War in Gaza

[temporal1]

News is reporting that Hamas has accepted a ceasefire proposal: https://apnews.com/article/israel-pales ... 4aa4be53e0

And that Israel and Netanyahu are the obstacles and announcing their rejection of a ceasefire.

I'm curious to see if international pressure and US pressure will lead Israel to reconsider. I think at this point Netanyahu believes that continued war is in his political interest. So we will probably get more war in the service of Netanyahu's political career.

your opinions, speculations are intriguing and fascinating.
more discerning folks would be interested in details of the proposed ceasefire coming from opponents/attackers/terrorists before judging response.

[Ken]

News is reporting that Hamas has accepted a ceasefire proposal: https://apnews.com/article/israel-pales ... 4aa4be53e0

And that Israel and Netanyahu are the obstacles and announcing their rejection of a ceasefire.

I'm curious to see if international pressure and US pressure will lead Israel to reconsider. I think at this point Netanyahu believes that continued war is in his political interest. So we will probably get more war in the service of Netanyahu's political career.

your opinions, speculations are intriguing and fascinating.
more discerning folks would be interested in details of the proposed ceasefire coming from opponents/attackers/terrorists before judging response.

From the AP article that I cited. Pretty much the same thing that I wrote. Namely that Netanyahu has internal political considerations driving him to war and the rest of the world is in opposition to his plans:

Netanyahu is under pressure from hard-line partners in his coalition who demand an attack on Rafah and could collapse his government if he signs a deal. But he also faces pressure from the families of hostages to reach a deal for their release. They say that time is running out to bring their loved ones home safely, and a ground operation would further endanger them.

Thousands of Israelis rallied around the country Monday night calling for an immediate agreement. About 1,000 protesters swelled near the defense headquarters in Tel Aviv. In Jerusalem, about 100 protesters marched toward Netanyahu’s residence with a banner reading, “The blood is on your hands.“

Israel says Rafah is the last significant Hamas stronghold in Gaza, and Netanyahu said Monday that the offensive against the city was vital to ensuring the militants can’t rebuild their military capabilities.

But he faces strong American opposition. Miller said Monday the U.S. has not seen a credible plan to protect Palestinian civilians. “We cannot support an operation in Rafah as it is currently envisioned,” he said.

The looming operation has raised global alarm. Aid agencies have warned that an offensive will bring a surge of more civilian deaths in an Israeli campaign that has already killed over 34,000 people and devastated the territory. It could also wreck the humanitarian aid operation based out of Rafah that is keeping Palestinians across the Gaza Strip alive, they say.

[Josh]

News is reporting that Hamas has accepted a ceasefire proposal: https://apnews.com/article/israel-pales ... 4aa4be53e0

And that Israel and Netanyahu are the obstacles and announcing their rejection of a ceasefire.

I'm curious to see if international pressure and US pressure will lead Israel to reconsider. I think at this point Netanyahu believes that continued war is in his political interest. So we will probably get more war in the service of Netanyahu's political career.

your opinions, speculations are intriguing and fascinating.
more discerning folks would be interested in details of the proposed ceasefire coming from opponents/attackers/terrorists before judging response.

t1, Netanyahu and his extreme-far-right political party coalition are refusing a ceasefire. The minority political party coalition is very upset about this.

Hamas has agreed to a ceasefire.

The United States is the one that proposed the ceasefire. Generally speaking the U.S. government is extremely pro-Israeli government, and this has been no exception.

[Ernie]

but on the same scale as Gaza?

The operation in Iraq was much larger scale. Of course, it didn’t work in the long run.

How are you measuring scale?

Air drops of food. Sending ships across the Atlantic to build a pier. Etc.

[temporal1]

t1, Netanyahu and his extreme-far-right political party coalition are refusing a ceasefire. The minority political party coalition is very upset about this.

Hamas has agreed to a ceasefire.

The United States is the one that proposed the ceasefire. Generally speaking the U.S. government is extremely pro-Israeli government, and this has been no exception.

AP REPORT:
JERUSALEM (AP) — Hamas said Monday it accepted an Egyptian-Qatari cease-fire proposal, but Israel said the deal did not meet its core demands and it was pushing ahead with an assault on the southern Gaza city of Rafah.

Still, Israel said it would continue negotiations.

Hamas’s abrupt acceptance of the cease-fire deal came hours after Israel ordered an evacuation of some 100,000 Palestinians from eastern neighborhoods of Rafah, signaling an invasion was imminent.

.. The reported incursion came a day after Hamas militants killed four Israeli soldiers in a mortar attack that Israel said originated near the Rafah crossing.

The Egyptian official said the operation appeared to be limited.
The Associated Press could not independently verify the scope of the operation. ..

Shortly after Hamas said it had accepted the Egyptian-Qatari truce proposal, Israel’s War Cabinet decided to continue the Rafah operation, Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu ‘s office said.

It also said that
while the proposal Hamas agreed to “is far from meeting Israel’s core demands,” it would send negotiators to Egypt to work on a deal. Late Monday,

Qatar announced it was sending a team to Egypt as well.

.. Israel says Rafah is the last significant Hamas stronghold in Gaza, and Netanyahu said Monday that

the offensive against the city was vital to ensuring the militants can’t rebuild their military capabilities.

Israel isn’t interested in “negotiating with terrorists,” which was once SOP/Standard Operating Procedure, thought to be necessary to prevent terrorism. Why does this not apply to Hamas?

Hamas is not surrendering.

They want to 1) stand by their Oct 7 ambush+execute attack, AND 2) control terms of ceasefire. Not a surrender.
If Israel concedes to this, terrorists everywhere will be empowered.

i’m no military expert.
i could be all-wrong.

Should Ukraine allow Russia to declare terms of a cease-fire, then be pressured to comply?
i’ve been for RESOLUTION in Ukraine from the start. The biden U.S. hasn’t mentioned it. There are no pro-Russian protests on college campuses.

These appear opposite responses to me.
i don’t understand why, except for unwanted POLITICAL pressure on biden in the U.S.
Playing politics is a dangerous game that gets people killed.

i want a ceasefire.
i don’t want to empower/enable terrorists.

[Josh]

The operation in Iraq was much larger scale. Of course, it didn’t work in the long run.

How are you measuring scale?

Air drops of food. Sending ships across the Atlantic to build a pier. Etc.

The operation in Iraq saw many ships sent over along with massive airlifts in many large cargo planes.

[Josh]

Israel isn’t interested in “negotiating with terrorists,” which was once SOP/Standard Operating Procedure, thought to be necessary to prevent terrorism. Why does this not apply to Hamas?

If you want a ceasefire, you have to negotiate. Israel has killed a lot more civilians than Hamas has. Israel’s behaviour (like bombing churches and Danish cooks in food trucks) could also be called “terrorism”.

Hamas is not surrendering.

They want to 1) stand by their Oct 7 ambush+execute attack, AND 2) control terms of ceasefire.
If Israel concedes to this, terrorists everywhere will be empowered.

The ceasefire was brokered and proposed by outsider parties. Hamas is not currently controlling the terms of much of anything.

i’m no military expert.
i could be all-wrong.

Should Ukraine allow Russia to declare terms of a cease-fire, be pressured to comply?

Yes. That would be good too. However neither side seems interested in a cease fire.

i’ve been for RESOLUTION in Ukraine from the start. The biden U.S. hasn’t mentioned it. There are no pro-Russian protests on college campuses.

What does that have to do with anything?

These appear opposite responses to me.
i don’t understand why, except for unwanted POLITICAL pressure on biden in the U.S.
Playing politics is a dangerous game that gets people killed.

Can you explain what “politics” the Biden admin has been playing?

i want a ceasefire.
i don’t want to empower/enable terrorists.

Hamas has agree to a ceasefire. Netanyahu doesn’t want one and is refusing to abide by it. The main reason is because he is playing politics and pandering to an extreme right coalition that has wanted to invade Gaza for decades.

[temporal1]

Israel fires two officers after finding grave errors in strike on aid workers
https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-ea ... 024-04-05/

[Josh]

Israel fires two officers after finding grave errors in strike on aid workers
https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-ea ... 024-04-05/

This doesn’t change the fact the Israeli government has a regular patter of killing aid workers and civilians.

Their behaviour has been so poor that globally opinions have turned against them. America’s government hasn’t… but at some point I’d prefer to see my tax dollars not going to kill women and children and bomb churches. Is that reasonable of me?

[temporal1]

Israel fires two officers after finding grave errors in strike on aid workers
https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-ea ... 024-04-05/

This doesn’t change the fact the Israeli government has a regular patter of killing aid workers and civilians.

Their behaviour has been so poor that globally opinions have turned against them. America’s government hasn’t… but at some point I’d prefer to see my tax dollars not going to kill women and children and bomb churches. Is that reasonable of me?

i’m sorry Russia crossed Ukraine borders, that Hamas ambushed+executed Israeli citizens. Bad moves.
i never see war as reasonable, just the opposite.