Criminal background as a barrier to employment

[Josh]

You absolutely could refuse to hire people who have cars, or cars with bad fuel economy.

Discriminating against a specific religion would run afoul of discrimination laws.

But yes, I don’t want any potheads working for me. Drugs usually do NOT stay in just someone’s personal life.

[Ken]

Absolutely ridiculous. Why should I be forced to hire someone who chooses to get high?

Do you really think that as an employer it is your RIGHT to dictate the behavior and activities of your employees when they are NOT at work? That's pretty intrusive.

I would equally ask why should I be forced to hire someone who drives a gas guzzling car and attends a Holdeman Church? If I happen to disapprove of those things. Should I have the right to reach out into my employee's private lives and set standards of conduct for them when they are not working for me? In Washington State the answer to that question is no. Employers don't have the right to regulate the lives of their employees when they are not at work. Which seems fair to me.

I think you should totally have the right to not hire a person who has removed the emissions control system from his pickup and drives it on the road in violation of federal law.

You can certainly turn such a person in. And forbid them from using such a pickup on the job. And if you turn him in and he is arrested then you could refuse to hire him on the grounds that he is a criminal.

And you can probably refuse to hire them too. I don't know of any state that has made it illegal to discriminate against knuckleheads who are "rolling coal" or otherwise illegally modifying their vehicles. The law in Washington is specific to pot smoking (which is legal behavior) and not illegally modifying vehicles (which is illegal behavior).

[Ken]

You absolutely could refuse to hire people who have cars, or cars with bad fuel economy.

Discriminating against a specific religion would run afoul of discrimination laws.

But yes, I don’t want any potheads working for me. Drugs usually do NOT stay in just someone’s personal life.

Don't open a business in Washington then. Or find some other pretext to exclude pot smokers, which is probably pretty easy to do.

[ken_sylvania]

Do you really think that as an employer it is your RIGHT to dictate the behavior and activities of your employees when they are NOT at work? That's pretty intrusive.

I would equally ask why should I be forced to hire someone who drives a gas guzzling car and attends a Holdeman Church? If I happen to disapprove of those things. Should I have the right to reach out into my employee's private lives and set standards of conduct for them when they are not working for me? In Washington State the answer to that question is no. Employers don't have the right to regulate the lives of their employees when they are not at work. Which seems fair to me.

I think you should totally have the right to not hire a person who has removed the emissions control system from his pickup and drives it on the road in violation of federal law.

You can certainly turn such a person in. And forbid them from using such a pickup on the job. And if you turn him in and he is arrested then you could refuse to hire him on the grounds that he is a criminal.

And you can probably refuse to hire them too. I don't know of any state that has made it illegal to discriminate against knuckleheads who are "rolling coal" or otherwise illegally modifying their vehicles. The law in Washington is specific to pot smoking (which is legal behavior) and not illegally modifying vehicles (which is illegal behavior).

21 U.S.C. § 844 prohibits possession of non-medical marijuana. So yes, pot smoking is a federal crime.

[Ken]

I think you should totally have the right to not hire a person who has removed the emissions control system from his pickup and drives it on the road in violation of federal law.

You can certainly turn such a person in. And forbid them from using such a pickup on the job. And if you turn him in and he is arrested then you could refuse to hire him on the grounds that he is a criminal.

And you can probably refuse to hire them too. I don't know of any state that has made it illegal to discriminate against knuckleheads who are "rolling coal" or otherwise illegally modifying their vehicles. The law in Washington is specific to pot smoking (which is legal behavior) and not illegally modifying vehicles (which is illegal behavior).

21 U.S.C. § 844 prohibits possession of non-medical marijuana. So yes, pot smoking is a federal crime.

Yes, but since 2014, Congress has approved a budget amendment that prohibits the Department of Justice from using its funds to prevent states from implementing their medical marijuana laws. Known as the Rohrabacher-Farr amendment. Look it up. So Congress has prohibited the Justice Department from enforcing the provisions of the law that you just cited.

Congress hasn't prohibited the Justice Department or states from enforcing emissions laws. So there is a difference.

And it any event, states are free to be as specific or broad as they want when writing anti-discrimination laws. If they want to write it narrowly to just include pot smokers then they can do so. If they want to broaden their anti-discrimination laws to include both pot smokers and knuckleheads who roll coal, then they are free to do that as well. As of now they haven't, so you are still free to discriminate against emissions scofflaws in hiring.

[ken_sylvania]

You can certainly turn such a person in. And forbid them from using such a pickup on the job. And if you turn him in and he is arrested then you could refuse to hire him on the grounds that he is a criminal.

And you can probably refuse to hire them too. I don't know of any state that has made it illegal to discriminate against knuckleheads who are "rolling coal" or otherwise illegally modifying their vehicles. The law in Washington is specific to pot smoking (which is legal behavior) and not illegally modifying vehicles (which is illegal behavior).

21 U.S.C. § 844 prohibits possession of non-medical marijuana. So yes, pot smoking is a federal crime.

Yes, but since 2014, Congress has approved a budget amendment that prohibits the Department of Justice from using its funds to prevent states from implementing their medical marijuana laws. Known as the Rohrabacher-Farr amendment. Look it up. So Congress has prohibited the Justice Department from enforcing the provisions of the law that you just cited.

Congress hasn't prohibited the Justice Department or states from enforcing emissions laws. So there is a difference.

And it any event, states are free to be as specific or broad as they want when writing anti-discrimination laws. If they want to write it narrowly to just include pot smokers then they can do so. If they want to broaden their anti-discrimination laws to include both pot smokers and knuckleheads who roll coal, then they are free to do that as well. As of now they haven't, so you are still free to discriminate against emissions scofflaws in hiring.

It's still illegal to possess marijuana even if Congress won't let the Justice Department enforce it. And I think it's poor policy to prohibit employers from discriminating against scofflaws.

[Josh]

So you’re telling me it would be illegal to have in your employee handbook, “Employees may not break federal laws”?

[Ken]

So you’re telling me it would be illegal to have in your employee handbook, “Employees may not break federal laws”?

My guess would be that you can put anything you want in your employment handbook. It is just a book and doesn't carry any legal weight. You could fill it with Japanese anime or the Unabomber Manifesto if you wanted.

But what you cannot do is discriminate against someone in violation of state law. In Washington that includes someone who smokes pot on their own time away from work. So you couldn't enforce any provisions of your employment handbook in a manner that violated state law.

[steve-in-kville]

You could fill it with Japanese anime or the Unabomber Manifesto if you wanted.

I'm stealing that quote for a future thread title

[steve-in-kville]

But yes, I don’t want any potheads working for me. Drugs usually do NOT stay in just someone’s personal life.

Unfortunately, due to state laws, people with weed cards seem to be getting some leniency at employers that had no tolerance for it previously.