Face Punch

[MaxPC]

Kindly bear with me as this does pertain to Anabaptist teachings. I witnessed an astounding occurrence this week. I stopped by a local "biscuits and gravy" roadside stand and came across two men I know.

The man in his 50s brought up a subject that his acquaintance in his 70s made clear, both in verbalisations and in body language, that he was not interested in Mr. 50s' lecture. Mr. 50s did not take the hints and perseverated, quite literally pontificating to the entire line at the window that his opinions were right and anyone opposing was wrong. Mr. 70s finally had enough and quite literally punched Mr. 50s in the face, sending him to the ground. Mr. 70s told him that he needs to know when to shut up and stop being the last part of a donkey through a door. Mr. 70s got into his vehicle and drove off.

What are your thoughts if you had witnessed this event? Clearly "face-punching" is not an Anabaptist response, yet it was evident that Mr. 70s had been pushed beyond reason.

Should Mr. 50s apologise for his obnoxious behavior?

How would you have made peace in the heat of the moment, or would you have stepped back and let the lesson proceed?

[steve-in-kville]

How would you have made peace in the heat of the moment, or would you have stepped back and let the lesson proceed?

I watched something very similar in the workplace. It started as a shoving match and was near fist-throwing. A respected supervisor got between the two and told them it wasn't worth loosing their job over a stupid personal scrap.

If you're gonna get between two people like that, make sure your back-side is able to cover the check your mouth is about to write

[temporal1]

How would you have made peace in the heat of the moment, or would you have stepped back and let the lesson proceed?

I watched something very similar in the workplace. It started as a shoving match and was near fist-throwing. A respected supervisor got between the two and told them it wasn't worth loosing their job over a stupid personal scrap.

If you're gonna get between two people like that, make sure your back-side is able to cover the check your mouth is about to write

being in the workplace changes the scenario.
but, certainly, all first responders know these sorts of personal conflicts can be deadly (to first responders).

i’m glad there was no knife or firearm.
in today’s world, a simple punch in the heat of the moment - is something many dream of.

- - - - -

1955-ish.
i must have been 5 when with my mother and younger sibs at a shoe repair shop. i can still smell the leather and waxes.
we were waiting in rows of chairs, i was looking out the big shop windows at the street. a car drove up and parked just next to the shop. later, i learned, there was a bar just adjacent to the shoe shop. that’s probably when i learned the word, “bar.”

i saw 3 men scuffling. 1 man was in a rage, i don’t remember hearing anything. but it was intense. 2 men were struggling hard to restrain him, they tried to force him back into the car. to no avail. that’s when i learned how much stronger a person can be in a fit of anger/rage. the men were all about the same size. probably in their 20-30’s. OLD, to me!

i don’t think my mother noticed any of this. it was a nice sunny summer day.

it was quiet for just a little while. i thought nothing much of it. men scuffling. not really unusual.
but then. everything changed.

the angry man came back into view, now stumbling and disoriented. his entire head, shoulders, white shirt, were covered in blood. i’d never seen such a thing. i saw all of this. my mother saw the blood. she hurriedly moved us all away from the view. and told us to be quiet!

i later overheard the man was “hit over the head with a whiskey bottle.”
and that head injuries can cause a lot of blood.

we were not allowed to speak of it. one of my clearest and oldest memories. i’ve often thot about just how much harm a simple broken bottle can do. shudder.

in the world, even in schools, many folks wish boys+men would return to fists. i understand the sentiment.

by 50-70’s, most men have abandoned throwing punches. right?

[MaxPC]

by 50-70’s, most men have abandoned throwing punches. right?

Not in this case.

[Ken]

That must be one fit 70-year old if he can knock a man down with one punch.

[justme]

some time ago, i realized that the only way some people learn anything is by pain.

[Ken]

some time ago, i realized that the only way some people learn anything is by pain.

And there are plenty who are so hard-headed they are unteachable, whether by pain or persuasion.

[MaxPC]

some time ago, i realized that the only way some people learn anything is by pain.

Justme: are you saying that there are occasions in which the lesson must proceed? I can see where that would be wise, especially if one does not know the entire story. The punch was so sudden there was no time to intervene. It shocked everyone, including Mr. 50s.

If we see a conflict building, indeed escalating, is there a time and circumstance for interventions?
What interventions would be consistent with nonresistance?

[Bootstrap]

If this were a real situation, I think it would be about the two men involved and healing their relationship. After the conflict, I imagine each should want to listen to the other, perhaps with mediation to help them hear what the other is saying. They probably wouldn''t need someone from the outside to tell them who is right, they probably wouldn't benefit by an Internet forum discussing who was right. I would check in with them and see how they are doing, ask about whether they have talked to each other since, see how they are feeling.

Clearly, each of them did at least something problematic. And if this were a real situation, it would probably be something that had built up over time. There might be other things they need to talk out. They might need help reflecting on their own contributions before they talk, what they might each apologize for.

I would never suggest that someone deserved to be hit because of what they said. I would certainly encourage people to avoid fighting words, taunting, mocking. Odds are, both Mr 50s and Mr 70s have some difficulty in a conversation with someone who has strongly different opinions. Which is becoming increasingly common, but that's really unfortunate.

[PetrChelcicky]

My idea is that we have to be peacekeepers, not peacemakers - or at best peacemakers in our own conflicts by being peacekeepers. The whole idea about "making peace" as a third party in other people's conflicts is an exaggeration, leading to hubris and mental overload.
With other words, there need not be a proper solution to your problem.
That said, if I had seen this coming, I probably would have tried to start a conversation with the 50 years old guy simply in order to divert his attention.