extent of these sanctions against Putin and Russia. This will be devastating for the Russian economy - Putin may very well have overplayed his hand (and may end up with an ungovernable country on his hands in Ukraine when his assault is done).

Putin seems pretty smart, I wonder if he is betting on increased trade with China to offset his economic losses. I think he is still holding back his main cards to see what Nato does.

I want to make it clear that I do not support Russia in this, I have a fascination with military politics. If I was not non-resistant, I likely would be supporting Ukraine in some way but as I belong to another Kingdom, I cannot get involved in using the sword. Hypocrisy and the use of the sword in so called just wars should make anyone think twice before believing war time propaganda and getting involved in deciding who is committing the bigger sin. Clearly I'm not in favor of war, I just am not convinced that "Russian troops" are committing any war crimes at any larger rate then any war. Putin on the other hand... who knows.

[Ken]

Wow! The sanctions now include expelling a number of Russian banks from the international Swift transfer system. In a global economy, the sanction stick is a huge one when the West is unified. I'm impressed with the extent of these sanctions against Putin and Russia. This will be devastating for the Russian economy - Putin may very well have overplayed his hand (and may end up with an ungovernable country on his hands in Ukraine when his assault is done).

Putin seems pretty smart, I wonder if he is betting on increased trade with China to offset his economic losses. I think he is still holding back his main cards to see what Nato does.

I want to make it clear that I do not support Russia in this, I have a fascination with military politics. If I was not non-resistant, I likely would be supporting Ukraine in some way but as I belong to another Kingdom, I cannot get involved in using the sword. Hypocrisy and the use of the sword in so called just wars should make anyone think twice before believing war time propaganda and getting involved in deciding who is committing the bigger sin. Clearly I'm not in favor of war, I just am not convinced that "Russian troops" are committing any war crimes at any larger rate then any war. Putin on the other hand... who knows.

The last thing that China wants is to legitimate the concept of breakaway provinces which is Putin's stated reason for this military invasion (defending the breakaway provinces of Donetsk and Luhansk). China has its own issue with breakaway provinces in Taiwan and to some extent Tibet. The very LAST thing China wants is to create legitimacy for that concept. If Russia has a legitimate interest in militarily defending breakaway provinces in Ukraine, then the US has the same legitimate interest in militarily defending the breakaway province of Taiwan. China has spent the past 50 years making the exact opposite argument.

More likely, China will use Russia's struggles in Ukraine to expand it's influence into Kazakhstan and the other former Soviet republics that border China. Historically there is no great love lost between Russia and China.

[mike]

Wow! The sanctions now include expelling a number of Russian banks from the international Swift transfer system. In a global economy, the sanction stick is a huge one when the West is unified. I'm impressed with the extent of these sanctions against Putin and Russia. This will be devastating for the Russian economy - Putin may very well have overplayed his hand (and may end up with an ungovernable country on his hands in Ukraine when his assault is done).

I am surprised at how long it is taking the Russians to accomplish their military goals. A bit ago I read that after three days they still haven’t overpowered any major city. If the Ukrainians keep holding out and if the weapons now pouring in belatedly from their allies make a difference, this could be a huge quagmire for Putin. However I still think it is probably only a matter of time until the country is overrun and subjugated.

[Ken]

[Szdfan]

I am surprised at how long it is taking the Russians to accomplish their military goals. A bit ago I read that after three days they still haven’t overpowered any major city. If the Ukrainians keep holding out and if the weapons now pouring in belatedly from their allies make a difference, this could be a huge quagmire for Putin. However I still think it is probably only a matter of time until the country is overrun and subjugated.

Yeah, the Ukrainians aren’t taking this lying down. There’s a video going around of a Ukrainian woman offering a Russian soldier sunflower seeds to put in his pocket so that at least the sunflowers will grow when he’s dead. The soldier keeps asking her not to escalate this further and she asks, how can this escalate any further? The Ukrainians are showing some extraordinary grit here.

I’m expecting Kiev to fall in the next few days, but I think the Russians will have a much harder time with an occupation than anticipated. Western Ukraine will never accept whatever puppet government Moscow installs.

[Szdfan]

Maybe it will be over quicker than we think.

From what I have observed, Ukraine has not once in this entire conflict refused talks with Russia or walked away from the negotiating table. Not during the buildup to war, and not after the invasion started. It was Russia that walked away from negotiations and launched military operations, not Ukraine.

The latest is that Zelensky has rejected talks in Minsk because Belarus is not a neutral country since part of the invasion was launched there. The Ukrainians are asking for talks in Warsaw or Istanbul.

[Szdfan]

Maybe it will be over quicker than we think.

From what I have observed, Ukraine has not once in this entire conflict refused talks with Russia or walked away from the negotiating table. Not during the buildup to war, and not after the invasion started. It was Russia that walked away from negotiations and launched military operations, not Ukraine.

The latest is that Zelensky has rejected talks in Minsk because Belarus is not a neutral country since part of the invasion was launched there. The Ukrainians are asking for talks in Warsaw or Istanbul.

The NYT live blog on this is reporting that Ukraine has agreed to talks on the Russian-Ukrainian border.