Amish Covid | Full Measure

[Ernie]

6 foot social distancing is pointless (there’s plenty of science to back up my statement, too).

Which is why I recommend 6-10 feet for conversation. I prefer closer to 10 feet when in conversation. I agree that in a work place for 8 hours, physical distancing is not going to help much.
There is science that shows that the amount of Covid particles one inhales can effect how severe of an illness that person may get. So there can be benefit in physical distancing (in a large room) when two people visit for an hour or so. They may not get infected at all, and if they get infected it may be a milder case. I was recently in a small room with about 10 people for 8 hours. We had the windows open and I sat near the windows. Turns out that two in the group were carrying the virus and didn't know it. Those between me and the infected ones got sick. I did not. Perhaps it was a miracle, or because I was taking quercetin and zinc, but I won't try that again, unless the persons recently recovered from Covid.

Things like hand sanitiser and wiping down surfaces are no longer CDC recommended.

They still recommend washing hands which was what I was promoting in my list of things churches should do. https://www.cdc.gov/handwashing/when-ho ... shing.html

[Josh]

What’s the scientific evidence for 6 feet (or 10 feet)?

And washing hands has been around a lot longer than covid.

Maintaining 6 (or 10) feet of distance at all times is basically impossible. It’s sad although entertaining to see, for example, in an airport, six feet marked off for standing in lines - and of course nobody is that far apart. It’s utterly absurd.

The same goes for church. Actually staying that far apart is quite silly, and there’s no reason to do it.

[Ernie]

What’s the scientific evidence for 6 feet (or 10 feet)?

https://news.psu.edu/story/668782/2021/ ... l-exposure

I agree with this article that standing 6' away will not make much difference if you are talking face to face with someone in situations where masking is not done or there is not good ventilation. And as I said before, masking, or physical distance of 6' or 10' is not going to make much difference in environments where people are working together in the same office for prolonged periods of time. Physical distance only helps to mitigate the spread of Covid in situations where people are not talking to each for long periods of time and other mitigation measures are also in place.

[Josh]

What’s the scientific evidence for 6 feet (or 10 feet)?

https://news.psu.edu/story/668782/2021/ ... l-exposure

I agree with this article that standing 6' away will not make much difference if you are talking face to face with someone in situations where masking is not done or there is not good ventilation. And as I said before, masking, or physical distance of 6' or 10' is not going to make much difference in environments where people are working together in the same office for prolonged periods of time. Physical distance only helps to mitigate the spread of Covid in situations where people are not talking to each for long periods of time and other mitigation measures are also in place.

More specifically, 6 foot separation accomplishes absolutely nothing at all. There is no reason to do it, nor any reason to keep up signs telling people to do it (which are mostly ignored).

The non-scientific basis for the six foot rule is one reason I’ve lost a lot of my trust in establishment “science” and institutions like the CDC; they just make stuff up.

[Valerie]

What’s the scientific evidence for 6 feet (or 10 feet)?

https://news.psu.edu/story/668782/2021/ ... l-exposure

I agree with this article that standing 6' away will not make much difference if you are talking face to face with someone in situations where masking is not done or there is not good ventilation. And as I said before, masking, or physical distance of 6' or 10' is not going to make much difference in environments where people are working together in the same office for prolonged periods of time. Physical distance only helps to mitigate the spread of Covid in situations where people are not talking to each for long periods of time and other mitigation measures are also in place.

More specifically, 6 foot separation accomplishes absolutely nothing at all. There is no reason to do it, nor any reason to keep up signs telling people to do it (which are mostly ignored).

The non-scientific basis for the six foot rule is one reason I’ve lost a lot of my trust in establishment “science” and institutions like the CDC; they just make stuff up.

Exactly. Is it that they don't really know &/or understand?
Testing the waters for what people will believe/fall for?
Remember when the CDC was first showing what the air would look like with this virus floating around unless you were standing in place just walking through where somebody had previously walked with expose you.
I remember thinking in the very busy store where people were panic shopping that I work in, there was no way for people to avoid breathing in the virus if somebody had it, the masks don't keep it from going through the masks, if it's floating in the air the way the CDC showed us it does, even 6-ft distancing doesn't last when people are going every which way through a store it's ridiculous to think any of that social distancing accomplished anything but seeing what people will comply to if told

[Jazman]

But is there any evidence that meeting for church has been killing people?

I'm 100% aware of everyone who's died in my congregation and in a few other congregations in my denomination. Nobody has died because they caught COVID by attending a church service. Most deaths have been non-COVID. For those who did die of COVID - they caught it and died when we weren't meeting for church at all, or meeting in tiny groups of 10 (and the afflicted people not attending).

Interesting question this far into this event... I, like you, can say "my church" didn't have any deaths (yet) from meeting together... (but lot's of people have gotten the disease with a high possibility that they got it at church) But that's just my small corner of the world. Throughout this event, there has absolutely been many cases of people catching it at church (one famous example, the choir practice, somewhere I forget) and dying from it. I thought this question was beyond contention by now...

And, although not at my church now, the one we attended in the past, had a recent outbreak (likely among the unvaccinated) and an older woman got it and died. Now she was elderly, had some other health issues, but a potluck at church where the outbreak occurred... I can't prove 100% that she would still be with us if a number of other things had taken place like: everyone vaxxed, she would have skipped the potluck and/or church, she or others had been more careful during the service or the potluck... etc etc. - but maybe she might be?

[Neto]

What’s the scientific evidence for 6 feet (or 10 feet)?

https://news.psu.edu/story/668782/2021/ ... l-exposure

I agree with this article that standing 6' away will not make much difference if you are talking face to face with someone in situations where masking is not done or there is not good ventilation. And as I said before, masking, or physical distance of 6' or 10' is not going to make much difference in environments where people are working together in the same office for prolonged periods of time. Physical distance only helps to mitigate the spread of Covid in situations where people are not talking to each for long periods of time and other mitigation measures are also in place.

More specifically, 6 foot separation accomplishes absolutely nothing at all. There is no reason to do it, nor any reason to keep up signs telling people to do it (which are mostly ignored).

The non-scientific basis for the six foot rule is one reason I’ve lost a lot of my trust in establishment “science” and institutions like the CDC; they just make stuff up.

Obviously, the farther you were from an infected person the less likely you will come down with what ever catchy sickness they have. Like if you are not together at all, or in a different city. Sure, that's an extreme, and nonsense to say it, but it seems apparent that at some distance the likelihood of catching what another has is going to start going up. So what is the magic number? 25'? 1 mile?

(An irrelevant fact from the Banawa - their "social distance", their custom, is around 12' or farther. Why? Good question. Part of it is for fear of receiving a curse through touch, but maybe some long ago experiences with the "common cold", which, incidentally, is the named cause of death for many of the parents of the now older generation, may have also contributed to that. It could also easily be that the "common cold" was considered the result of a curse, especially in those early days after first contact with the "outsiders".)

[Ken]

What’s the scientific evidence for 6 feet (or 10 feet)?

https://news.psu.edu/story/668782/2021/ ... l-exposure

I agree with this article that standing 6' away will not make much difference if you are talking face to face with someone in situations where masking is not done or there is not good ventilation. And as I said before, masking, or physical distance of 6' or 10' is not going to make much difference in environments where people are working together in the same office for prolonged periods of time. Physical distance only helps to mitigate the spread of Covid in situations where people are not talking to each for long periods of time and other mitigation measures are also in place.

More specifically, 6 foot separation accomplishes absolutely nothing at all. There is no reason to do it, nor any reason to keep up signs telling people to do it (which are mostly ignored).

The non-scientific basis for the six foot rule is one reason I’ve lost a lot of my trust in establishment “science” and institutions like the CDC; they just make stuff up.

Seriously Josh. You are a smart guy. What is your number if not 6 ft?

You do agree that Covid is a transmissible disease that is highly contagious between people in close contact? And that physical distance is one way to prevent transmission? Do you agree that prolonged close contact between two people at say 1 ft apart can easily lead to transmission of Covid? And that physical distance of say 100 ft or maybe 500 ft is sufficient to absolutely prevent any transmission of Covid?

So it is simply a matter of finding an intermediate point between those two extremes that serves as a good universal rule of thumb to prevent the bulk of easily preventable transmission. Maybe it should actually be 20 ft when you are indoors, and 5 ft when you are outdoors. Maybe it depends on the duration of the close contact and the degree of air circulation. There are hundreds of different variables. But you need to come up with one basic universal rule of thumb. What is it going to be if not 6 ft?

Or maybe you just abandon social distancing completely and go with universal mask use and universal use instead? What are YOUR solutions?

[Josh]

https://news.psu.edu/story/668782/2021/ ... l-exposure

I agree with this article that standing 6' away will not make much difference if you are talking face to face with someone in situations where masking is not done or there is not good ventilation. And as I said before, masking, or physical distance of 6' or 10' is not going to make much difference in environments where people are working together in the same office for prolonged periods of time. Physical distance only helps to mitigate the spread of Covid in situations where people are not talking to each for long periods of time and other mitigation measures are also in place.

More specifically, 6 foot separation accomplishes absolutely nothing at all. There is no reason to do it, nor any reason to keep up signs telling people to do it (which are mostly ignored).

The non-scientific basis for the six foot rule is one reason I’ve lost a lot of my trust in establishment “science” and institutions like the CDC; they just make stuff up.

Seriously Josh. You are a smart guy. What is your number if not 6 ft?

You do agree that Covid is a transmissible disease that is highly contagious between people in close contact? And that physical distance is one way to prevent transmission? Do you agree that prolonged close contact between two people at say 1 ft apart can easily lead to transmission of Covid? And that physical distance of say 100 ft or maybe 500 ft is sufficient to absolutely prevent any transmission of Covid?

So it is simply a matter of finding an intermediate point between those two extremes that serves as a good universal rule of thumb to prevent the bulk of easily preventable transmission. Maybe it should actually be 20 ft when you are indoors, and 5 ft when you are outdoors. Maybe it depends on the duration of the close contact and the degree of air circulation. There are hundreds of different variables. But you need to come up with one basic universal rule of thumb. What is it going to be if not 6 ft?

Or maybe you just abandon social distancing completely and go with universal mask use and universal use instead? What are YOUR solutions?

No social distancing, no masks, and no measures at all needed. Life goes on just fine. I’ve been doing this for over a year, as has virtually everyone I’ve been in contact with for the last year (which is hundreds if not thousands of people).

Weddings of 500 people? No problem. Funeral with 500+ people. No problem. Church every Sunday packed to the gills with 200+ people? No problem.

Some people want to get vaccinated, some don’t, and it’s a personal choice for each person. Virtually everybody I know has already had it.

Incidentally I’ve had more than the usual amount of funerals to attend the last year and a half - zero of them covid related.

Packed airplane, middle seats full, passengers with masks down eating and drinking snacks? Also no problem. Busy crowds in the BMV? No masks, no problem.

If I needed to go to the hospital, there isn’t a crisis to get care. This entire thing is a made up fake crisis, and you should rethink why you want to believe in it so badly.

[nett]

https://news.psu.edu/story/668782/2021/ ... l-exposure

I agree with this article that standing 6' away will not make much difference if you are talking face to face with someone in situations where masking is not done or there is not good ventilation. And as I said before, masking, or physical distance of 6' or 10' is not going to make much difference in environments where people are working together in the same office for prolonged periods of time. Physical distance only helps to mitigate the spread of Covid in situations where people are not talking to each for long periods of time and other mitigation measures are also in place.

More specifically, 6 foot separation accomplishes absolutely nothing at all. There is no reason to do it, nor any reason to keep up signs telling people to do it (which are mostly ignored).

The non-scientific basis for the six foot rule is one reason I’ve lost a lot of my trust in establishment “science” and institutions like the CDC; they just make stuff up.

Seriously Josh. You are a smart guy. What is your number if not 6 ft?

You do agree that Covid is a transmissible disease that is highly contagious between people in close contact? And that physical distance is one way to prevent transmission? Do you agree that prolonged close contact between two people at say 1 ft apart can easily lead to transmission of Covid? And that physical distance of say 100 ft or maybe 500 ft is sufficient to absolutely prevent any transmission of Covid?

So it is simply a matter of finding an intermediate point between those two extremes that serves as a good universal rule of thumb to prevent the bulk of easily preventable transmission. Maybe it should actually be 20 ft when you are indoors, and 5 ft when you are outdoors. Maybe it depends on the duration of the close contact and the degree of air circulation. There are hundreds of different variables. But you need to come up with one basic universal rule of thumb. What is it going to be if not 6 ft?

Or maybe you just abandon social distancing completely and go with universal mask use and universal use instead? What are YOUR solutions?

You can't find any empirical evidence that positively ties COVID measures with positively outcomes. Not vaccines, not lockdowns, not masking, not social distancing. None of it. In hindsight, it was all theatre.