400 Years of African Slavery in America

[barnhart]

Yes and no. The idea that the U.S. were "founded" on slavery is, in my eyes, definitely wrong. They were "founded" on the concept of "indentured servitude" which the settlers brought with them from England and which concerned at first white people. Slavery as in Africa or Arabia did no more exist in Christian countries, and the Americans came, in 1619, only accidentally in contact with it. They at first tried to use the well known concept of indentured servitude and then the legal professions gradually worsened the legal conditions in direction to "cattle slavery".

I think people who make that claim are using a broader definition of "founding" than you are using. Founded in the sense that the wealth and power that came to the US through international trade was founded on the produce of slavery. The US existed for quite some time before it became a world power, but the "founding" of the global trade economy was slave products.

[joshuabgood]

Yes and no. The idea that the U.S. were "founded" on slavery is, in my eyes, definitely wrong. They were "founded" on the concept of "indentured servitude" which the settlers brought with them from England and which concerned at first white people. Slavery as in Africa or Arabia did no more exist in Christian countries, and the Americans came, in 1619, only accidentally in contact with it. They at first tried to use the well known concept of indentured servitude and then the legal professions gradually worsened the legal conditions in direction to "cattle slavery".

I think people who make that claim are using a broader definition of "founding" than you are using. Founded in the sense that the wealth and power that came to the US through international trade was founded on the produce of slavery. The US existed for quite some time before it became a world power, but the "founding" of the global trade economy was slave products.

I would add to this, philosophically, American was founded on principles of violent aggression and violent oppression. Aggression against the native peoples, true of every colony, possibly save PA and RI, for the first 90 years. Violent oppression of the Africans (and of the religious dissidents by the Puritans). In this case founded means, including the systemic principles of, which contributed to founding construction of society.

[HondurasKeiser]

his seems a fair critique, who would argue the american experiment is not a " ...messy, evolving, multicultural, religiously infused, Enlightenment-based, racist, liberating, wealth-generating kaleidoscope..." But it seems like a difference without distinction. How does this narrow minded historical interpretation of american history change anything going forward?

I think people who make that claim are using a broader definition of "founding" than you are using. Founded in the sense that the wealth and power that came to the US through international trade was founded on the produce of slavery. The US existed for quite some time before it became a world power, but the "founding" of the global trade economy was slave products.

I would add to this, philosophically, American was founded on principles of violent aggression and violent oppression. Aggression against the native peoples, true of every colony, possibly save PA and RI, for the first 90 years. Violent oppression of the Africans (and of the religious dissidents by the Puritans). In this case founded means, including the systemic principles of, which contributed to founding construction of society.

I would contend that a narrow-minded reading of any history, in this case America's in the 1619 Project, is doomed to failure because it's tendentious, and intentionally excludes other source material so as to arrive at a pre-conceived conclusion. To say for instance that all of "the wealth and power that came to the U.S. through international trade was founded on the produce of slavery" is simply untrue. It's an assertion in need of source data that doesn't exist. Or to say that America was founded on principles of violent agression and oppression is nothing more than rhetorical flight and emotionally-laden assertions that don't have their groundings in what diverse peoples actually thought, wrote and lived 300 years ago. What's more and to your question - it leaves us nowhere. If America is nothing more than a country founded on slavery, aggression and oppression then what can we do with that other than forever lament our terrible beginnings. No one I see, is advocating turning everything back over to the natives for instance. To that last thought I'll add a quote from a former professor of mine at Eastern College, Allen Guelzo:

...the 1619 Project is not history; it is evangelism, but evangelism for a gospel of disenchantment whose ultimate purpose is the hollowing out of the meaning of freedom, so that every defense of freedom drops nervously from the hands of people who have been made too ashamed to defend it. No nation can live without a history, and no free nation can flourish without a history that affirms—in Ralph Waldo Emerson’s words in 1856—“that the evil eye can wither, that the heart’s blessing can heal; that love can exalt talent” and “overcome all odds.” What the 1619 Project offers instead is bitterness, fragility, and intellectual corruption—not history.

It is the bitterest of ironies that the 1619 Project dispenses this malediction from the chair of ultimate cultural privilege in America, because in no human society has an enslaved people suddenly found itself vaulted into positions of such privilege, and with the consent—even the approbation—of those who were once the enslavers. The 156 years since emancipation are less than a second on human history’s long clock, so that such a transformation is more in the nature of a miracle to be celebrated than a failure to be deplored for any seeming slowness. It is a miracle Frederick Douglass celebrated; it is a miracle Sergeant William Carney celebrated on the ramparts of Fort Wagner; it is a miracle Dorie Miller and the Tuskegee Airmen celebrated; and it is a miracle Colin Powell and Ben Carson have celebrated. Why not the 1619 Project?

[joshuabgood]

If America is nothing more than a country founded on slavery, aggression and oppression then what can we do with that other than forever lament our terrible beginnings.

From my perspective, it has nothing to do with lamenting. And I am not more "negative" on the American experience than I am on any other nation-state. What needs to be blown-up is the myth of American Exceptionalism and the fallacious historical narrative that the USA was founded on righteousness, equality, and justice. It wasn't.

There is ample historical evidence for the assertions that I briefly noted (as you probably know), and they aren't emotionally laden at all. It is simply how this nation-state was founded. Just like all other nation-states (including American Indian tribes), on aggression and violence.

The USA is nothing more than another pagan nation founded the same way the rest of them were, at the point of a bayonet or gun. It was never a fair and just society. It was never the Kingdom of God. It is no better and no worse than other nation states. The USA tells themselves narratives about their existence in self justification just like other nation states do.

They aren't blessed by God. None of the blessings of Jesus, as taught in the Matthew 5, apply to them.

Lastly, I would object to the idea "our terrible beginnings." It isn't "ours." It is a pagan kingdom. We have never belonged to it and we don't claim or own it.

[barnhart]

I would contend that a narrow-minded reading of any history, in this case America's in the 1619 Project, is doomed to failure because it's tendentious, and intentionally excludes other source material so as to arrive at a pre-conceived conclusion. To say for instance that all of "the wealth and power that came to the U.S. through international trade was founded on the produce of slavery" is simply untrue.

That is why I didn't say "all", you added that. There was also the work, sweat, creativity and imagination of the masses.

Or to say that America was founded on principles of violent agression and oppression is nothing more than rhetorical flight and emotionally-laden assertions that don't have their groundings in what diverse peoples actually thought, wrote and lived 300 years ago. What's more and to your question - it leaves us nowhere.

Sins like agression and oppression are sinful even if those who commit them are deceived by the spirit of the age into thinking they are justified. I think it leaves us with a good footing, the simple question "was that right?"

If America is nothing more than a country founded on slavery, aggression and oppression then what can we do with that other than forever lament our terrible beginnings.

We can avoid carrying the contaminated social, political and religious DNA into current practice and belief. We must start somewhere and making clear stands on how we got here is a good start. These beliefs, unexamined and carried into the present form the groundwork for nasty ideologies like white supremacy. Also remember there were clear minded believers pointing out these evils at the time, they were able to see through confusion of the times. There is plenty to be done. I think the American experiment is still full of hope and promise and I imagine the writers behind the 1619 project do as well. That is why they write, because they believe in a better, more just tomorrow.

No one I see, is advocating turning everything back over to the natives for instance.

Is that what the Native Peoples want? Is that what they are asking for? Those I know personally want to be partners, not overlords.

[Bootstrap]

The USA is nothing more than another pagan nation founded the same way the rest of them were, at the point of a bayonet or gun. It was never a fair and just society. It was never the Kingdom of God. It is no better and no worse than other nation states. The USA tells themselves narratives about their existence in self justification just like other nation states do.

There is one sentence I disagree with here. I do think the United States is better than many nations, less oppressive, safer, more prosperous, with more fairness and justice than many. Of course, this is grading on a curve, but I do think some countries are better than others.

But on the whole, I agree with your post. And we should not have the same faith in America that we have in the Kingdom of God.

[Joy]

Then perhaps, if the USA no better than other countries, we could go live in some lovely place like Haiti or Albania or Cuba.

[HondurasKeiser]

If America is nothing more than a country founded on slavery, aggression and oppression then what can we do with that other than forever lament our terrible beginnings.

From my perspective, it has nothing to do with lamenting. And I am not more "negative" on the American experience than I am on any other nation-state. What needs to be blown-up is the myth of American Exceptionalism and the fallacious historical narrative that the USA was founded on righteousness, equality, and justice. It wasn't.

There is ample historical evidence for the assertions that I briefly noted (as you probably know), and they aren't emotionally laden at all. It is simply how this nation-state was founded. Just like all other nation-states (including American Indian tribes), on aggression and violence.

The USA is nothing more than another pagan nation founded the same way the rest of them were, at the point of a bayonet or gun. It was never a fair and just society. It was never the Kingdom of God. It is no better and no worse than other nation states. The USA tells themselves narratives about their existence in self justification just like other nation states do.

They aren't blessed by God. None of the blessings of Jesus, as taught in the Matthew 5, apply to them.

Lastly, I would object to the idea "our terrible beginnings." It isn't "ours." It is a pagan kingdom. We have never belonged to it and we don't claim or own it.

I have a few thoughts Joshua:

Your original assertion was that "philosophically, America was founded on principles of violent aggression and violent oppression. What are those principles particularly? Not examples of aggression and oppression but the actual principles that apparently are the truer, deeper, more defining principles than those found in the Declaration of Independence for example.

At some level I agree with you, Joshua. The U.S. is indeed a pagan kingdom and in that sense not something we should get terribly entangled with. Patriotism and displays of public devotion are not things Christians ought to participate in. Nevertheless, it seems to be willful blindness to assert that America is not and has not been exceptional. What's more, it is for that exceptionality that our forbears chose to emigrate here in the first place. To paraphrase Professor Guelzo: "What other nation in the history of mankind not only freed a formerly subjugated people but fought a civil war to do so?" What's more exceptional than that? What's not exceptional about creating a republic founded on both the need for God and the need for religious freedom? It's not perfect, it's not holy, it doesn't save us but it is certainly exceptional something to be deeply thankful for. In my understanding of God's political economy, nations (and nation-states for that matter) serve a God-ordained function. While no one nation could ever hope to be the Kingdom of God or in any sense be truly Christian it nevertheless seems clear both from the Biblical text, Christian tradition and lived experience that some nations do a better job at performing their God-ordained functions than others. Insofar that a nation performs its role or conforms to the standard laid out in the Bible then we might call it more Godly or less Godly. Thus while all nations are pagan, some are more pagan than others and we Mennonites have generally been thankful for and needful of pagan nations that at least tried to be Godly to some degree.

I disagree with you finally that we don't own this country and have never been part of it. The first Mennonites considered themselves subjects of King George, Jesus' own words about Caesar suggest that the Jews owed something to the Empire. Aristotle rightly noted that 'no man is prior to the State' - despite what the Enlightenment philosophers asserted we are all born with certain responsibilities, obligations and duties to the country in which we find ourselves and while as Christians we are not required to offer approbation of everything our nation does we must nevertheless perform those duties insofar as they do not violate the maxims of our faith. We do own this country, and its history, and its principles for this is the country we are citizens of - your own writings about our history of racism seem to suggest as much.

[joshuabgood]

Your original assertion was that "philosophically, America was founded on principles of violent aggression and violent oppression. What are those principles particularly? Not examples of aggression and oppression but the actual principles that apparently are the truer, deeper, more defining principles than those found in the Declaration of Independence for example.

Here is what I mean by that...nothing really fancy: just that the American nation-state will only ever operate using violence and coercion at the point of a gun. That is how worldly kingdoms function. It is the only way they function. The underlying philosophy is do what we want, pay what we require, or suffer. It's the precise opposite of the Kingdom of God. Jesus does not coerce. He suffers rather than coerce with violence. It's an exact opposite model. Rather than a model of government based on fear, it's a model based on love. Machiavelli saw the two differences clearly. Governing through fear and violence or love and a capacity to suffer?

Nevertheless, it seems to be willful blindness to assert that America is not and has not been exceptional. What's more, it is for that exceptionality that our forbears chose to emigrate here in the first place. To paraphrase Professor Guelzo: "What other nation in the history of mankind not only freed a formerly subjugated people but fought a civil war to do so?" What's more exceptional than that?

It is exceptional in the sense that right now they are the most powerful. However, it won't be exceptional forever. And it's clearly, in my view, not exceptional with regard to righteousness. The history of violence against the poor and downtrodden is breath-taking really, in spite of the nationalistic narratives we tell each other. As you mentioned, black people in this country have been oppressed through slavery, then through apartheid, for hundreds of years. And while there has been some movement on that front, systemic racism remains. In addition to that, the USA has been party to and propagated some of the bloodiest acts of violence in human history. Burning Dresden and Tokyo. Incinerating Nagasaki and Hiroshima. (And countless other examples). And most recently in the 50 or so years, been the instigator of the worst genocide ever, that is extremely well documented, that being the 50 million lives that have been officially state sanctioned slaughter. And now, are part of the worst moral degradation ever with regard to sexual confusion, abuse, sodomitic behavior, all in the name of "righteousness." The chickens have come home to roost. We are in Babylon.

I disagree with you finally that we don't own this country and have never been part of it.

This strikes me as our fundamental disagreement. I see Jesus as coming to literally be King/President and establish a country that is in competition with worldly kingdoms. I see us as literally citizens of his kingdom, where a different law, a law of love and gospel of peace, preside. Where a different justice system, one of forgiveness and reconciliation, rule. Where a different military, one that uses prayer and our capacity to love and suffer like Jesus, wars against evil. Citizens of God's kingdom will never be "good" citizens of worldly kingdoms. They are aliens. Yes we should pay taxes/tribute/ etc. Not because these are governments that rule by "divine right" but because we willingly give. Just like we are even directed to give to a thief who takes our coat, our cloak also. (That doesn't legitimize the thief though.)

Lastly, when I say the USA is equivalent to all other nation states, what I mean is in a philosophical sense. A man that murders 1 man is still a murderer just as much as a man that murders 50. The underlying willful action/motivation is the same. That is why, it doesn't work for a firefighter, who hypothetically saved the lives of 5 people to go free after he murders 1. He can't say I am exceptional because I am still "plus four." No. He is a murderer. So it is with nation-states. They all have blood on their hands regardless of a body count of 50 or 50 million.

[Josh]

I tend to view anti-Americanism like Josh displays here with suspicion since it is part and parcel of left wing (and anti-Jesus) thinking. If it were paired with similar condemnation of other countries, or just the world as a whole, I would be less suspicious.