i agree.Ken wrote:At this point we have zero reason to believe that (JMast's) case will be handled improperly or unjustly. Rather than hand-wringing about the criminal justice process, the more productive approach would seem to be:
1. Working to clean house within church organizations to prevent this sort of thing from happening again
2. Working for recovery and peace for his victims.
Dan Z wrote:Here's an interesting illustrative story from our time in Haiti:
Most who have lived in Haiti know that when a thief gets caught in the act, mob justice can be swift and often deadly. This is the way street justice often works in a country with a broken civil justice system. Well, a number of years ago one such thief was discovered in the Delmas section of Port-au-Prince, and the cry rang out in the street for him to be chased down and pay for his crime. He ended up trapped by a mob of dozens of angry people on a dead-end street which happened to be in front of the Mennonite Central Committee guest house. As people picked up stones and sticks and closed in on the robber, hearing the commotion and fearing the thief would be lynched, a few of the MCC American and Haitian staff bravely placed themselves between the thief and the mob, pleading for his life. They were able to keep the mob from taking its justice long enough for the police to arrive and usher the thief away.
As a non-resistant Christian I felt a real kinship with my MCC friends who put themselves in harms way out of their conviction that they should save the life of this criminal. One could argue that any thief in Haiti knows the consequences of getting caught in the act, and that this fellow simply deserved the justice that would rightfully be meted out by the culture in which he lived. You could say he should have known better - so let the chips fall where they may - and actually by saving his life the MCC staff deprived the thief's victims of the restitution they deserved. But these missionaries knew that the teachings and example of Jesus called them to be peacemakers in the face of violence, and so they preserved the life of this undeserving thief...just like Jesus did for them. Despite what some are insisting, I have never argued that Jeriah should avoid the legal consequences for his wrongs in Haiti and the US - in fact I have argued the contrary, he should do the time he has coming to him...but my concern is that that even the life of a child rapist has value before God - and that if I am called to the non-violent way of Christ, how can I stand by and give blessing to Jeriah (or ANYONE else) being turned over to what I know full well may be the mob justice of a Haitian prison.
As Ken has pointed out, the reality is that my opinion will likely make little difference in the end, the US and Haitian justice systems will need to work out Jeriah's fate, but what I can do, for consistency sake, is to lend my voice to his humane treatment and the preservation of his life because I am committed to the sanctity of life - even if it is the life of one who has done such evil - in the hopes that even a child rapist can find redemption some day.
That usually depends on how well known the person's crime is. I have a friend in state prison who said it is understood that one doesn't talk about his crime, and many inmates really don't know what others' offenses were. Often they can guess. I was surprised to learn this. But in a highly publicized case like this one, yes, by all means you are right.hillperson wrote:If JMast ends up in an American prison rather than a Haitian prison you can be assured it will be a long time before he’s safe with the general population.
1. He will have a lot of company. Our prisons are full of sex offenders.mike wrote:That usually depends on how well known the person's crime is. I have a friend in state prison who said it is understood that one doesn't talk about his crime, and many inmates really don't know what others' offenses were. Often they can guess. I was surprised to learn this. But in a highly publicized case like this one, yes, by all means you are right.hillperson wrote:If JMast ends up in an American prison rather than a Haitian prison you can be assured it will be a long time before he’s safe with the general population.
Dan Z wrote:Here's an interesting illustrative story from our time in Haiti:
Most who have lived in Haiti know that when a thief gets caught in the act, mob justice can be swift and often deadly. This is the way street justice often works in a country with a broken civil justice system. Well, a number of years ago one such thief was discovered in the Delmas section of Port-au-Prince, and the cry rang out in the street for him to be chased down and pay for his crime. He ended up trapped by a mob of dozens of angry people on a dead-end street which happened to be in front of the Mennonite Central Committee guest house. As people picked up stones and sticks and closed in on the robber, hearing the commotion and fearing the thief would be lynched, a few of the MCC American and Haitian staff bravely placed themselves between the thief and the mob, pleading for his life. They were able to keep the mob from taking its justice long enough for the police to arrive and usher the thief away.
....
This is what I was attempting to illustrate in a previous post. (And, judging from the news, it seems to be more and more the norm in large cities in the States.)GaryK wrote:Dan's story reminded me of the young man's body I saw on the back of a police pickup one day when I went to visit someone in the hospital in Monrovia. I asked the people gathered around what happened. They said the young man snatched someone's cell phone and ran off with it and the owner of the phone started yelling "rogue, rogue, rogue" as he pursued the thief. More and more people joined the chase and closed in on him to the point he turned into a yard and grabbed a small child and held the child tightly to him as a means of trying to keep the mob off of him. Someone snatched the child away and "justice" ensued. I didn't count the stab marks but I would estimate he was stabbed 30 times, if not more. A young man, probably no more than 25, lost his life to "justice" for stealing a cell phone.
That same type of "justice" is also not that uncommon within law enforcement and judicial systems in some of these countries.
I didn’t say it then, but this was in the tribal village. I also convinced him to turn himself into the Indian Agency, and the chief and another man went along. In this case he was not put in jail or anything – the Indian Agent just had the family move out of the village for several years. They moved to a place about two days walk away, from where they could hear & see the airplane pass overhead each time when we were returning to the village. Then they would come stay there while we were there, and leave again when we left. Even the father feared for his life if we were not there. Here's another thing I didn't say about this case - the murder's mother was very verbally abusive to this boy as he grew up, and had done so again just hours before he shot & killed his cousin.In the setting in which we lived, there is no police force - they carry out their own retributions. With difficulty I convinced the father of a murder victim to not kill the perpetrator. (He did shoot over his head, but didn't try to hit him.)
Our experiences are different. Your experience has clearly been positive and seems to relate much to those on the field. My genuine compassion is towards those missionaries who’ve given their lives out of love and are being negatively affected by this tragedy. To the contrary, the individuals I’ve known are some of those at top levels. You said well, “a few well-meaning but misguided.” The lack of understanding, of what is needed for an individual to change when involved in these actions, is such a gross lack of understanding at so many levels. When this is found in individuals at the top levels it does require a scrutinization of the organization as a whole. Further, what if so many of that era (age group) in our circles have operated in this way for a long time? And what if there are many who want that to change? And, what, or how much, of this is due to An older generation not really understanding the rapid changes that have occurred in our world due to technology and social media, and all the available information?hillperson wrote:Well said Dan.Dan Z wrote:This statement (and others like it that I am reading) makes me think that you don't know CAM, its ministry, or its people at all.Sienna wrote:But why would you even want to salvage an institution that is corrupt at the highest level of oversight?
Regarding CAM, I think a few well-meaning but naive & misguided and very human leaders made a horrible choice a while ago to believe that repentance and marriage and maturity and spiritual healing and church discipline somehow changed a depraved mind. And perhaps there was something in the culture that elevated these fellows too high for their own good. They gave a predator access to those they were committed to serve. I know they are suffering deeply for their error, and they'll bear it the rest of their days. Why and how this happened needs to be investigated - and changes need to happen for sure. But to call CAM leadership "corrupt at the highest level of oversight" just doesn't line up at all with my 30 year experience with CAM as a donor, fellow mission worker in Haiti, and a brief time as a CAM mission worker in the 90s. You don't know CAM's people.
This is a great big tragic mess - no question. It hurts us all in the Conservative Mennonite community deeply and we will do some serious soul searching for sure. But what I am seriously beginning to struggle with is the cynicism, the conspiracy mongering, and the disenfranchised griping that I am hearing that is attempting to take the acts of a depraved heart (which we all universally condemn) and the leadership failure of a few CAM executives, and transform it into a sweeping condemnation of the Conservative Anabaptist community. Yes, a few of us have fallen - give us a hand up. Don't spit on us while we're down.