Poll: Age for Dating and Marriage

[JohnH]

I've seen that quote about small businesses before, but in the plain world, half of people's businesses do not fail after 5 years. However, the typical plain person's business is something a lot lower risk where they basically are offering needed goods or services and not trying to do some "innovative" kind of idea or aiming for really fast growth.

MLMs are just something housewives do. Nobody is doing that as a serious business, other than the occasional random person who somehow gets to the top of the chain, and in my experience those people usually are exiting the plain world anyway.

The point of this discussion is that, somehow, against all odds, the plain world keeps on being able to afford housing for itself, find employment for its young people, who then start (successful) small businesses, and remain surprisingly insulated from the problems otherwise afflicting the middle class, such as housing becoming really unaffordable in the cities, lack of decent jobs for young people, outsourcing, mass layoffs, and so forth. It would seem prudent to learn from why plain people are able to avoid these problems, and perhaps even look for solutions there.

[Ken]

I've seen that quote about small businesses before, but in the plain world, half of people's businesses do not fail after 5 years. However, the typical plain person's business is something a lot lower risk where they basically are offering needed goods or services and not trying to do some "innovative" kind of idea or aiming for really fast growth.

MLMs are just something housewives do. Nobody is doing that as a serious business, other than the occasional random person who somehow gets to the top of the chain, and in my experience those people usually are exiting the plain world anyway.

The point of this discussion is that, somehow, against all odds, the plain world keeps on being able to afford housing for itself, find employment for its young people, who then start (successful) small businesses, and remain surprisingly insulated from the problems otherwise afflicting the middle class, such as housing becoming really unaffordable in the cities, lack of decent jobs for young people, outsourcing, mass layoffs, and so forth. It would seem prudent to learn from why plain people are able to avoid these problems, and perhaps even look for solutions there.

Most Americans are able to find employment and housing. This is a wealthy nation and the percentage who are homeless and unemployed is very small. And plain folks aren't immune to layoffs, outsourcing, and everything else. Thousands in Indiana lost their jobs in the RV industry during the great recession, for example. And plenty are on Medicaid.

Yes there is generational wealth in Mennonite and Amish communities to be sure (lots of generational wealth in cities too). But not so much if you want to walk into that life from the outside. Which doesn't make it much of a solution for anyone else frankly. Why would anyone look to plain communities as a model to join when they and their family will still likely be an outsider 10 or even 20 years later if they don't have the right last name or ethnicity?

[ohio jones]

MLMs are just something housewives do. Nobody is doing that as a serious business, other than the occasional random person who somehow gets to the top of the chain, and in my experience those people usually are exiting the plain world anyway.

It's hard to stay Plain while driving a pink Cadillac. But the occasional random Conklin roofer who somehow gets to the top of the ladder would probably claim to be doing that as a serious business, and is not usually a housewife.

[apd]

We've discussed minimum age for dating and marriage, what about the opposite side of things. Is there an age that is considered late for dating/marriage? Is there an age that is considered too late?

[Ken]

We've discussed minimum age for dating and marriage, what about the opposite side of things. Is there an age that is considered late for dating/marriage? Is there an age that is considered too late?

What do you think?

[Outsider]

If you think 14 year-olds are mature enough to make life decisions about marriage, do you also think they are old enough to vote? drink? buy pot? join the military? drive commercial trucks on the interstate? sign legally binding contracts? control their own medical decisions including elective surgery?

I didn't say it should be encouraged. In fact, I said it was better if they waited until they were 18. But I think if they're going to be doing the horizontal tango, they should be encouraged to marry. It's better than ending up on "onlyfans".

I think "dating" is a garbage tradition. I think "courting" is a more civilized way to go about the mating ritual.

I didn't know all of that about Loretta. I just saw the movie, didn't read the book. But I'll take the Paul's advice over yours.

Other than semantics, what do you see as the difference? To my ear, "dating" sounds like a more mutual arrangement where both the boy and girl agree to do things together. Whereas "courting" sounds more like the guy pursuing the girl whether she really wants the attention or not.

No, actually, "courting" was supervised "dating". How do you get that it "pursuing the girl whether she wants the attention or not"? It was the royalty, aristocracy, wealthy, and social climbers that typically arranged marriages whether the girl or boy involved wanted to or not.

[Outsider]

I have no idea at all of what king of age expectations our congregation has. I will just say that personally, I think that only "dating for marriage" should be encouraged or approved. What I mean by "dating for marriage" is to avoid dating just for the sake of dating, due to peer expectations, etc. (Going out on informal 'dates' in a group - that's not such a negative in my mind.

I think "dating" is a garbage tradition. I think "courting" is a more civilized way to go about the mating ritual.

I've known some people who were really into the Josh Harris "courtship" ideas. They ended up with kids who still aren't married in their 30s.

Josh Harris himself eventually abandoned Christianity altogether, and now he and his wife are divorced. I would not take any marriage advice from him.

That kind of thinking is like the idea that CAM should have been disbanded because one person did something bad- like Angel Food ministries (which really helped struggling families) was destroyed and is now defunct because the founder's son had a scandal of some sort. Throwing the baby out with the bathwater.

[the-real-steve]

I think "dating" is a garbage tradition. I think "courting" is a more civilized way to go about the mating ritual.

I've known some people who were really into the Josh Harris "courtship" ideas. They ended up with kids who still aren't married in their 30s.

Josh Harris himself eventually abandoned Christianity altogether, and now he and his wife are divorced. I would not take any marriage advice from him.

That kind of thinking is like the idea that CAM should have been disbanded because one person did something bad- like Angel Food ministries (which really helped struggling families) was destroyed and is now defunct because the founder's son had a scandal of some sort. Throwing the baby out with the bathwater.

CAM should have been investigated by the Feds long before that happened. Lot's of funny business going on in the accounting department. But that's a story for another day

[Outsider]

I've known some people who were really into the Josh Harris "courtship" ideas. They ended up with kids who still aren't married in their 30s.

Josh Harris himself eventually abandoned Christianity altogether, and now he and his wife are divorced. I would not take any marriage advice from him.

That kind of thinking is like the idea that CAM should have been disbanded because one person did something bad- like Angel Food ministries (which really helped struggling families) was destroyed and is now defunct because the founder's son had a scandal of some sort. Throwing the baby out with the bathwater.

CAM should have been investigated by the Feds long before that happened. Lot's of funny business going on in the accounting department. But that's a story for another day

I don't know anything about their accounting. There were complaints because the Angel Food ministries had purchased a jet. Personally, I couldn't care less about them having a jet. I was glad to get food that would have cost me hundreds for 30-40 dollars. And a lot of other people were. If they got wealthy while helping me, I couldn't care less.

[the-real-steve]

We've discussed minimum age for dating and marriage, what about the opposite side of things. Is there an age that is considered late for dating/marriage? Is there an age that is considered too late?

Honestly, it's not your business. Unless you consider yourself Supreme Manager of the Universe, stay out of it. I know ladies that were well into their 40's and 50's and married. A family friend was in her mid-50's and married a widower old enough to be her dad. They both are beyond happy. Good for them!

Stop being a kill joy and let love be love.

(I'm in a rare mood today. Stay tuned for more snarky comments )