Sattler College Turmoil

[barnhart]

I always thought it was a smart move by Finny to hire Dean as Dean had credibility with the CA community which comprised the vast vast majority of Sattler students. Further Dean emotes in a really down to earth way with an easier flexibility than some around minor doctrinal points...that built a lot of confidence.

I was encouraged by that pairing as well. I consider Dean as the bridgeiest of bridge builders. If he can't build a bridge from anabaptism to FOTW, I wonder if it will happen.

[Ernie]

So are you saying that Dean never intended to start a Mennonite church at all?

Correct. Although if some Mennonite group within Dean's parameters would have wanted to come in and start a church, he would have gotten behind it. Since no other Mennonite group was interested in planting a church in Boston, Dean decided to plant one himself in south Boston where no FOTW churches were located.

Was there more than one church that Finny opposed starting? Or is this the one everyone is talking about?

In short, "the one everyone is talking about".

The founder of Sattler was opposed to Dean being part of a church other than FOTW. He wanted the President and dean of students to be members of FOTW. At one point the founder of Sattler and the founders of FOTW did get behind Dean's church planting vision, whenever Dean told them that the dean of students he had recruited was welcome to join FOTW. Dean did not require that the dean of students help him start the new church plant. Dean also welcomed the founder of Sattler to be one his new church plant's advisory board. At this point, the FOTW founders said all sorts of nice things to Dean about how great a guy he was, how forgiving he was, etc. But when the FOTW founders could not convince the dean of students to join FOTW, and they found out that Dean was planning to start a "kingdom Christian Anabaptist church" with weekly communion, etc., then they adamantly opposed the endeavor. They did not want the President and the Dean of Students at the college (two former FOTW members with great influence) to start a church that would compete with FOTW in Boston.

[Judas Maccabeus]

I always thought it was a smart move by Finny to hire Dean as Dean had credibility with the CA community which comprised the vast vast majority of Sattler students. Further Dean emotes in a really down to earth way with an easier flexibility than some around minor doctrinal points...that built a lot of confidence.

I was encouraged by that pairing as well. I consider Dean as the bridgeiest of bridge builders. If he can't build a bridge from anabaptism to FOTW, I wonder if it will happen.

It is hard to build bridges to groups that think they are the one true visible church. I have long suspected bthat, but with the current new information, I am almost certain. It is tough to know, since they are a bit secretive about what they actually do Believe . A written statement of faith would go a long way in that direction. Removing their messages from public view does the opposite.

[ohio jones]

So are you saying that Dean never intended to start a Mennonite church at all?

Correct. Although if some Mennonite group within Dean's parameters would have wanted to come in and start a church, he would have gotten behind it. Since no other Mennonite group was interested in planting a church in Boston, Dean decided to plant one himself in south Boston where no FOTW churches were located.

This sounds contradictory to me. Are you saying is that he didn't originally intend to start a church, but later changed his mind and did intend to start one? (If so, that's the opposite of "never intended.")

[ken_sylvania]

So are you saying that Dean never intended to start a Mennonite church at all?

Correct. Although if some Mennonite group within Dean's parameters would have wanted to come in and start a church, he would have gotten behind it. Since no other Mennonite group was interested in planting a church in Boston, Dean decided to plant one himself in south Boston where no FOTW churches were located.

This sounds contradictory to me. Are you saying is that he didn't originally intend to start a church, but later changed his mind and did intend to start one? (If so, that's the opposite of "never intended.")

Does it sound less contradictory if you read it as:
Dean never intended to start a Mennonite church at all. If some Mennonite group within Dean's parameters would have wanted to come in and start a church, he would have gotten behind it. Since no other Mennonite group was interested in planting a church in Boston, Dean decided to plant one [a church, not necessarily Mennonite] himself in south Boston....

Admittedly, the phrase "other Mennonite" seems to imply that Dean is/was Mennonite.

[Ernie]

This sounds contradictory to me. Are you saying is that he didn't originally intend to start a church, but later changed his mind and did intend to start one? (If so, that's the opposite of "never intended.")

Does it sound less contradictory if you read it as:
Dean never intended to start a Mennonite church at all. If some Mennonite group within Dean's parameters would have wanted to come in and start a church, he would have gotten behind it. Since no other Mennonite group was interested in planting a church in Boston, Dean decided to plant one [a church, not necessarily Mennonite] himself in south Boston....

That is correct, from what I understand.

Dean would have been fine with any sort of Anabaptist... Mennonite, Amish-Mennonite, Brethren, etc. (within certain parameters) starting a church in Boston.

[Josh]

My understanding was one of the goals was to form a church where BMA and Keystone type of students would feel comfortable (and their parents and ministers back home would also feel comfortable with it). That left a lot of room for differences like weekly communion but didn’t leave space for “one true church” teaching, belief that full immersion baptism is required for salvation, nor the teaching that there can only be one true church in a given city and that a second church that starts in the same city is illegitimate.

[brothereicher]

If Dean never intended to start an Anabaptist church in Boston, as you say, the common accusation that Finny prevented/opposed/resisted an Anabaptist church from starting in Boston is a false accusation.

Whether Finny's approach to another church starting in Boston as a split-off from FOTW was the correct response is another matter for discussion. But there have been frequent references in this very thread to the idea that Finny, in some form, prevented a Mennonite/Anabaptist church from starting, when it turns out that that never happened.

[ken_sylvania]

If Dean never intended to start an Anabaptist church in Boston, as you say, the common accusation that Finny prevented/opposed/resisted an Anabaptist church from starting in Boston is a false accusation.

Whether Finny's approach to another church starting in Boston as a split-off from FOTW was the correct response is another matter for discussion. But there have been frequent references in this very thread to the idea that Finny, in some form, prevented a Mennonite/Anabaptist church from starting, when it turns out that that never happened.

Ernie did not say that Dean never intended to start an Anabaptist church in Boston. Also, he said his impression is that Finny would not have opposed a BMA type church from starting in Boston.

Talk about false accusations.....

[brothereicher]

So are you saying that Dean never intended to start a Mennonite church at all?

Correct. Although if some Mennonite group within Dean's parameters would have wanted to come in and start a church, he would have gotten behind it. Since no other Mennonite group was interested in planting a church in Boston, Dean decided to plant one himself in south Boston where no FOTW churches were located.

That's exactly what Ernie said.

ME: So are you saying that Dean never intended to start a Mennonite church at all?
ERNIE: Correct.

How is this a false accusation?