MennoNet.com

appleman2006 wrote:Some keep saying we must listen to the black community and not just to the ones that happen to align with our philosophy. They say if we do the latter we are not really listening. I could not agree more. But that applies to all sides of this argument. To imply that only those that speak a certain way truly represent the best interests of the whole black community is to imply the very worst of racism in my mind which is to put everyone that looks alike in a box and assume they have all experienced the same things and think the same way. That is pigeon holing in the very way that we all despise when we are pigeon holed simply based on our appearance and culture. It is not right.

Polls are one of the best ways to find out what the black community thinks.

Do You Know How Divided White And Black Americans Are On Racism?

For instance, 91% of blacks believe that police do not treat black people and white people equally. 88% of blacks believe that race was a major factor in George Floyd's death. 87% believe that police are more likely to use excessive force if the suspect is black. That's why they are speaking out. 77% of black Americans support the George Floyd protests. When you get numbers like that, I think it is fair to say these beliefs are representative of the black community.

Sure, that means that there are black people who do not feel this way. But they are a distinct minority. Candace Owens does not get most of her support from the black community.

And you might be surprised how many white Americans agree with most black Americans on some of these issues.

i don’t agree that polls are the best way (for very much, at all). they can be interesting. but limited, and, if taken too seriously, limiting. not to mention, biased and mistaken to shocking degrees.

did Jesus use polls?

for myself, if i sense ANY person is speaking from a political bloc narrative, i largely dismiss, regardless of the bloc. i don’t care for “narratives.”

i’ve shared quite a few examples of individuals i respect, Thomas Sowell, Dr A King, Ivier Sylvester, Herman Cain, numbers of others, individual and well-known. i suppose, when what is said resonates with what Jesus said, this impresses, this is what lasts. stated numbers and political narratives can mislead.

Jesus is what lasts. There are amazing followers on every continent. These resonate.
They don’t show up in polls, or media air time. But, they are real.

Here is a major problem though right off the top with the above statement. Do 91 percent of blacks believe that all or even most police treat blacks differently than whites?

And if some do, do we dare to talk about some of the reasons that might be so?

If the question is, Do some police treat blacks differently than whites? Than count me in. I agree with that.

Here is the weird thing though. There are actually studies out there that show that in some areas blacks today because of all the connotations and accusations that police get hurled at them actually have situations overlooked in their favour. Police are actually ignoring situations and not going into some neighbourhoods anymore because they know they cannot win. Do you for one minute think that is a good situation?
I have watched enough youtube videos to see that there are far too many cases of police misusing blacks. It angers me to know end. But I have also seen the opposite. I have seen where people white and black approach police with a huge chip on their shoulder. they push their rights and freedoms to an extent just to make a point. Why would anyone do that? There is nothing Christ like about that. And it will almost certainly not end good for you.

There is a proper way to appeal to authority. And I applaud it when I see it.

appleman2006 wrote:Here is a major problem though right off the top with the above statement. Do 91 percent of blacks believe that all or even most police treat blacks differently than whites?

Probably not. In fact, I suspect very few of the protesters would say that all police do. I don't think most pollsters would even bother with that question, I don't know many people who would make that claim.

appleman2006 wrote:There are actually studies out there that show that in some areas blacks today because of all the connotations and accusations that police get hurled at them actually have situations overlooked in their favour. Police are actually ignoring situations and not going into some neighbourhoods anymore because they know they cannot win. Do you for one minute think that is a good situation?

I think the police can win in those neighborhoods if we make that a priority. I don't know what you mean by "overlooked in their favour", overlooking these neighborhoods is definitely not in their favor. I recently pointed that out in this post. And this is also part of what black people are complaining about - only about 50% of black Americans say that police do a good job of protecting people from crime. Look at the first bar in this graph:

appleman2006 wrote:I have watched enough youtube videos to see that there are far too many cases of police misusing blacks. It angers me to no end.

That's what the anger is about.

appleman2006 wrote:But I have also seen the opposite. I have seen where people white and black approach police with a huge chip on their shoulder. they push their rights and freedoms to an extent just to make a point. Why would anyone do that? There is nothing Christ like about that. And it will almost certainly not end good for you.

There is a proper way to appeal to authority. And I applaud it when I see it.

Sure. But that's not what the protests are about. I think these polls show some of the things that the black community, as a whole, is concerned about.

Wow. Thanks Bootstrap for posting that article. Very illustrative...

Bootstrap wrote:

appleman2006 wrote:Some keep saying we must listen to the black community and not just to the ones that happen to align with our philosophy. They say if we do the latter we are not really listening. I could not agree more. But that applies to all sides of this argument. To imply that only those that speak a certain way truly represent the best interests of the whole black community is to imply the very worst of racism in my mind which is to put everyone that looks alike in a box and assume they have all experienced the same things and think the same way. That is pigeon holing in the very way that we all despise when we are pigeon holed simply based on our appearance and culture. It is not right.

Polls are one of the best ways to find out what the black community thinks.

Do You Know How Divided White And Black Americans Are On Racism?

For instance, 91% of blacks believe that police do not treat black people and white people equally. 88% of blacks believe that race was a major factor in George Floyd's death. 87% believe that police are more likely to use excessive force if the suspect is black. That's why they are speaking out. 77% of black Americans support the George Floyd protests. When you get numbers like that, I think it is fair to say these beliefs are representative of the black community.

Sure, that means that there are black people who do not feel this way. But they are a distinct minority. Candace Owens does not get most of her support from the black community.

And you might be surprised how many white Americans agree with most black Americans on some of these issues.

And there is no more a "black community" in this country than a "white community". There are many many different black communities that may share common opinions about some issues and differ on others.

This thread is racist. It identifies people because of color, not character. This saddens me.

"White men denying the existence of systemic racism, that is the essence of white entitlement. We do not need their permission or their sign off on what we know to be true and what we have lived. That is whitemansplaning. How can you solve this problem? The systemic racism that is killing people of color if you won't even admit there's a problem? First step is admitting there's a problem. America knows which way the wind is blowing."

That is a quote from an actual black man, Don Lemon.

joshuabgood wrote:That is a quote from an actual black man, Don Lemon.

And he is real neutral.

You feel there is systematic racism. I have tried to show how that does not generally exist any more. Instead of arguing over it, feel free to find a way to do something about it if you feel it exists.

Robert wrote:

joshuabgood wrote:That is a quote from an actual black man, Don Lemon.

And he is real neutral.

You feel there is systematic racism. I have tried to show how that does not generally exist any more. Instead of arguing over it, feel free to find a way to do something about it if you feel it exists.

Fair enough...I'll stop arguing about it.