CAM Molestation Issue

[RZehr]

I feel tired. I’ve been trying to think of possible ways this could possibly be something other than what it looks like on CAM’s part, but it is wearing. I’m supposing and fearing that the worst will turn out to be reality. It’s not that I’ve learned anything new in the last 24 hours, but it just sort of feels like I’m trying to make something true that isn’t.
I should think of something else for a while.

[Aurien]

I feel tired. I’ve been trying to think of possible ways this could possibly be something other than what it looks like on CAM’s part, but it is wearing. I’m supposing and fearing that the worst will turn out to be reality. It’s not that I’ve learned anything new in the last 24 hours, but it just sort of feels like I’m trying to make something true that isn’t.
I should think of something else for a while.

Unfortunately it probably is what it looks like. If I remember correctly the Christian News article said that CAM had a meeting scheduled for Monday. There'll probably be more news going around social media after that. The most useful thing we can do right now is pray.
It probably would be a good idea to focus on something else even if only for a few hours. I know I need to take breaks from intense things like this or I start to become overwhelmed.

[Ken]

This begs the question, didn't she trust the Lord to take care of the situation? Or wasn't God dealing with the problem according to her time line? Is she appointed by God to expose abuse, or is she self appointed? Was she being used of God or playing God? And under whose authority, the Lord's authority or her own self appointed authority?

I think sometimes all of us, myself included, go before the Lord, and take matters into our own hands. We saw that in the Old Testament when Sarai, gave her Egyptian slave, Hagar, to Abraham, to bear a son. Or when Saul didn't wait for the prophet Samuel at Gilgal. Not waiting on the Lord to do His work is something we all need to guard against.

I'm sitting here shaking my head, just truly astounded at your reasoning here. Heaven help us.

Brings to mind the parable of the drowning man:

https://storiesforpreaching.com/i-sent-you-a-rowboat/

[Aurien]

I'm sitting here shaking my head, just truly astounded at your reasoning here. Heaven help us.

1 John 4:1A Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God.

Are you saying that Trudy Metzger has a spirit that is not of God?

1 John 4:1-3
1 Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, for many false prophets have gone out into the world. 2 By this you know the Spirit of God: every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God, 3 and every spirit that does not confess Jesus is not from God. This is the spirit of the antichrist, which you heard was coming and now is in the world already.

[Grace]

Are you saying that Trudy Metzger has a spirit that is not of God?

.

Absolutely not. Don’t put words in my mouth. I merely asked questions In a prior post and the response was “heaven help us”. Asking questions is part of testing the spirits.

[Valerie]

This begs the question, didn't she trust the Lord to take care of the situation? Or wasn't God dealing with the problem according to her time line? Is she appointed by God to expose abuse, or is she self appointed? Was she being used of God or playing God? And under whose authority, the Lord's authority or her own self appointed authority?

I think sometimes all of us, myself included, go before the Lord, and take matters into our own hands. We saw that in the Old Testament when Sarai, gave her Egyptian slave, Hagar, to Abraham, to bear a son. Or when Saul didn't wait for the prophet Samuel at Gilgal. Not waiting on the Lord to do His work is something we all need to guard against.

I'm sitting here shaking my head, just truly astounded at your reasoning here. Heaven help us.

God is longsuffering- it's difficult to understand why it was allowed to go on for 20 years- especially when CAM and his church was aware at some point and then they sent him back out-

The way I see it is how do you know that it's not God using Trudy? I'm not saying she is a prophetess but certainly God used Nathan to bring David's sin to light- and there were grievous consequences but God did give David time- and then He had to use someone to speak through.

[Grace]

God is longsuffering- it's difficult to understand why it was allowed to go on for 20 years- especially when CAM and his church was aware at some point and then they sent him back out-

The way I see it is how do you know that it's not God using Trudy? I'm not saying she is a prophetess but certainly God used Nathan to bring David's sin to light- and there were grievous consequences but God did give David time- and then He had to use someone to speak through.

Very true, God is long suffering and His ways and His timing is hard for us to comprehend.

Thanks for that perspective.

[mike]

So Trudy took on the responsibility of exposing this tragedy. This begs the question, didn't she trust the Lord to take care of the situation? Or wasn't God dealing with the problem according to her time line? Is she appointed by God to expose abuse, or is she self appointed? Was she being used of God or playing God? And under whose authority, the Lord's authority or her own self appointed authority?

I think sometimes all of us, myself included, go before the Lord, and take matters into our own hands. We saw that in the Old Testament when Sarai, gave her Egyptian slave, Hagar, to Abraham, to bear a son. Or when Saul didn't wait for the prophet Samuel at Gilgal. Not waiting on the Lord to do His work is something we all need to guard against.

As I said I have no grievances with Trudy as I believe she has helped many women who have suffered from abuse. I wish her the best and hope the motives of her heart are pure and humble. And if her motives aren't the best, God can still use her in a mighty way, as we all are imperfect.

By this reasoning, we should never do anything about evil. That's not what Jesus taught. He called evil out for what it was.

I'm not on the same page as Trudy Metzger, and I'm not always sure she has the best angle on everything, but it is disingenuous to criticize her for publicizing uncomfortable but true information that reflects negatively on sexual abusers and communities that don't deal well with them. This situation is not about the people exposing the facts. It's about the terrible abuse and the response of individuals within respected organizations. If you're going to fixate on somebody like Trudy, focus on giving her nothing to talk about.

[temporal1]

(mike posted whilst i was writing, this is not a response to him.)

God is longsuffering- it's difficult to understand why it was allowed to go on for 20 years- especially when CAM and his church was aware at some point and then they sent him back out-

The way I see it is how do you know that it's not God using Trudy? I'm not saying she is a prophetess but certainly God used Nathan to bring David's sin to light- and there were grievous consequences but God did give David time- and then He had to use someone to speak through.

Very true, God is long suffering and His ways and His timing is hard for us to comprehend.

Thanks for that perspective.

i appreciate your perspective, too, Grace.
i sense your honesty, and that’s the most that can be hoped for, as we go along in our journeys.
we journey and learn along the way. not everyone has the same experience, reads from the same script. i will guess your perspective is shared by others, and there are more perspectives not represented here.

i’m just beginning to learn of Trudy M., i have no certain conclusion.

i agree, tho, God uses -all- for His purposes, even our awful mistakes.
we can err big-time, i believe, when we do, God looks at intent, and can be merciful.

Welcome to MN! -

[temporal1]

Page 15 (ancient history)

I was excited to get things from CAM and read stuff to my family and pray. They are excited to read the Billboard Evangelism team card with a couple recognizable faces. We had a Christmas where my parents came by with a load of secular presents and our house was chaos, the only thing that seemed to calm them was sitting at the computer looking at the CAM programs and them slowly coming over and reading about the programs to them. Eventually they got to choose one. They talk about that throughout the year.
Then to see their faces the other day to tell them CAM seems to not hold people to a proper accountability and children are hurt because of it...
I feel like I let them down...

i would suggest use this as an important teaching moment.

i would make it about the grave sin of idol worship.
no human is perfect, our most respected and trusted friends, or family, can disappoint us, or let us down. even our mothers and fathers, who, ordinarily would not harm us, can fail.
knowing and keeping God at center is our strength, He is our coping mechanism.

one sign of idol worship sneaking into our minds is when we become “so hurt” by others’ betrayal or bad behavior. when we keep the recognition that “none is perfect,” the disappointments don’t cut quite so sharply. idol worship is sneaky! it creeps in when we least expect it.

a few days ago, i read a post by someone, a grown man, who was devastated to learn Martin Luther King Jr., had affairs, and a seedy side. i empathized, saying it can be sad to learn those we respect and trust are imperfect. we are imperfect.

we are not to worship sacred cows. we don’t think we do!
but, when these big disappointments occur, they can serve as a good nudge to rethink just who, or what, it is we worship.

does that make any sense at all?

i try to convey this to my (now adult) children, even when they were young, “we are your parents. we love you!” but, only One Perfect One who will not fail you. worship and trust God.
it’s easier to forgive when, to begin, perfection was not expected.

it seems, CAM has some serious accounting to attend to. this must not be minimized.
like Hats Off, i would not throw the baby out with the bathwater.

Good advice- I think I may have entered into this when first seeking Anabaptism without realizing it- putting them up on a pedestal I should not have-

Valerie,
i didn’t mean to overlook this. thank you for understanding my hoped-for point.