Mennonite Measles in Texas

[Ken]

JohnH is here on a public forum accusing the Cleveland Clinic of administering its own un-tested and unapproved vaccine cocktails in violation of both the law and the guidelines by the vaccine manufacturers themselves. And he is doing so in support of his larger argument that vaccines are unsafe and ineffective.

I have done no such thing. I have not claimed they have broken the law nor violated any guidelines.

Please do not make statements claiming that I have said things that I have not.

You have claimed that they did a certain thing. Namely mix GARDASIL and the flu vaccine into vials for administration jointly.

This is in direct violation of FDA vaccine guidelines for these two vaccines and the directions of the manufacturers. And is actually the sort of thing that could get someone's medical license revoked or a facility fined.

[JohnH]

JohnH is here on a public forum accusing the Cleveland Clinic of administering its own un-tested and unapproved vaccine cocktails in violation of both the law and the guidelines by the vaccine manufacturers themselves. And he is doing so in support of his larger argument that vaccines are unsafe and ineffective.

I have done no such thing. I have not claimed they have broken the law nor violated any guidelines.

Please do not make statements claiming that I have said things that I have not.

You have claimed that they did a certain thing. Namely mix GARDASIL and the flu vaccine into vials for administration jointly.

This is in direct violation of FDA vaccine guidelines for these two vaccines and the directions of the manufacturers. And is actually the sort of thing that could get someone's medical license revoked or a facility fined.

I observed a premixed (presumably sealed) barcoded etc vial. I am going to assume no laws or regulations were broken.

[Soloist]

Can we stay on topic and avoid fruitless arguments?

[Ken]

Moving back to measles…

So far in Texas the numbers are up to 400 reported cases with 1 death and 41 hospitalizations.

Two deaths. The second one was an unvaccinated adult right across the border in Lee County New Mexico which borders Hobbs County TX (where the Mennonite colony is) and is part of the same measles outbreak. The two deaths were like 20 miles apart: https://www.nmhealth.org/news/alert/2025/3/?view=2188

[JohnH]

Measles is a highly contagious respiratory illness that can cause severe complications. One in five cases requires hospitalization, and approximately three in every 1,000 cases result in death.

Still trying to figure this out - in the 1950s, did 20% of children go to the hospital? I have talked to various friends, my parents, in-laws, etc. who were alive back then and they cannot remember this degree of hospitalization. Basically everyone back then got measles, and I do not see much evidence that 20% of children were hospitalized in the 1950s.

I am also not finding a 0.3% death rate bump of all children in the 1950s, and I question why they're quoting a rate that is 15 to 30 times higher than the rate in the UK (1 in 5,000 according to some sources, 1 in 10,000 according to others). Something isn't adding up here.

We also see this kind of pointless pro-vaccine propaganda:

“We don’t want to see New Mexicans getting sick or dying from measles,” said Dr. Chad Smelser, NMDOH Deputy State Epidemiologist. “The measles-mumps-rubella (MMR) vaccine is the best protection against this serious disease.”

A mumps-rubella combination doesn't provide any protection against measles. They should have said, "The measles vaccine is the best protection against this serious disease." Instead, they use the fear of measles as a way to try to get people to take the other two vaccines. It's ridiculous.

[Ken]

Measles is a highly contagious respiratory illness that can cause severe complications. One in five cases requires hospitalization, and approximately three in every 1,000 cases result in death.

Still trying to figure this out - in the 1950s, did 20% of children go to the hospital? I have talked to various friends, my parents, in-laws, etc. who were alive back then and they cannot remember this degree of hospitalization. Basically everyone back then got measles, and I do not see much evidence that 20% of children were hospitalized in the 1950s.

I am also not finding a 0.3% death rate bump of all children in the 1950s, and I question why they're quoting a rate that is 15 to 30 times higher than the rate in the UK (1 in 5,000 according to some sources, 1 in 10,000 according to others). Something isn't adding up here.

We also see this kind of pointless pro-vaccine propaganda:

“We don’t want to see New Mexicans getting sick or dying from measles,” said Dr. Chad Smelser, NMDOH Deputy State Epidemiologist. “The measles-mumps-rubella (MMR) vaccine is the best protection against this serious disease.”

A mumps-rubella combination doesn't provide any protection against measles. They should have said, "The measles vaccine is the best protection against this serious disease." Instead, they use the fear of measles as a way to try to get people to take the other two vaccines. It's ridiculous.

Many diseases that would be treated with hospitalization today were treated by mandatory home quarantine 75-100 years ago before the advent of vaccines and modern ICUs that have things like ventilators and infectious disease wards with negative ventilation.

You would get a quarantine notice posted on your front door by the health authorities and no one would be allowed to come or go until the quarantine period was over. And you thought COVID lockdowns were strict. This is what would get tacked to your front door.

[JohnH]

You would get a quarantine notice posted on your front door by the health authorities and no one would be allowed to come or go until the quarantine period was over. And you thought COVID lockdowns were strict. Something like this:

Nice try, but that was not done widespread in the 1950s. My parents don't recall a "quarantine notice" posted on their front doors and nobody allowed in or out of the house for a week.

This is an attempt to spread fear, which is the primary tool of Big Pharma to make sure vaccine sales stay high. "Get vaccinated or you won't be allowed to have a job." "Get vaccinated or your kids won't be allowed to go to school." "If you don't have a vaccine card you won't be allowed in the grocery store."

[R7ehr]

Moving back to measles…

So far in Texas the numbers are up to 400 reported cases with 1 death and 41 hospitalizations.

Two deaths. The second one was an unvaccinated adult right across the border in Lee County New Mexico which borders Hobbs County TX (where the Mennonite colony is) and is part of the same measles outbreak. The two deaths were like 20 miles apart: https://www.nmhealth.org/news/alert/2025/3/?view=2188

I am curious about this case. Age, preexisting conditions, etc.

[R7ehr]

Moving back to measles…

So far in Texas the numbers are up to 400 reported cases with 1 death and 41 hospitalizations.

That would suggest the fatality rate is relatively small and nowhere near 2%, at least in the US.

With Covid, we had undereporting, and we know this because we still had uptick in fatalities in certain areas of our country that were more prone having less reports…

Based off of how the general population has been treating this couple who decided to open their mouth (at least online), and on reports I’ve read, I would suggest that the initial Mennonite population was mostly noncompliant in being tested.
I don’t know what the actual numbers would look like if we had that, but I would suggest at least 50% increase in cases. Obviously, I have no way to actually know this…
So that would put our numbers at somewhere between 0.25% to 0.16% with hospitalization rates ranging from 10% to 5%.
Given these numbers, I would suggest historical data is not up to modern results. As we continue to have more measles outbreaks among unvaccinated, we will gather more accurate data given this is a relatively small population data to work with. that being said, given how the unvaccinated are treated, it’s going to be even harder probably to gather accurate data in the future because people will not want to report it.

I think you’re right.

[Soloist]

Moving back to measles…

So far in Texas the numbers are up to 400 reported cases with 1 death and 41 hospitalizations.

Two deaths. The second one was an unvaccinated adult right across the border in Lee County New Mexico which borders Hobbs County TX (where the Mennonite colony is) and is part of the same measles outbreak. The two deaths were like 20 miles apart: https://www.nmhealth.org/news/alert/2025/3/?view=2188

From what I understand, that death was still under investigation. Have they released an official report on it yet?