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I've got a specific scenario and I'm curious what advice you would give to this (real) person. They suffer from intrusive thoughts connected with OCD, they feel that they cannot be good enough and constantly fear going to hell. At the same time they are convinced (because of intrusive thoughts) that their struggles will be better if they do reassignment surgery. They feel like if they do not do surgery they will do it themselves as they can't deal with it anymore. This person identifies as transgender and has had some experience with therapy, but feels like the therapists just are there to listen and have not actually provided any solution.

This person was raised in a religious setting (not sure what) and I am guessing has been ostracized for pursuing their intrusive thoughts of transgenderism. They now are in a borderline mental health crisis that professionals would identify as gender dysphoria and treat with reassignment surgery and HRT.
These things will not fix the problem nor his struggle with sin, and things will not get better if he goes ahead with the surgery.

What would you tell him that might help?

I would tell him to find a new and better therapist or counselor. And to keep trying until he finds one who can help. Preferably one sympathetic to his faith if not of it.

I have had close family struggle with mental health issues (depression not trans stuff) and sometimes you have to go through a lot of different therapists until you find one who can really help. It isn't like physical medicine where any competent doctor can diagnose and prescribe the right treatment.

Personally I wouldn't be equipped to dive into that mess. It sounds like he has a lot of problems and needs real help. Do you want to be the one to blame if things go awry and he does something drastic like attempt suicide?

i thought of this young man as i listened to this (and cried for him).

Jamel_AKA_Jamal / BROOKS & DUNN “BELIEVE” | REACTION / 8min

Believe / Song by Brooks & Dunn

Old man Wrigley lived in that white house
Down the street where I grew up
My mama used to send me over with things
We struck a friendship up
I spent a few long summers
Out on his old porch swing
Said he was in the war, when in the navy
Lost his wife, lost his baby
Broke down and asked him one time
"How you keep from goin' crazy?"
He said, "I'll see my wife and son in just a little while"
Mm, I asked him what he meant, he looked at me and smiled

Said, "I raise my hands
Bow my head
I'm findin' more and more truth
In the words written in red
They tell me that there's more to life
Than just what I can see, I believe"

A few years later I was off at college
Talkin' to mom on the phone one night
Gettin' all caught up on the gossip
The ins and outs of the small town life
She said, "Oh, by the way son
Old man Wrigley's died"
Later on that night
I laid there thinkin' back
Thought about a couple long-lost summers
I didn't know whether to cry or laugh
If there was ever anybody
Deserved a ticket to the other side
It'd be that sweet old man
Who looked me in the eye

Said, "I raise my hands
Bow my head
I'm findin' more and more truth
In the words written in red
They tell me that there's more to life
Than just what I can see"

I can't quote the book
The chapter or the verse
You can't tell me it all ends
In a slow ride in a hearse

You know I'm more and more convinced
The longer that I live
Yeah, this can't be (no, this can't be), no, this can't be (no, this can't be)
No, this can't be all there is

Lord, I raise my hands
Bow my head
Oh, I'm findin' more and more truth
In the words written in red

They tell me that there's more to life
Than just what I can see (just what I can see), I believe
Oh, I (I believe)
I believe
I believe
(I believe)
I believe
(I believe)
I believe
(I believe)
I believe
(I believe)
I believe

Source: LyricFind

Ken wrote: ↑Wed Jun 29, 2022 7:46 pm I would tell him to find a new and better therapist or counselor. And to keep trying until he finds one who can help. Preferably one sympathetic to his faith if not of it.

I have had close family struggle with mental health issues (depression not trans stuff) and sometimes you have to go through a lot of different therapists until you find one who can really help. It isn't like physical medicine where any competent doctor can diagnose and prescribe the right treatment.

Personally I wouldn't be equipped to dive into that mess. It sounds like he has a lot of problems and needs real help. Do you want to be the one to blame if things go awry and he does something drastic like attempt suicide?

I echo Ken. I do not have the ability to go anywhere near this. Mental health stuff, yeah, I can help. But identity crisis... nope.

True story, years ago a man from a very conservative setting in my area tried to become a eunuch... by himself. Almost didn't end well.

temporal1 wrote: ↑Wed Jun 29, 2022 8:46 pm .. prayers for all who suffer when there seems to be no answer, no way out.
in these time, fall into submission to God, His will; understanding may not be possible. trust in Him, anyway.

1 Cor 10:13 describes how God provides strength in our worst times. He promises.
there are times that can seem unbearable, sometimes lasting years+years. sometimes life is lived one day at a time, sometimes minute by minute. sometimes pain can be so acute it seems physically unbearable. sometimes it’s impossible to realize you are living, but why, for what? live, anyway.

submit to God’s will. esp when it doesn’t make sense. that’s faith.

I agree on this with temporal1.

I would add that the apostle Paul had a 'thorn in the flesh' and who knows exactly what it was. Paul describes it as something from satan meant to buffet him. Paul prayed some three times for it to be taken away. God said no, His grace would be sufficient to cope with this. So instead of Paul seeking other sources for help, Paul accepted what God told Paul that this was for Paul's benefit to trust and rely on God regardless of this 'thorn'. How did Paul respond ? He believed God would give Him the grace needed and rejoiced that he would be experiencing the power God would give him to live with it.

First believe in Christ and be born again if this person had not sincerely given their heart to the Lord. I'm not sure what they mean by not 'being good enough' and ending up in hell but this might be that they are trusting in their own being good enough and have not trusted in what Jesus did to save them. Many grow up in Christian environments and do not experience the power of God working in their lives to overcome things because they have not believed in Christ and have the Holy Spirit living in them. But if they know they are saved, then look at Paul for an example that God will give us the ability to deal with whatever comes our way and whatever we are 'stuck with' if we are determined to trust in Him and His promises.

That is what comes to mind at the moment but seek the Holy Spirit's guidance in what to tell this person. He may use someone here or other means to guide you but I believe we must look to the Holy Spirit ultimately to hear that still small voice saying this is the way that we should go.

However, if you consider me an adulterer that will not receive eternal life, then best ignore what I suggest.

Soloist wrote: ↑Wed Jun 29, 2022 7:34 pm I've got a specific scenario and I'm curious what advice you would give to this (real) person. They suffer from intrusive thoughts connected with OCD, they feel that they cannot be good enough and constantly fear going to hell. At the same time they are convinced (because of intrusive thoughts) that their struggles will be better if they do reassignment surgery. They feel like if they do not do surgery they will do it themselves as they can't deal with it anymore. This person identifies as transgender and has had some experience with therapy, but feels like the therapists just are there to listen and have not actually provided any solution.

This person was raised in a religious setting (not sure what) and I am guessing has been ostracized for pursuing their intrusive thoughts of transgenderism. They now are in a borderline mental health crisis that professionals would identify as gender dysphoria and treat with reassignment surgery and HRT.
These things will not fix the problem nor his struggle with sin, and things will not get better if he goes ahead with the surgery.

What would you tell him that might help?

It is dangerous to try to diagnose and prescribe over the internet so I will only make a suggestion for a way forward. I would advise that a new therapist who shares the faith with this person be found; and plus that a psychiatrist be found that is willing to work respectfully in tandem with the therapist.

The psychiatrist can diagnose and prescribe medication for OCD if it is truly OCD. The therapist can mentor the person through faith and temptations.

Soloist:
.. These things will not fix the problem nor his struggle with sin, and things will not get better if he goes ahead with the surgery.
What would you tell him that might help?

Isolation, feeling as-if you’re so alone, so unique, is a strong factor in hopelessness. Hopelessness is lethal. (A competent psychiatrist once shared with us.) Hopelessness is #1 Enemy.

i want to clarify, i believe in competent counseling, and medicine, as available. understanding, much is unknown. IN ADDITION, we are all spiritual beings, our spirits need nourishment. no matter age, or challenge.

Said, "I raise my hands
Bow my head
I'm findin' more and more truth
In the words written in red
They tell me that there's more to life
Than just what I can see, I believe"

These are the operative words of faith. ^^
In order to be in a place to accept tangible help, our spirits need to be in submission to God.

Even years ago, i read personal observations of doctors that they noticed patients with deep faith beliefs responded best to treatments, including surgeries. Men of science acknowledging we are more than the sum of our physical parts.

Just as sodomites must realize fornication and adultery are likewise grave sins, so must those in confusion+agony over gender must realize that a lot of people all around them are suffering (what seems like) unbearable pain.

There is one place to go.
Submission of will to God, handing pain over to Him, He will take it. He will provide relief as no other. He promises.

The starting place. The place to be before, and along with, any and all other decisions.

Just like the song’s Mr Wrigley who had lived in abject pain+loneliness for DECADES, going through motions on earth, looking forward to Life Everlasting. No one can know the DECADES of life he lived, maybe not of his will, at all. But accepting this was God’s will for him.

No one should believe his sin/pain is so unique, it can’t be addressed. “Bidden or not, God is present.”

i don’t want to be misunderstood that i don’t appreciate mind+body medicine. i know some reject doctors.
i believe our spiritual life can make all the difference in how effective our earthly life is. including with doctors/medicine.
i’ve witnessed it, i’ve experienced it.

Before our children were born, i had this strong thought, “this is my child. who ever, what ever that child is, this is my child. description, condition, no matter.” no need to count fingers+toes. (counting digits was a common “go to” for new parents back then, before sonograms.) i thought, “why?” who cares how many fingers? this is my child, no matter. God’s creation.

i don’t believe i’d feel any different today.
we had friends expecting their second child, she was about 40. both with doctorate degrees, wonderful people.
i have no idea about faith. my guess would be they weren’t believers.

she shared with me that an amniocentesis was recommended. they rejected. saying, “why?” there was risk to the baby, and, they weren’t about to abort. i smiled and agreed. remembering how i accepted my babies before i knew them. God’s creation.
nothing formal. i wasn’t yet a believer, not a baptised believer. not an informed believer.

if i had a child who felt mixed up, even in an obviously mixed up body, i imagine i would hope to help that child see himself as one of God’s creations, designed with purpose, no matter if we can understand it or not. accept yourself, love yourself. be grateful to God. understand you might very well be different. for life. nothing wrong with different. as with all, seek after God’s will for your life.

the starting place that is equally offered to all is, submission to God’s will. God: all lives matter.

it’s really amazing what surrender to God can do to bring hopefulness to every one of us distorted beings.
definitely, before elective surgery, seek God’s will for your life on earth. the results might surprise. accepting “imperfect” minds+bodies may work out just fine.

human reasoning is ‘way too finite.

Resilience and Happiness After Spinal Cord Injury: A Qualitative Study
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4896325/

Results:
Analyses of these responses identified both specific resources and cognitive perspectives that are associated with perceived happiness. Responses fell within 8 general categories:
resilience, general outlook on life, social support and social relationships, religion or faith in a higher power, mood, physical health and functioning (including pain), social comparisons, and resources. Nuanced themes within these categories were identified and were generally concordant with self-reported level of happiness.

Conclusion:
A majority of respondents with SCI identified themselves as happy and explained their adjustment and resilience as related to personality, good social support, and a spiritual connection. In contrast, pain and physical challenges appeared to be associated with limited ability to bounce back.

Said, "I raise my hands
Bow my head
I'm findin' more and more truth
In the words written in red
They tell me that there's more to life
Than just what I can see, I believe"

Soloist wrote: ↑Wed Jun 29, 2022 7:34 pm I've got a specific scenario and I'm curious what advice you would give to this (real) person. They suffer from intrusive thoughts connected with OCD, they feel that they cannot be good enough and constantly fear going to hell. At the same time they are convinced (because of intrusive thoughts) that their struggles will be better if they do reassignment surgery. They feel like if they do not do surgery they will do it themselves as they can't deal with it anymore. This person identifies as transgender and has had some experience with therapy, but feels like the therapists just are there to listen and have not actually provided any solution.

This person was raised in a religious setting (not sure what) and I am guessing has been ostracized for pursuing their intrusive thoughts of transgenderism. They now are in a borderline mental health crisis that professionals would identify as gender dysphoria and treat with reassignment surgery and HRT.
These things will not fix the problem nor his struggle with sin, and things will not get better if he goes ahead with the surgery.

What would you tell him that might help?

I don’t know that I’d have any advice. I would share what aspects I’ve struggled with related to my depression and anxiety. A driving factor in my mental health issues was the belief that my value was based on my performance. I might share the one book that helped break that lie in my heart. “The Life of the Beloved” by Henri Nouwen.

Here’s a message he shared based on that book.