Ken wrote: ↑Fri Jul 01, 2022 3:06 pm
Over half of Oregon is Federal land.
It is still in the state and subject to the laws therein This is why they will not be able to do abortions on federal land inside a state that has prohibited it.
Washington DC is unique since there is no state that it resides in.
I'm not positive about the law, but I think technically that the US government could, indeed, do abortions on Federal lands such as military bases and within military hospitals. But that is not legally practical because (1) The Hyde Amendment prohibits Federal dollars being used for abortions so would require an act of Congress, and (2) the minute anyone who got an abortion on say a US military base stepped off the base they would be subject to prosecution under the laws of the state in which the base is located.
The exception would be Indian Reservations but the Hyde Amendment still applies there so it could not be the Indian Health Service which is Federal. And the Supreme Court just ruled that state jurisdiction extends to acts committed on Indian land by NON-INDIANS so the only abortions that could be performed legally on Indian reservations would be those performed outside of the Federal Indian Health Service and performed by tribal members on patients who are tribal members.
And the Federal government can and does implement different gun laws than the states on some Federal lands. For example, open carry isn't allowed on military bases. When I taught in Texas we would have some games and school events held at the football stadium at Fort Hood which functioned as a second home stadium for Killeen-area high schools. We were always warned that we couldn't drive onto the base for school events with weapons in the car and they would check for that at the gate upon entry.
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A fool can throw out more questions than a wise man can answer. -RZehr
Ken wrote: ↑Fri Jul 01, 2022 3:06 pm
Or that people should be able to own stinger missiles or tanks under the Second Amendment.
Yes, there are.
Sane people are arguing that?
I live under the flightpath of a major international airport. Should I be able to own my own stinger missiles? Should anyone? Do you want to live in a world where people can acquire stinger missiles here in the US?
And yes, you can technically own your own tank. Collectors and museums have them. Lots of old Shermans out there. But the guns have to be decommissioned or removed before you can do that. So it is essentially a well armored vintage bulldozer. You can't own a working Sherman tank with functional machine guns or main gun.
This is false, and lots of private citizens own these exact things.
§2332g. Missile systems designed to destroy aircraft
(a) Unlawful Conduct.—
(1) In general.—Except as provided in paragraph (3), it shall be unlawful for any person to knowingly produce, construct, otherwise acquire, transfer directly or indirectly, receive, possess, import, export, or use, or possess and threaten to use—
(A) an explosive or incendiary rocket or missile that is guided by any system designed to enable the rocket or missile to—
(i) seek or proceed toward energy radiated or reflected from an aircraft or toward an image locating an aircraft; or
(ii) otherwise direct or guide the rocket or missile to an aircraft;
(B) any device designed or intended to launch or guide a rocket or missile described in subparagraph (A); or
(C) any part or combination of parts designed or redesigned for use in assembling or fabricating a rocket, missile, or device described in subparagraph (A) or (B).
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A fool can throw out more questions than a wise man can answer. -RZehr
Ken wrote: ↑Tue Jun 28, 2022 7:01 pm
The United States has two universally-recognized "original sins": Slavery and the genocide of our native peoples and their cultures.
Christianity was integral to both and was weaponized to justify both. And, of course, good Christians also opposed both as well.
So yes, in a very real sense Christianity was integral to the establishment of this country and the shaping of what it is today. Both for better and for worse.
That is absolute nonsense. The dominant countries in Europe, Africa, and Asia all had legalized slavery, the US did not establish a new "slave" state.
Can you please explain how Christianity is "integral" to slavery?
§2332g. Missile systems designed to destroy aircraft
(a) Unlawful Conduct.—
(1) In general.—Except as provided in paragraph (3), it shall be unlawful for any person to knowingly produce, construct, otherwise acquire, transfer directly or indirectly, receive, possess, import, export, or use, or possess and threaten to use—
(A) an explosive or incendiary rocket or missile that is guided by any system designed to enable the rocket or missile to—
(i) seek or proceed toward energy radiated or reflected from an aircraft or toward an image locating an aircraft; or
(ii) otherwise direct or guide the rocket or missile to an aircraft;
(B) any device designed or intended to launch or guide a rocket or missile described in subparagraph (A); or
(C) any part or combination of parts designed or redesigned for use in assembling or fabricating a rocket, missile, or device described in subparagraph (A) or (B).
What does that have to do with owning a fully functional army tank?
§2332g. Missile systems designed to destroy aircraft
(a) Unlawful Conduct.—
(1) In general.—Except as provided in paragraph (3), it shall be unlawful for any person to knowingly produce, construct, otherwise acquire, transfer directly or indirectly, receive, possess, import, export, or use, or possess and threaten to use—
(A) an explosive or incendiary rocket or missile that is guided by any system designed to enable the rocket or missile to—
(i) seek or proceed toward energy radiated or reflected from an aircraft or toward an image locating an aircraft; or
(ii) otherwise direct or guide the rocket or missile to an aircraft;
(B) any device designed or intended to launch or guide a rocket or missile described in subparagraph (A); or
(C) any part or combination of parts designed or redesigned for use in assembling or fabricating a rocket, missile, or device described in subparagraph (A) or (B).
What does that have to do with owning a fully functional army tank?
That is governed by other laws. This is what prohibits private ownership of working stinger missiles so that crazy people or terrorists don't shoot down airplanes in the US. The penalty for possessing a working anti-aircraft missile in the US is 20 years to life. The US government REALLY doesn't want people owning these things.
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A fool can throw out more questions than a wise man can answer. -RZehr
What does that have to do with owning a fully functional army tank?
That is governed by other laws. This is what prohibits private ownership of working stinger missiles so that crazy people or terrorists don't shoot down airplanes in the US. The penalty for possessing a working anti-aircraft missile in the US is 20 years to life. The US government REALLY doesn't want people owning these things.
Ken wrote: ↑Fri Jul 01, 2022 5:45 pm......You can't own a working Sherman tank with functional machine guns or main gun.
Like Josh said, this statement of yours about citizens not being able to own a working tank is false.
In my opinion a law prohibiting ownership of guided missiles has nothing to do with whether owning a working tank is illegal.
ken_sylvania wrote: ↑Sat Jul 02, 2022 10:29 pm
Like Josh said, this statement of yours about citizens not being able to own a working tank is false.
In my opinion a law prohibiting ownership of guided missiles has nothing to do with whether owning a working tank is illegal.
There are state laws the prohibit them being driven on public roads. This is one of the challenges of having them in parades. They do tear up the streets.
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ken_sylvania wrote: ↑Sat Jul 02, 2022 2:35 pm
What does that have to do with owning a fully functional army tank?
That is governed by other laws. This is what prohibits private ownership of working stinger missiles so that crazy people or terrorists don't shoot down airplanes in the US. The penalty for possessing a working anti-aircraft missile in the US is 20 years to life. The US government REALLY doesn't want people owning these things.
Ken wrote: ↑Fri Jul 01, 2022 5:45 pm......You can't own a working Sherman tank with functional machine guns or main gun.
Like Josh said, this statement of yours about citizens not being able to own a working tank is false.
In my opinion a law prohibiting ownership of guided missiles has nothing to do with whether owning a working tank is illegal.
I’m not sure how we got this far sidetracked. I was only making the point that there are limits to the Second Amendment. All we are really debating is where we draw the line. I used the random example of stinger missiles and working tanks. It is clearly illegal to possess a stinger missile or any other similar anti-aircraft weapon. I cited the statute.
As for tanks, which was just a random example. It turns out that the US government does not ever sell surplus tanks to civilians. And you can’t buy one from the manufacturer. You can’t go buy a M1A1 Abrams at any price from General Dynamics. The are prohibited from selling them to civilians. So people who want to purchase tanks generally have to do it by buying them from foreign countries where the are sometimes sold to the public when surplussed. However you cannot own one with a working main gun unless you have a Federal Destructive License which are not generally issued to people for the purpose of private ownership tanks unless you have a very specific demonstrated need. And every round of ammunition is separately considered a destructive device and requires all the same permits and licenses as the tank itself. Research it all you want. People say it is basically impossible for a civilian to get the necessary permits to own a tank with a working main cannon. And even if you got that far, most state laws prohibit ownership of any working big bore weapons of that caliber such as tank guns or howitzers. So prior to import, people have to have the main guns and firing systems disabled which essentially turns the tank into a bulldozer with armor that they can actually own.
Are you defining “working” as one that actually runs? Or are you defining “working” as having a main cannon that can aim and fire armor piercing or high explosive shells. I’m talking about the latter.
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A fool can throw out more questions than a wise man can answer. -RZehr
