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Vote and discuss.

Please keep partisan comments/debates out of this thread - avoid comments that reflect negatively on either right-leaning or left leaning political persuasions. Please keep this thread focused on the topic.

#5-#7 is an interesting one; I’m not entirely sure how to interpret the promises God made to Hagar. They aren’t referred to very much in the rest of scripture although there are examples such as “Cast out the bondwoman and her son.”

I have actually heard a preacher use that verse as a justification for why it’s OK to drag Arabs out of their homes and bulldoze them.

I honestly don’t know.

I agree, I don't honestly know.

i don’t know about poll questions.

no individual, group, or country, has the right to ambush-attack the defenseless and unprepared,
in the past, this was deemed extreme cowardice, even children can understand the concept of shooting fish in a barrel.

these acts should never be tolerated, much less romanticized as glorious, or even justified.

temporal1 wrote: ↑Thu Oct 26, 2023 9:27 am i don’t know about poll questions.

no individual, group, or country, has the right to ambush-attack the defenseless and unprepared,
in the past, this was deemed extreme cowardice, even children can understand the concept of shooting fish in a barrel.

these acts should never be tolerated, much less romanticized as glorious, or even justified.

This doesn't really have anything to do with the question of divine right to the land. I don't believe in any concept of divine right to land for the Jews or anyone else, since the kingdom of Jesus is not of this world. That doesn't mean attacking innocent people is justified in any way; that is a separate question.

The earth is the Lord's. He has given us the creation mandate and it is all divinely ours...as his kingdom is come on earth as also in heaven. The worldly nation states with their borders and armies and weapons of the world are outside the rule and reign of Christ...but they will come under his rule and reign.

mike wrote: ↑Thu Oct 26, 2023 9:38 am

temporal1 wrote: ↑Thu Oct 26, 2023 9:27 am i don’t know about poll questions.

no individual, group, or country, has the right to ambush-attack the defenseless and unprepared,
in the past, this was deemed extreme cowardice, even children can understand the concept of shooting fish in a barrel.

these acts should never be tolerated, much less romanticized as glorious, or even justified.

This doesn't really have anything to do with the question of divine right to the land. I don't believe in any concept of divine right to land for the Jews or anyone else, since the kingdom of Jesus is not of this world.

That doesn't mean attacking innocent people is justified in any way; that is a separate question.

Thanks. i agree. too many believe they are justified by divine right. this blurs lines for me.

I've always believed the Jews list their land by Providence of God. Yet what does "forever" mean in the OT? The "world" still refers to that area as "The Holy Land". The OP is a hard question- only a "guess" but there is a right answer to God. Which? There were non-Jewish Christians who are Scripturally speaking "The Israel of God" by faith not heritage. The Jews of course would not see it that way.

I voted "other" because I'm uncomfortable with Divine right language for any nation, including Israel. Even in biblical times the "right" of Jews to the land was mediated by other factors like faithfulness and lack of respect for the weak and powerless.

As far as the escaton and God's plans for Jews, I don't have a lot of certainty except the Righteous Judge will judge righteously and with mercy.