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Dan Z wrote: I don't know about your brothers-in-law motives Dr. Wojo, but I suspect this type of "disrespect" is what got Shadrach, Mechach and Abednigo thrown into the furnace.

DrWojo wrote:

Dan Z wrote: I don't know about your brothers-in-law motives Dr. Wojo, but I suspect this type of "disrespect" is what got Shadrach, Mechach and Abednigo thrown into the furnace.

So I’m curious, would you also consider Colin Kaepernick, Eric Reid and Kenny Stills, who all took a knee while the National Anthem was being played, to be modern Shadrach, Mechach and Abednigos?

Aslanhasheard wrote: Is it also showing disrespect to stand during the Pledge of Allegiance but not say it or put your hand over your heart?

DrWojo wrote:

Aslanhasheard wrote: Is it also showing disrespect to stand during the Pledge of Allegiance but not say it or put your hand over your heart?

The whole point I’m trying to make is to get Plain folks to think about the message they leave without speaking any words. In particular, the message that fellow Christians find offensive. I probably didn’t fully realize this until I moved to Oklahoma. I was visiting with a deacon of a Pentecostal Holiness Church who shared with me his experience when a local Mennonite Church sent their children to the Holiness school and asked whether the Holiness would remove their flag from the stage for graduation because the Mennonites find it offensive? The Holiness Deacon proceeded to tell me of his relatives who died in service of the USA, “that these jokers can disrespect their service.” He further informed me that if he had a supply of small flags he would not have hesitated to break into the Mennonite Church and drill small holes on the end of every church bench and place flags there. (I don’t doubt for a minute that he would have) Also, I don’t want to be making up any stories, but I’m fairly certain that years ago there was a Pacifistic Church that started in Oklahoma and was burned by the locals in the community because it did not have a US flag in it and eventually the church did keep one in it to prevent having it be burned.

I don't think breaking and entering and arson are appropriate responses for people towards those who don't wish to display the a country's flag. I don't know if the folks who reportedly burned a church were Christian but that Holiness Deacon definitely did NOT display any kind of Christian attitude towards the Mennonites.

To answer your question, Is it also showing disrespect to stand during the Pledge of Allegiance but not say it or put your hand over your heart? I believe what’s most important is the body language, facial expressions, etc that convey whether we truly care or whether others would question if we’d sooner spit on the flag. Perhaps a way to check ourselves would be to make sure our conduct towards saluting the flag is just as respectful as though we are saying the Lord’s Prayer?

Um... One is the inspired word of God and is speaking to the Creator of the universe. The Pledge of Allegiance was created by man to honor a country created by man. The Lord's Prayer definitely deserves more respect. I'll continue standing during the Pledge without saying it and without my hand on my heart. I'll try to not look like I'd sooner spit on the flag though my usual expression during the Pledge is neutral anyway.

RZehr wrote:You are equating, elevating the flag to praying to God? Worshiping God is no more reverent than that? Looks like flag worship to me. I think you have imbibed your community’s nationalism too much.

AnthonyMartin wrote:I'm not convinced that the respect suggested by DrWojo and the total allegiance to Jesus Christ results in the polar opposites developing in the dialogue. Perhaps it deserves its own thread. But, surely there are compatible ways to respectfully express gratitude for the privileges we experienced based on sacrifices made by many.

DrWojo wrote: The whole point I’m trying to make is to get Plain folks to think about the message they leave without speaking any words. In particular, the message that fellow Christians find offensive.

DrWojo wrote: I probably didn’t fully realize this until I moved to Oklahoma. I was visiting with a deacon of a Pentecostal Holiness Church who shared with me his experience when a local Mennonite Church sent their children to the Holiness school and asked whether the Holiness would remove their flag from the stage for graduation because the Mennonites find it offensive? The Holiness Deacon proceeded to tell me of his relatives who died in service of the USA, “that these jokers can disrespect their service.” He further informed me that if he had a supply of small flags he would not have hesitated to break into the Mennonite Church and drill small holes on the end of every church bench and place flags there. (I don’t doubt for a minute that he would have) Also, I don’t want to be making up any stories, but I’m fairly certain that years ago there was a Pacifistic Church that started in Oklahoma and was burned by the locals in the community because it did not have a US flag in it and eventually the church did keep one in it to prevent having it be burned.

Biblical Anabaptist wrote:

AnthonyMartin wrote:I'm not convinced that the respect suggested by DrWojo and the total allegiance to Jesus Christ results in the polar opposites developing in the dialogue. Perhaps it deserves its own thread. But, surely there are compatible ways to respectfully express gratitude for the privileges we experienced based on sacrifices made by many.

I think (correct me if I am wrong) the whole idea of us "enjoying freedoms" because of the sacrifices made by many is a myth perpetuated by those who are trying to incite young men (and women) to march off into war and kill their fellow men.