Can we make MN less hostile?

[Bootstrap]

One of the 'marks' of the Last Days is being offended- we see it's rapid growth on social media- it does seem that Christian forums seem to follow the world in that regard. There should be a marked difference that the watching world can observe.

Amen.

Before hitting submit, it's helpful to ask whether the post is either (1) giving offense or (2) taking offense at other people in the forum.

And sometimes it's not the other guy who is trolling. The same people who write some very insightful posts can also troll sometimes, using offense and vivid emotional distractions to avoid the subject of a conversation.

[MaxPC]

Brothers and Sisters and Friends:

Don’t take the bait.

Don’t feed the Trolls.

All the name calling reminds me of public school... This doesn't seem to be a place suited much for Christians...

I was wondering as I consider all this. When I first arrived on Mennodiscuss long ago, there was not long after some hostility going on- there was a new person, Jay Hurst? Horst? Can't remember (you oldies on here probably remember him). Anyways, it was my first introduction to non-resistance and loving ones enemies being perplexing as I observed some strife and word wars- and insults flying. Over time I realize the only way to see non-resistance and loving one's enemies here is to basically 'not be considered an enemy' whether in theology or church affiliation outside of Anabaptism. There's been numerous very rude remarks made about other faith groups who I am pretty sure, that God loves. Actually, this had a lot to do with why we didn't pursue Anabaptism any further- after visiting some Churches, my husband already was convinced there were too many harsh remarks made against other Christians and he did not want to be a part of that. Recently,, a friend/brother in the Lord left pursuing Anabaptism any further for this same reason as he shared with me the attacks from the pulpit. I find it so odd as originally as an outsider, I thought it was a denomination of peace & love, which it is- if you're 'in' or don't disagree with believing that Anabaptism has all the 'right' answers and drawn all the 'right' conclusions. Then, you fit in and will be accepted it seems. I was warned when first pursuing not to put Anabaptists on a pedestal - I think our Beachy friend knew what I'd witness.

That being said- why so much strife here?
Jesus said "Wherever two or more are gathered in My name, there I am also" (Matthew 18:20)

Is it because we are gathered here in Menno's name? (perhaps you consider that is the same thing, but it is not)

Our church felt it was good (this was several years ago) to go through this book:

https://www.thriftbooks.com/w/the-bait- ... iq=1577998

One of the 'marks' of the Last Days is being offended- we see it's rapid growth on social media- it does seem that Christian forums seem to follow the world in that regard. There should be a marked difference that the watching world can observe

Peace

I can agree with the bolded statement. Another book that I like is Getting Along with People God's Way by John Coblentz.

[Robert]

When I first joined MennoDiscuss, I was attacked by von for having Anabaptist beliefs ... on a Mennonite forum. MD was not always a bastion of peace either. The challenge is we get all kinds. One of the reasons why I added the affiliation tag is to help judge where the poster is coming from theologically. I found very quickly that online forums often attract some fringe. Okay, a LOT of fringe. Seldom did I hear the things discussed on MD that I did in church on any Sunday.

MN is NOT a window into an Anabaptist congregation. Half the things, or more, we discuss here would never get more then a shoulder shrug on a Sunday Morning by the majority worshipping. We can dissect things much deeper here, sometimes too deep. I often wonder if Paul knew his letters would be used for theology 2000 years later, I bet he would have reworded a few things too.

[Mennogal]

Rant warning.... I find some persons here on MN to be self-righteous and rather patronizing toward others, and it is sad, and offensive, because although they might have a valid post to make, all of it is lost, on me at least, in the self-aggrandizement and I find myself ignoring them on principle. It is also not very Christ-follower like. I wish we could take the personal out of some posts, discuss the facts, and be respectful toward others’ views - you don’t know me, I don’t know you, and placing assumptions on others is not good for discussion. Though some might be more knowledgeable than others here, there are ways to convey it without coming off as “all-knowing.” I certainly don’t know everything and I continue to be amazed by the knowledge of others here, wishing I had the time to put into such in-depth discussion, or being able to debate from a knowledge standpoint. Let’s all just try to be respectful of each other, and recognize others’ points of view with respect, and not get personal or uppity... easy said I know. But if we can simply discuss without the emotion, the discussion would be so much the better. /end of rant

[steve-in-kville]

While I have not noticed a huge amount of hostility, I do know there have been some "personality contests" from time to time. I've learned there are two choices to take:

1) stay clear and let it burn out.
2) Add fuel to the fire for my own personal amusement.

There is no in-between.

The above being said (half in jest) that I have noticed that after the fire gets too hot, certain people disappear from the forum for a while, so you can tell who can't handle the heat. What's funny about that, the person that goes missing is usually the one who started the fire to begin with, can't handle the heat, and can't finish what he/she started.

You'll find that real life is that way.

[JimFoxvog]

Rant warning.... I find some persons here on MN to be self-righteous and rather patronizing toward others, and it is sad, and offensive, because although they might have a valid post to make, all of it is lost, on me at least, in the self-aggrandizement and I find myself ignoring them on principle. It is also not very Christ-follower like. I wish we could take the personal out of some posts, discuss the facts, and be respectful toward others’ views - you don’t know me, I don’t know you, and placing assumptions on others is not good for discussion. Though some might be more knowledgeable than others here, there are ways to convey it without coming off as “all-knowing.” I certainly don’t know everything and I continue to be amazed by the knowledge of others here, wishing I had the time to put into such in-depth discussion, or being able to debate from a knowledge standpoint.

When we get this impression, what's the best way to handle it? PM, public questioning, or ignoring it?

Let’s all just try to be respectful of each other, and recognize others’ points of view with respect, and not get personal or uppity... easy said I know. But if we can simply discuss without the emotion, the discussion would be so much the better. /end of rant

I agree.

[ohio jones]

When we get this impression, what's the best way to handle it? PM, public questioning, or ignoring it?

Ignoring the situation is easiest (which is why I often do it), but least effective. It won't change anything, and your reaction to the other person will just continue to become more negative.

Public questioning, at least as a first step, sets up an adversarial relationship and derails the thread. Keeping threads on track is hard enough without that. If it's necessary, at least take it to the Briar Patch.

That leaves PM. If you're calling someone out for being self-righteous and patronizing, it's important to keep from appearing that way yourself, but it's almost always worth the effort to engage them. If he listens to you, you have gained your brother.

[Robert]

If he listens to you, you have gained your brother.

So you expect me to listen to you now?

[temporal1]

Page 7

There are a lot of personal testimonies, victories, and things like that I would love to share, but I don’t want to here since they would simply get ripped apart and devoured.

I, for one, would like you to share these, Josh. I think it would help build a greater sense of commonality here. It might encourage more of us to do the same.

I do not want to risk MN drama with me to spread and affect other people in real life, and I don’t want my real life testimonies ripped to shreds.

They’re precious and special to me. This forum is a place where it is fair game to challenge my salvation and publicly denounce me as a gravely immoral person, and nobody does anything about it.

If MN is to be a less hostile place, a good place is to not allow challenging someone else’s salvation in public.

Just stumbled upon this.
In my view, one of the most successful “categories” (?) MD offered was, “Prayers and Personal Testimonies.” It was used for many purposes, but, mods were “on it” about not allowing politics, criticism, negatives, derogatory remarks, et al.

i presume it began with the early MD CM young folks, it was well established before i joined.
others may remember more+better.
i created a poll on it:
http://forum.mennonet.com/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=287

There have been a couple of topics i would have liked to discuss on MN. But, chose not to, knowing they would attract criticisms+accusations that would detract, while not adding anything of value.
i presume others have concluded similarly, at least, on occasion.

LJones wrote:

Josh wrote:
If MN is to be a less hostile place, a good place is to not allow challenging someone else’s salvation in public.

Unless they're EO... then to hell with them. Or at least the last thread I found on the subject seems to think so. You guys want to be less hostile. Stop being so self righteous. I came through Anabaptism and picked up some pretty valuable things. However, it was in their nature to tear each other apart. My last straw came the day of my son's baptism and I had to stand in a man's yard for an hour and listen to how evil the "Old Conference" was. As a Mennonite it was seeing the church tear apart a young teacher because he disciplined the wrong kid (who picked at my kid relentlessly and even physically bullied him while we were setting up for their classmate's funeral). I keep trying to come back here, hoping to find the mythical Anabaptists of Nickel Mines, but it's never going to happen. Why? Because you are always justified in your own minds. You are always looking at your tassels, knots, and tithes of cumin.

Josh, you are the worst. You are joining a cult by everybody's measure of a cult. I hope they have changed as you claimed, but up until 5 years ago they were exactly that. You cannot keep demanding consideration when you give no one the same courtesy. Even when I was Anabaptist you stayed on me and tried to make me feel like I was 2 inches tall.

So, whatever. Keep creating threads where you ask these probing questions that turn up the same answer, "it's everybody but us that's the problem."

LJones, i agree with some of what you’re saying here, i don’t understand it in full. my experience is not the same as yours, i don’t doubt your experience. i do not know about your reference to “cult.”

Josh can be harsh, but that’s not the total of who/what he is.
for a long while, i was afraid of incurring his wrath, no matter what i posted!

i’m encouraged that Josh recognizes the importance of respecting his personal experiences.
i’m not afraid of him anymore.

[MaxPC]

If you're calling someone out for being self-righteous and patronizing, it's important to keep from appearing that way yourself

Indeed. The whole idea of complaining about someone else reminds me of the old saying: "When you point a finger at others there's always 3 pointing back at you."

There are times when it gets heated because someone feels threatened or their feelings are hurt. The truly Christian and Biblical response is to pray for the other instead of public whining, sarcasm, lashing out and self-pity parties. Admonishing someone publicly for being self-righteous and patronizing is itself condescending and uncharitable as well as full of irony. The suggestion of PMing is a good one as it's a communication in private similar to the Biblical directive of going to the person in private.