Dank Kingdom Christian Memes

[Wade]

Today I saw an atheist friend of mine that was sober for a year and a half walking into the liquor store. He told me that I am the only person he has told that he has relapsed. He also told me he is ready to sit down and have a bible study with me.
Yesterday a conservative evangelical Christian friend that has interest in Anabaptism shared again about his wife wanting to leave him so he is ready to go shoot himself.
The day before a divorced ex-Pentecostal that wants to come to a CA church phoned asking questions about day 6 of creation along with asking me a number of times if it would be okay for him to remarry.
I have people phoning asking if they can give my number to a drunk friend that needs help - meanwhile my friend who has been in AA for longer than I have been alive says, "Wow, they must be serious about getting help if they are calling you."
This kind of stuff has become fairly normal in my life and honestly it is brutally hard to stare people in the face and share the words of Christ they don't want to hear. So when I need help because I am not strong enough to help these people I need to not only go to Christ but to some brothers and sisters in Christ too.
I really feel strongly if I presented to these people sarcastic or mocking memes I would NOT have any GOOD opportunity to point them to the only place that there is Hope. Christianity is no joke. We need each others help and prayers in this battle - it seems that is too much to ask.

[Josh]

Part of it may be generational, but some of what is driving what JoshScott called "crowds of people and groups in orbit around conservative Mennonitism" is that conservative Mennonites have some serious problems that are largely being ignored. So while the "conservatives" condemn those who don't wear the correct clothing or engage on the internet correctly, or etc., they are ignoring huge issues like sexual abuse or the sin of favoritism or materialism or contentious/hateful church splits.

Conservative Mennonites can get upset about there being places like DKCM, but I don't think they can wash their hands of it and say they haven't helped create its content.

I think is a profoundly insightful post. I know there is trauma in the CM world from my own extended family that frequently does not get addressed or dealt with. I’m glad when there are ways to express it. If memes are a minor form of therapy and it provokes discussion, then that’s a good thing. Some of the posters on DCKM are thoughtful.

Szd, you and I are both technically MC USA members (or at least I was until they changed,
I think, to FEC). You should know as well as I do that abuse and trauma does not know any conservative or liberal distinction, and that a great deal of abuse in the liberal-progressive Mennonite world got covered up and not dealt with.

Memes don’t help it get dealt with, though. I focus on sweeping my own house, so I focus on doing what I can in the CM world, or in my own denomination. There has been real progress in the liberal-progressive Mennonite world in recent years too. But let’s not point fingers at each other as somehow being “worse”, even if making that accusation feels good.

[ToseekGod]

I used to be registered on thehistoricfaith.com. There was a link months back to this DKCM facebook page. There was a 13 year old boy asking how to find the page and was getting help - it was sad, I warned the boy it wasn't anywhere I would encourage my 13 year old son to check out. Protestants and Catholics have better things than CA's I guess for children...
Anyway, when I checked it out the first time there was a couple posts from a Dean Taylor that struck me as him having some involvement or participation anyway. I hope he has stopped but I don't know since I haven't checked it out in a while.

Understood. I was strictly going by some things he said on the DKCM session with Chester Weaver. Other than that I don't know what his involvement is with DKCM.

I did enjoy that they had Chester on.

Partly where I'm coming from is years without fellowship and searching for encouragement. The person who has had the most profound impact on my life in encouraging me to follow Christ compassionately loving others is lesterb. I doubt I'd love my wife and children and God as much without his influence. And probably the person who has encouraged me the most in loving serving and reaching out to others is Ernie.
In fact I may have given up all together and especially on CA's if lesterb didn't engage with me like he has.

I could actually name many more that have been an encouragement - I've heard a few of your talks from the church planters forum I've listened to over the years.

But my point is that it was no matter how good ones theology is it really means nothing without the love of Christ in relating in a kind way to others. People are looking for more than wit and doctrine, of which DKCM doesn't have more than that to offer, or so it seems. I sorrow over people being turned away from Christ because of some of the people that get attention over the quiet ones in the background loving and serving kindly. I doubt lesterb and Ernie enjoy me mentioning them but I that's because they point to Christ.
I hope people can find encouragement in following Christ that leads to much loving and serving others selflessly and unfortunately DKCM is not that place.

I get what you're saying and agree to some extent. There is absolutely a great need for loving warm discipleship. However there are people (like me) who are reached on a more intellectual level. Their interest and hearts are grabbed by intellectual stimulation and challenge. DKCM supplies this (though it has slipped over the past couple months).

[mike]

Their interest and hearts are grabbed by intellectual stimulation and challenge. DKCM supplies this (though it has slipped over the past couple months).

Probably because of the influx of MennoNet members.

[Wade]

Understood. I was strictly going by some things he said on the DKCM session with Chester Weaver. Other than that I don't know what his involvement is with DKCM.

I did enjoy that they had Chester on.

Partly where I'm coming from is years without fellowship and searching for encouragement. The person who has had the most profound impact on my life in encouraging me to follow Christ compassionately loving others is lesterb. I doubt I'd love my wife and children and God as much without his influence. And probably the person who has encouraged me the most in loving serving and reaching out to others is Ernie.
In fact I may have given up all together and especially on CA's if lesterb didn't engage with me like he has.

I could actually name many more that have been an encouragement - I've heard a few of your talks from the church planters forum I've listened to over the years.

But my point is that it was no matter how good ones theology is it really means nothing without the love of Christ in relating in a kind way to others. People are looking for more than wit and doctrine, of which DKCM doesn't have more than that to offer, or so it seems. I sorrow over people being turned away from Christ because of some of the people that get attention over the quiet ones in the background loving and serving kindly. I doubt lesterb and Ernie enjoy me mentioning them but I that's because they point to Christ.
I hope people can find encouragement in following Christ that leads to much loving and serving others selflessly and unfortunately DKCM is not that place.

I get what you're saying and agree to some extent. There is absolutely a great need for loving warm discipleship. However there are people (like me) who are reached on a more intellectual level. Their interest and hearts are grabbed by intellectual stimulation and challenge. DKCM supplies this (though it has slipped over the past couple months).

What's your background?

It's intriguing because until this year there was no CA church near the area I live. And I tell you these mocking memes of others peoples beliefs is not doing any good in leading them closer to Christ. I am working among these people being mocked... If they find you supporters of DKCM I might as well give up.

[ToseekGod]

I wonder if there’s done generational differences going on. The most active participants on DKCM seem to skew pretty young and are much more comfortable with social media and memes than I think a lot of folks on MN are. I am sometimes surprised by the awareness of race and sexual abuse some of them are, which is not something I remember CM churches being that aware of when I was younger.

MennoDiscuss also began as a project of young CA’s and it’s become something different over the past decade or so. I also remember discussion about how inappropriate it was for Christians to participate in web forums and that you could never really build community online. On the one hand that’s true, we really do need face-to-face contact, but on the other hand, I’ve known some of you virtually for over a decade, and that also seems to me that MN is some sort of community as well.

I think an ongoing theme I’ve witnessed over the years is that the older generation of CA’s is often afraid that the next generation is too liberal and progressive, so there’s lots of gate keeping and tension but things eventually seem to work out.

I love how you put this. I think that's an important realization that is often totally missed. I also wonder though: is the resistance to "the younger generation going liberal" part of what makes it turn out alright?

[annkat]

I did enjoy that they had Chester on.

Partly where I'm coming from is years without fellowship and searching for encouragement. The person who has had the most profound impact on my life in encouraging me to follow Christ compassionately loving others is lesterb. I doubt I'd love my wife and children and God as much without his influence. And probably the person who has encouraged me the most in loving serving and reaching out to others is Ernie.
In fact I may have given up all together and especially on CA's if lesterb didn't engage with me like he has.

I could actually name many more that have been an encouragement - I've heard a few of your talks from the church planters forum I've listened to over the years.

But my point is that it was no matter how good ones theology is it really means nothing without the love of Christ in relating in a kind way to others. People are looking for more than wit and doctrine, of which DKCM doesn't have more than that to offer, or so it seems. I sorrow over people being turned away from Christ because of some of the people that get attention over the quiet ones in the background loving and serving kindly. I doubt lesterb and Ernie enjoy me mentioning them but I that's because they point to Christ.
I hope people can find encouragement in following Christ that leads to much loving and serving others selflessly and unfortunately DKCM is not that place.

I get what you're saying and agree to some extent. There is absolutely a great need for loving warm discipleship. However there are people (like me) who are reached on a more intellectual level. Their interest and hearts are grabbed by intellectual stimulation and challenge. DKCM supplies this (though it has slipped over the past couple months).

What's your background?

It's intriguing because until this year there was no CA church near the area I live. And I tell you these mocking memes of others peoples beliefs is not doing any good in leading them closer to Christ. I am working among these people being mocked... If they find you supporters of DKCM I might as well give up.

Wade, can you help me understand what group(s) of people you’re working with that these memes are mocking? Most memes I’ve seen are criticizing valid issues in the church, or are bringing to light the hypocrisy of those who claim to be CA or Kingdom Christian but who support republican candidates like Trump, are overtly or subtly racist, things like that. I haven’t seen a single meme mocking people genuinely struggling at all.

[ToseekGod]

Today I saw an atheist friend of mine that was sober for a year and a half walking into the liquor store. He told me that I am the only person he has told that he has relapsed. He also told me he is ready to sit down and have a bible study with me.
Yesterday a conservative evangelical Christian friend that has interest in Anabaptism shared again about his wife wanting to leave him so he is ready to go shoot himself.
The day before a divorced ex-Pentecostal that wants to come to a CA church phoned asking questions about day 6 of creation along with asking me a number of times if it would be okay for him to remarry.
I have people phoning asking if they can give my number to a drunk friend that needs help - meanwhile my friend who has been in AA for longer than I have been alive says, "Wow, they must be serious about getting help if they are calling you."
This kind of stuff has become fairly normal in my life and honestly it is brutally hard to stare people in the face and share the words of Christ they don't want to hear. So when I need help because I am not strong enough to help these people I need to not only go to Christ but to some brothers and sisters in Christ too.
I really feel strongly if I presented to these people sarcastic or mocking memes I would NOT have any GOOD opportunity to point them to the only place that there is Hope. Christianity is no joke. We need each others help and prayers in this battle - it seems that is too much to ask.

It's truly awesome that God can use you so powerfully! Praise His Name!

DKCM isn't there as an outreach. I'm not one of the founding members or anything so I can't really speak to its purpose but I can say what it does for me. I struggle in Bible study and use of time. DKCM gives me a place where I am inspired to Bible study and gives me a place that is a far more profitable location to spend time than many alternatives. DKCM has also given me a place to connect with people whose minds work more like mine. I think in different patterns than 99% of the people I know so to have a group of people who think more similarly makes me feel a greater sense of community than I otherwise do.

[Szdfan]

Part of it may be generational, but some of what is driving what JoshScott called "crowds of people and groups in orbit around conservative Mennonitism" is that conservative Mennonites have some serious problems that are largely being ignored. So while the "conservatives" condemn those who don't wear the correct clothing or engage on the internet correctly, or etc., they are ignoring huge issues like sexual abuse or the sin of favoritism or materialism or contentious/hateful church splits.

Conservative Mennonites can get upset about there being places like DKCM, but I don't think they can wash their hands of it and say they haven't helped create its content.

I think is a profoundly insightful post. I know there is trauma in the CM world from my own extended family that frequently does not get addressed or dealt with. I’m glad when there are ways to express it. If memes are a minor form of therapy and it provokes discussion, then that’s a good thing. Some of the posters on DCKM are thoughtful.

Szd, you and I are both technically MC USA members (or at least I was until they changed,
I think, to FEC). You should know as well as I do that abuse and trauma does not know any conservative or liberal distinction, and that a great deal of abuse in the liberal-progressive Mennonite world got covered up and not dealt with.

I’ve written how I was part of an effort to hold my own alma mater accountable for sexual abuse, so I’m perfectly aware of the dynamics. I’m not pointing fingers — I’m not saying that conservatives are worse than liberals on this — but you seem really defensive.

Trauma doesn’t just involve sexual abuse. In my extended family, there is also trauma from a dynamic from when theology and doctrine were more important than relationships. When my paternal grandparents left the Amish in the 1950’s, my grandmother’s family excommunicated them. When my grandmother died a few years ago, none of her family attended the funeral. Those kinds of family dynamics are also traumatic.

Here’s one meme I made:

It’s not a meme about sexual abuse, but rather the stoic emotional constipation in my family and amongst a wide swath of Swiss-German Mennodom. It felt good to poke fun at that.

Memes don’t help it get dealt with, though. I focus on sweeping my own house, so I focus on doing what I can in the CM world, or in my own denomination. There has been real progress in the liberal-progressive Mennonite world in recent years too. But let’s not point fingers at each other as somehow being “worse”, even if making that accusation feels good.

You do you and do what you need to do. If you work at cleaning house, that’s great, but you don’t get to decide how other people deal with or work through their stuff. It’s not up to you. You don’t control that.

[ToseekGod]

I did enjoy that they had Chester on.

Partly where I'm coming from is years without fellowship and searching for encouragement. The person who has had the most profound impact on my life in encouraging me to follow Christ compassionately loving others is lesterb. I doubt I'd love my wife and children and God as much without his influence. And probably the person who has encouraged me the most in loving serving and reaching out to others is Ernie.
In fact I may have given up all together and especially on CA's if lesterb didn't engage with me like he has.

I could actually name many more that have been an encouragement - I've heard a few of your talks from the church planters forum I've listened to over the years.

But my point is that it was no matter how good ones theology is it really means nothing without the love of Christ in relating in a kind way to others. People are looking for more than wit and doctrine, of which DKCM doesn't have more than that to offer, or so it seems. I sorrow over people being turned away from Christ because of some of the people that get attention over the quiet ones in the background loving and serving kindly. I doubt lesterb and Ernie enjoy me mentioning them but I that's because they point to Christ.
I hope people can find encouragement in following Christ that leads to much loving and serving others selflessly and unfortunately DKCM is not that place.

I get what you're saying and agree to some extent. There is absolutely a great need for loving warm discipleship. However there are people (like me) who are reached on a more intellectual level. Their interest and hearts are grabbed by intellectual stimulation and challenge. DKCM supplies this (though it has slipped over the past couple months).

What's your background?

It's intriguing because until this year there was no CA church near the area I live. And I tell you these mocking memes of others peoples beliefs is not doing any good in leading them closer to Christ. I am working among these people being mocked... If they find you supporters of DKCM I might as well give up.

I grew up in a family that looks Mennonite to the untrained eye but is nondenominational. My folks used to attend a Church of Christ bit I grew up in a church that was made up of former Mennos for the most part. I have become more Mennonite as I've gotten older (a year at SMBI and a year teaching at a Mennonite school will do that to a fella) but I would still hesitate to call myself by that Mennonite.

I would be interested to hear who would be offended at DKCM. There are obviously individuals but most all attacks are on beliefs not the people who hold to those beliefs. In fact, unless the person is a public figure (e.g. Joel Osteen) a post attacking someone will be removed by the moderators.