Phrases and words Christians use not in the bible

[barnhart]

Bloviate.
Weisenheimer.

I don't use that word...

[MaxPC]

Bloviate.
Weisenheimer.

I don't use that word...

Then you are blessed to have people in your acquaintance who do not think they are the smartest people in the room and bloviate or pontificate while monopolizing the conversation. It's good to have fellowship that is both humble while being helpful.

[Sudsy]

Computer
Car
Telephone
Pocketknife
Tractor
Plastic
Cheetos
Pencil
X-ray
Mahogany
Tomato

True. I was thinking more in this thread of words and phrases more related to our spiritual/religious lingo.

[Sudsy]

"slippery slope"

[Sudsy]

"Come, Holy Spirit"

[MaxPC]

"Come, Holy Spirit"

True. Yet it's the English title of a very old hymn in Catholic World, "Veni Creator Spiritus". Believed to have been written in the 9th century it has a long standing place in our worship.

Here's the sung Latin version.

[Sudsy]

"Come, Holy Spirit"

True. Yet it's the English title of a very old hymn in Catholic World, "Veni Creator Spiritus". Believed to have been written in the 9th century it has a long standing place in our worship.

Here's the sung Latin version.

1 Cor 14:27 -

If any man speak in an unknown tongue, let it be by two, or at the most by three, and that by course; and let one interpret.

Sounds very nice but I forgot what I learned in Latin in high school.

This was also a very common phrase in my background. We sang this little chorus that puzzled me as a youngster -

Come Holy Spirit, I need thee
Come sweet Spirit, I pray
Come in Thy strength and Thy power
Come in Thy own special way

My puzzlement was - didn't the Holy Spirit already 'come' at Pentecost ? And if He now lives inside a believer, where is He to 'come from' ? Another chorus was worded 'Holy Spirit fall afresh on me'. It just seemed strange that we would use the word 'come' (which seemed to indicate to me that the Holy Spirit was external to me) instead of a phrase indicating that our desire was to be guided and empowered by the Holy Spirit within us. Were we asking for someone external from us to come into our presence or rather was it about us knowing/experiencing the presence of the Holy Spirit within us.

Would love to hear what yourself and others have thought regarding this. I don't mind some bunny trailing on this thread on these terms we use. This specific term has been quite common in Christianity and is it only me, that has found it a bit puzzling ?

[MaxPC]

My puzzlement was - didn't the Holy Spirit already 'come' at Pentecost ? And if He now lives inside a believer, where is He to 'come from' ? Another chorus was worded 'Holy Spirit fall afresh on me'. It just seemed strange that we would use the word 'come' (which seemed to indicate to me that the Holy Spirit was external to me) instead of a phrase indicating that our desire was to be guided and empowered by the Holy Spirit within us. Were we asking for someone external from us to come into our presence or rather was it about us knowing/experiencing the presence of the Holy Spirit within us.

Would love to hear what yourself and others have thought regarding this. I don't mind some bunny trailing on this thread on these terms we use. This specific term has been quite common in Christianity and is it only me, that has found it a bit puzzling ?

I think we aren't always aware of that indwelling in ourselves. Saying "come" raises our awareness of that which is already there.

We in (Catholic World) use the phrase "Come Holy Spirit" as a means of reminding ourselves to consult the Holy Spirit and to listen to His response. This hymn is sung before all the big meetings, elections, and decision-making events. It's also sung in private or prayed in private whenever we seek guidance from God. I love to listen to the chant sequence: it's very calming and does exactly what it's supposed to do: refocus me on the indwelling on Holy Spirit.

We might say it in Latin in formal settings. Or we might say it in Latin or our native language in formal or private/personal settings. In any event, those that use the Latin know what it is saying.

If you're interested here are the translations with the Latin in italics:

Veni Creator Spiritus,
mentes tuorum visita,
imple superna gratia,
quae tu creasti, pectora.

Come, Holy Ghost, Creator, come
from thy bright heav'nly throne;
come, take possession of our souls,
and make them all thine own.

Qui diceris Paraclitus,
altissimi donum Dei,
fons vivus, ignis, caritas,
et spiritalis unctio.

Thou who art called the Paraclete,
best gift of God above,
the living spring, the living fire,
sweet unction and true love.

Tu septiformis munere,
digitus paternae dexterae,
tu rite promissum Patris,
sermone ditans guttura.

Thou who art sevenfold in thy grace,
finger of God's right hand;
his promise, teaching little ones
to speak and understand.

Accende lumen sensibus,
infunde amorem cordibus,
infirma nostri corporis
virtute firmans perpeti.

O guide our minds with thy blest light,
with love our hearts inflame;
and with thy strength, which ne'er decays,
confirm our mortal frame.

Hostem repellas longius
pacemque dones protinus;
ductore sic te praevio
vitemus omne noxium.

Far from us drive our deadly foe;
true peace unto us bring;
and through all perils lead us safe
beneath thy sacred wing.

Per te sciamus da Patrem
noscamus atque Filium,
te utriusque Spiritum
credamus omni tempore.

Through thee may we the Father know,
through thee th'eternal Son,
and thee the Spirit of them both,
thrice-blessed three in One.

Deo Patri sit gloria
et Filio, qui a mortuis
surrexit, ac Paraclito
in saeculorum saecula.

All glory to the Father be,
with his coequal Son;
the same to thee, great Paraclete,
while endless ages run.

Amen.

[JimFoxvog]

My puzzlement was - didn't the Holy Spirit already 'come' at Pentecost ? And if He now lives inside a believer, where is He to 'come from' ? Another chorus was worded 'Holy Spirit fall afresh on me'. It just seemed strange that we would use the word 'come' (which seemed to indicate to me that the Holy Spirit was external to me) instead of a phrase indicating that our desire was to be guided and empowered by the Holy Spirit within us. Were we asking for someone external from us to come into our presence or rather was it about us knowing/experiencing the presence of the Holy Spirit within us.

Here is an example of what seems to be many of the people filled on Pentecost being filled later:

31 When they had prayed, the place where they were assembled was shaken, and they were all filled with the Holy Spirit and began to speak God’s message with boldness.

[bible]Acts 4,31[/bible]

[Sudsy]

My puzzlement was - didn't the Holy Spirit already 'come' at Pentecost ? And if He now lives inside a believer, where is He to 'come from' ? Another chorus was worded 'Holy Spirit fall afresh on me'. It just seemed strange that we would use the word 'come' (which seemed to indicate to me that the Holy Spirit was external to me) instead of a phrase indicating that our desire was to be guided and empowered by the Holy Spirit within us. Were we asking for someone external from us to come into our presence or rather was it about us knowing/experiencing the presence of the Holy Spirit within us.

Would love to hear what yourself and others have thought regarding this. I don't mind some bunny trailing on this thread on these terms we use. This specific term has been quite common in Christianity and is it only me, that has found it a bit puzzling ?

I think we aren't always aware of that indwelling in ourselves. Saying "come" raises our awareness of that which is already there.

We in (Catholic World) use the phrase "Come Holy Spirit" as a means of reminding ourselves to consult the Holy Spirit and to listen to His response. This hymn is sung before all the big meetings, elections, and decision-making events. It's also sung in private or prayed in private whenever we seek guidance from God. We might say it in Latin in formal settings. Or we might say it in Latin or our native language in formal or private/personal settings. In any event, those that use the Latin know what it is saying.

Thanks for the translation, Max. Yes, this is how I, too, understand it today, although I still hesitate to use this phrase. I just find it a somewhat confusing when we are asking the Holy Spirit for guidance to say 'come'. In my earlier experiences, the 'coming' was often understood as a manifestation of His presence and was thought to be present when there was various emotional manifestations. Not to say that His presence in us cannot affect our emotions but imo, moods created by music and other means can provide something other than the Spirit's manifestations.

Another phrase that is in the bible that can be somewhat confusing is 'be filled with the Spirit'. I believe it is used more in the sense of coming under the control of the Holy Spirit in one's life (give way to the Spirit) and not to getting more (quantity speaking) of the Holy Spirit. I was raised to believe being filled with the Spirit would manifest Himself in the speaking of an unknown tongue. I don't believe this to be the 'initial' nor 'required' evidence of Spirit filling and scripture speaks of various other evidences of the Spirit at work in us (boldness to witness, peace, joy, gifts, etc, etc). But 'to be filled' versus 'to allow the Spirit to reign' in us can be two different understandings of what is meant.