This is a thread to discuss:
Religious Headcovering - Beliefs and Practices of Various Religions
Information and discussion about both men and women's headcoverings are welcome.
I would like to keep this thread as an educational resource, without a lot of fluff and banter.
Religious Headcovering - Beliefs and Practices of Various Religions
Religious Headcovering - Beliefs and Practices of Various Religions
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A wee little man can’t say, I’m sorry. A big man owns his mistakes and apologizes.
A wee little man trusts himself and his own discernment. A big man is humble enough to know that he needs the counsel and input of others.
A wee little man trusts himself and his own discernment. A big man is humble enough to know that he needs the counsel and input of others.
Re: Religious Headcovering - Beliefs and Practices of Various Religions
Since at least the second century, some women in the Christian church seem to struggle with veiling their heads in an adequate manner.
Tertullian, around the year 200 AD, writes. "For even when they are about to spend time in prayer itself, with the utmost readiness they place a fringe, or a tuft, or any thread whatever, on the crown of their heads, and suppose themselves to be covered. Of so small extent do they falsely imagine their head to be!" ... "Others are to a certain extent covered over the region of the brain with linen coifs of small dimensions—I suppose for fear of pressing the head—and not reaching quite to the ears."
This same trend seems to have continued to the present day in some Christian settings.
Recently I wondered why Muslims don't seem to have this same trend. It seems that Muslims who quit veiling do so abruptly, without making the gradual transition from full coverings, to smaller coverings, to no covering at all, like happens in many Christian settings.
I'm curious as to why this might be.
Tertullian, around the year 200 AD, writes. "For even when they are about to spend time in prayer itself, with the utmost readiness they place a fringe, or a tuft, or any thread whatever, on the crown of their heads, and suppose themselves to be covered. Of so small extent do they falsely imagine their head to be!" ... "Others are to a certain extent covered over the region of the brain with linen coifs of small dimensions—I suppose for fear of pressing the head—and not reaching quite to the ears."
This same trend seems to have continued to the present day in some Christian settings.
Recently I wondered why Muslims don't seem to have this same trend. It seems that Muslims who quit veiling do so abruptly, without making the gradual transition from full coverings, to smaller coverings, to no covering at all, like happens in many Christian settings.
I'm curious as to why this might be.
0 x
A wee little man can’t say, I’m sorry. A big man owns his mistakes and apologizes.
A wee little man trusts himself and his own discernment. A big man is humble enough to know that he needs the counsel and input of others.
A wee little man trusts himself and his own discernment. A big man is humble enough to know that he needs the counsel and input of others.
Re: Religious Headcovering - Beliefs and Practices of Various Religions
I'm not an expert in Muslim practice but it's my impression they veil to cover beauty. That is not found in the Christian practice, or I should say not commonly found because someone will certainly find an exception.
I see a parallel between the Islamic practice and the Orthodox Jewish practice where women are veiled (or cut off their hair or hide with a wig) or are hidden behind screens.
I see a parallel between the Islamic practice and the Orthodox Jewish practice where women are veiled (or cut off their hair or hide with a wig) or are hidden behind screens.
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Re: Religious Headcovering - Beliefs and Practices of Various Religions
Do you make a distinction between glory and beauty?
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A wee little man can’t say, I’m sorry. A big man owns his mistakes and apologizes.
A wee little man trusts himself and his own discernment. A big man is humble enough to know that he needs the counsel and input of others.
A wee little man trusts himself and his own discernment. A big man is humble enough to know that he needs the counsel and input of others.
Re: Religious Headcovering - Beliefs and Practices of Various Religions
Interesting question. Just off hand I would say yes, exactly, but that is not a considered opinion.
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HondurasKeiser
- Posts: 573
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- Affiliation: LMC/IEMH
Re: Religious Headcovering - Beliefs and Practices of Various Religions
I would posit that Muslim civilization is less infused with an individualistic/Liberal (in the philosophical sense) worldview. Indeed, Muslim women that do take off the covering tend be those that have Westernized and imbibed the Liberal mindset. One other observation, covering in Muslim cultures is on a kind of spectrum. I am generalizing to be sure but in my observation, women in the Levant, Northern Africa and the major urban centers use headscarves and hijabs, whereas women in the Gulf States and into Afghanistan use the Chadas, Niqabs and Burkas. Much like our experience in the Mennonite/Anabaptist world; the less individualistic/Liberal their milieu is, the more covered they are.Ernie wrote: ↑Thu Apr 30, 2026 7:24 am Since at least the second century, some women in the Christian church seem to struggle with veiling their heads in an adequate manner.
Tertullian, around the year 200 AD, writes. "For even when they are about to spend time in prayer itself, with the utmost readiness they place a fringe, or a tuft, or any thread whatever, on the crown of their heads, and suppose themselves to be covered. Of so small extent do they falsely imagine their head to be!" ... "Others are to a certain extent covered over the region of the brain with linen coifs of small dimensions—I suppose for fear of pressing the head—and not reaching quite to the ears."
This same trend seems to have continued to the present day in some Christian settings.
Recently I wondered why Muslims don't seem to have this same trend. It seems that Muslims who quit veiling do so abruptly, without making the gradual transition from full coverings, to smaller coverings, to no covering at all, like happens in many Christian settings.
I'm curious as to why this might be.
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joshuabgood
- Posts: 940
- Joined: Fri Sep 20, 2024 9:54 am
- Affiliation: Mennonite
Re: Religious Headcovering - Beliefs and Practices of Various Religions
I am pretty sure that in some Muslim cases, while the size may not vary as much, there are some who veil sometimes and not others. And there is at least some variation in size...or there was in 2008 when I worked in a setting with a sizable number of various Muslim sects.
With Jewish folks there is also a distinction, at least in some sects, between married and unmarried. And the size can vary also.
With Jewish folks there is also a distinction, at least in some sects, between married and unmarried. And the size can vary also.
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Re: Religious Headcovering - Beliefs and Practices of Various Religions
HondurasKeiser wrote: ↑Thu Apr 30, 2026 10:38 amI would posit that Muslim civilization is less infused with an individualistic/Liberal (in the philosophical sense) worldview. Indeed, Muslim women that do take off the covering tend be those that have Westernized and imbibed the Liberal mindset. One other observation, covering in Muslim cultures is on a kind of spectrum. I am generalizing to be sure but in my observation, women in the Levant, Northern Africa and the major urban centers use headscarves and hijabs, whereas women in the Gulf States and into Afghanistan use the Chadas, Niqabs and Burkas. Much like our experience in the Mennonite/Anabaptist world; the less individualistic/Liberal their milieu is, the more covered they are.Ernie wrote: ↑Thu Apr 30, 2026 7:24 am Since at least the second century, some women in the Christian church seem to struggle with veiling their heads in an adequate manner.
Tertullian, around the year 200 AD, writes. "For even when they are about to spend time in prayer itself, with the utmost readiness they place a fringe, or a tuft, or any thread whatever, on the crown of their heads, and suppose themselves to be covered. Of so small extent do they falsely imagine their head to be!" ... "Others are to a certain extent covered over the region of the brain with linen coifs of small dimensions—I suppose for fear of pressing the head—and not reaching quite to the ears."
This same trend seems to have continued to the present day in some Christian settings.
Recently I wondered why Muslims don't seem to have this same trend. It seems that Muslims who quit veiling do so abruptly, without making the gradual transition from full coverings, to smaller coverings, to no covering at all, like happens in many Christian settings.
I'm curious as to why this might be.
I interact with a lot of Muslims here at Penn State. I see the variety and understand the conservative-liberal spectrum.joshuabgood wrote: ↑Thu Apr 30, 2026 10:39 am I am pretty sure that in some Muslim cases, while the size may not vary as much, there are some who veil sometimes and not others. And there is at least some variation in size...or there was in 2008 when I worked in a setting with a sizable number of various Muslim sects.
With Jewish folks there is also a distinction, at least in some sects, between married and unmarried. And the size can vary also.
But I never see a piece of cloth fastened to the back of the head, or a bit of lace fastened on a hairbun, or something of that nature. This seems to be unique to Christians who are in transition. I think some of the explanations given so far may speak to this.
The majority of Christian women who cover, view their veil (or cap or hat) as a head-covering with many even viewing it as a long-hair covering. (the majority of Plain Anabaptists)
But I think there is an element that view their veil as strictly a symbol and not a head-covering. As women transition from viewing their veil as a head-covering, to viewing it as a symbol only, it makes sense to simply pin a symbol on the back or top of the head, depending on the era in which one lives.
I think the point that Jews and Muslims don't view veiling as merely a symbol, probably explains why we don't see this transitional step to something symbolic in their traditions.
1 x
A wee little man can’t say, I’m sorry. A big man owns his mistakes and apologizes.
A wee little man trusts himself and his own discernment. A big man is humble enough to know that he needs the counsel and input of others.
A wee little man trusts himself and his own discernment. A big man is humble enough to know that he needs the counsel and input of others.
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Silentreader
- Posts: 141
- Joined: Sat Sep 14, 2024 5:45 pm
- Affiliation: Midwest Fellowship
Re: Religious Headcovering - Beliefs and Practices of Various Religions
Of what is the covering to be a symbol?Ernie wrote: ↑Thu Apr 30, 2026 11:58 amHondurasKeiser wrote: ↑Thu Apr 30, 2026 10:38 amI would posit that Muslim civilization is less infused with an individualistic/Liberal (in the philosophical sense) worldview. Indeed, Muslim women that do take off the covering tend be those that have Westernized and imbibed the Liberal mindset. One other observation, covering in Muslim cultures is on a kind of spectrum. I am generalizing to be sure but in my observation, women in the Levant, Northern Africa and the major urban centers use headscarves and hijabs, whereas women in the Gulf States and into Afghanistan use the Chadas, Niqabs and Burkas. Much like our experience in the Mennonite/Anabaptist world; the less individualistic/Liberal their milieu is, the more covered they are.Ernie wrote: ↑Thu Apr 30, 2026 7:24 am Since at least the second century, some women in the Christian church seem to struggle with veiling their heads in an adequate manner.
Tertullian, around the year 200 AD, writes. "For even when they are about to spend time in prayer itself, with the utmost readiness they place a fringe, or a tuft, or any thread whatever, on the crown of their heads, and suppose themselves to be covered. Of so small extent do they falsely imagine their head to be!" ... "Others are to a certain extent covered over the region of the brain with linen coifs of small dimensions—I suppose for fear of pressing the head—and not reaching quite to the ears."
This same trend seems to have continued to the present day in some Christian settings.
Recently I wondered why Muslims don't seem to have this same trend. It seems that Muslims who quit veiling do so abruptly, without making the gradual transition from full coverings, to smaller coverings, to no covering at all, like happens in many Christian settings.
I'm curious as to why this might be.I interact with a lot of Muslims here at Penn State. I see the variety and understand the conservative-liberal spectrum.joshuabgood wrote: ↑Thu Apr 30, 2026 10:39 am I am pretty sure that in some Muslim cases, while the size may not vary as much, there are some who veil sometimes and not others. And there is at least some variation in size...or there was in 2008 when I worked in a setting with a sizable number of various Muslim sects.
With Jewish folks there is also a distinction, at least in some sects, between married and unmarried. And the size can vary also.
But I never see a piece of cloth fastened to the back of the head, or a bit of lace fastened on a hairbun, or something of that nature. This seems to be unique to Christians who are in transition. I think some of the explanations given so far may speak to this.
The majority of Christian women who cover, view their veil (or cap or hat) as a head-covering with many even viewing it as a long-hair covering. (the majority of Plain Anabaptists)
But I think there is an element that view their veil as strictly a symbol and not a head-covering. As women transition from viewing their veil as a head-covering, to viewing it as a symbol only, it makes sense to simply pin a symbol on the back or top of the head, depending on the era in which one lives.
I think the point that Jews and Muslims don't view veiling as merely a symbol, probably explains why we don't see this transitional step to something symbolic in their traditions.
In my opinion the covering is supposed to serve a purpose and also be a symbol. If it does not serve a purpose, then it is also no longer a symbol.
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Re: Religious Headcovering - Beliefs and Practices of Various Religions
True, but I think Ernie is asking about the philosophy or doctrine that motivates the practice.HondurasKeiser wrote: I would posit that Muslim civilization is less infused with an individualistic/Liberal (in the philosophical sense) worldview. Indeed, Muslim women that do take off the covering tend be those that have Westernized and imbibed the Liberal mindset. One other observation, covering in Muslim cultures is on a kind of spectrum. I am generalizing to be sure but in my observation, women in the Levant, Northern Africa and the major urban centers use headscarves and hijabs, whereas women in the Gulf States and into Afghanistan use the Chadas, Niqabs and Burkas. Much like our experience in the Mennonite/Anabaptist world; the less individualistic/Liberal their milieu is, the more covered they are.
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