Stereotyping and Overgeneralizing People and Institutions

[barnhart]

Let's move the specifics of the discussion about AP to the AP thread. I wanted this thread to be about the problem of Stereotyping and Overgeneralizing things about Anabpatists outside of AP.

The generalization of Anabaptists is as old as the movement itself and one group generalizing other groups within is nearly as old. The names "Anabaptist" and "Mennonite" are from outsiders making generalizations. As I recall Simmons once excommunicated the entire Swiss brothers movement over their handling of the ban. This is history repeating.

Where and when did this happen? Which "Simmons" was this?

Menno. Google it.

[ohio jones]

Did you mean: menno simons

[ken_sylvania]

The generalization of Anabaptists is as old as the movement itself and one group generalizing other groups within is nearly as old. The names "Anabaptist" and "Mennonite" are from outsiders making generalizations. As I recall Simmons once excommunicated the entire Swiss brothers movement over their handling of the ban. This is history repeating.

Where and when did this happen? Which "Simmons" was this?

Menno. Google it.

Google doesn't return any historic or authoritative sources that would corroborate the claim that Menno Simons excommunicated the entire Swiss Brethren movement. That's why I asked for more information.

[barnhart]

Where and when did this happen? Which "Simmons" was this?

Menno. Google it.

Google doesn't return any historic or authoritative sources that would corroborate the claim that Menno Simons excommunicated the entire Swiss Brethren movement. That's why I asked for more information.

We have different Googles I guess. My Google AI even has a summary. Here is an article from Anabaptist World that mentions it but I hesitate to post because it might prove distracting.


What Menno got wrong and the difference it makes | Anabaptist World https://share.google/XpaDaC8HbwwFFgdiP

[ken_sylvania]

Menno. Google it.

Google doesn't return any historic or authoritative sources that would corroborate the claim that Menno Simons excommunicated the entire Swiss Brethren movement. That's why I asked for more information.

We have different Googles I guess. My Google AI even has a summary. Here is an article from Anabaptist World that mentions it but I hesitate to post because it might prove distracting.
What Menno got wrong and the difference it makes | Anabaptist World https://share.google/XpaDaC8HbwwFFgdiP

This is what Google AI shows

I saw that claim by Marcus Smucker, but since he doesn't source it I was wondering where the claim comes from.

[JohnH]

On my work account:



On my personal account, which has a Google AI Pro subscription:



What is truth?

[ohio jones]

Ask artificial intelligence, get artificial truth.

[barnhart]

Ask artificial intelligence, get artificial truth.

Very true. But in fairness I didn't, I googled and they offered me a summary without my consent...

I don't remember where I read the basic fact of the dis-fellowshipping of the Swiss, possibly Estep. Maybe I'll skim through and try to find it. The Google search turns up long tedious article from mennosimmons.org that seems to be an English translation of his writing about the ban but I didn't get far enough to verify details.

It's certainly not out of character for Simmons as he excommunicated large swaths of dutch Anabaptists for the same reason.

[JohnH]

Ask artificial intelligence, get artificial truth.

Very true. But in fairness I didn't, I googled and they offered me a summary without my consent...

A Google search is an AI tool that returns AI-generated results.

I don't remember where I read the basic fact of the dis-fellowshipping of the Swiss, possibly Estep. Maybe I'll skim through and try to find it. The Google search turns up long tedious article from mennosimmons.org that seems to be an English translation of his writing about the ban but I didn't get far enough to verify details.

It's relatively simple to feed the entire works of Menno Simons into an AI and then run queries against it with various questions.

For Simmons, one might fight that instead they get advice on dance routines to help stay in shape.

[Szdfan]

I believe this is an example of what Ernie was getting at. I have no idea what you are talking about in your last paragraph. I listen to most of their content and have not picked up on your characterization of them at all. Maybe you can point us to an example of what you are talking about.

They seem quite willing to give air time to concern about things like "Christian nationalism"; I have yet to see any airtime given to the problematic political inroads in more liberal Anabaptist circles.

That's what I'm getting to.

It basically makes it a farce to claim that they're just concerned about politics in general, because they aren't: they're only concerned about one particular political leaning.

I disagree.

I think one of the reasons why there’s more discussion on this forum about the inroads into conservative Anabaptism rather than liberal Anabaptist is because the majority of Anabaptists on this forum are conservative. You can’t really have a conversation with liberals who aren’t here.

So I don’t think the imbalance itself is a sign of ideology. It may just reflect the makeup of the forum. I think that a topic like Christian Nationalism might have more urgency on this forum because it affects conservative Anabaptism more directly than whatever is going on in MCUSA affects them.