200 Mass shootings in 127 Days

[Sliceitup]

... a growing lack of connection to community and each other.

i think that is the root cause. and of course, access to guns combined w the root cause of lack of connection to each other is a recipe for disaster.
the question is, which is easier to fix?
access to guns needs to be controlled, it can't be fixed
connection to each other needs to be fixed, not controlled. control and connection don't mix.

i think maybe i might just have talked myself into understanding why gun control is such a hot topic. side #1 says: don't make me give up my guns, i don't want to be controlled. but i don't want to work on my relationships either. and side 2 says: i'm not putting in the effort to fix relationships, i like control, so lets focus on gun control. you need to give up your guns.

I really struggle with the idea that our country specifically would have relationship/community issues in numbers so much larger than other countries. I’m not saying it’s not a problem here, just that it likely exists in many places.

I’ve come to see it as basically a “means and motive” issue. I think maybe with mass shooters one of the ways to sum up their motive is “a desire for death, coupled with intense anger or apathy towards humanity.” The means to follow up with violence are unfortunately too easy to access.

[justme]

and side 2 says: i'm not putting in the effort to fix relationships, i like control, so lets focus on gun control. you need to give up your guns.

I think there are some who believe that, but I would argue that’s different from the belief that there need to be some reasonable restrictions on the availability to buy and possess guns. I don’t think that’s just about control.

True. i can agree with that also.

its just that reasonable restrictions mean different things to different people.

[Szdfan]

and side 2 says: i'm not putting in the effort to fix relationships, i like control, so lets focus on gun control. you need to give up your guns.

I think there are some who believe that, but I would argue that’s different from the belief that there need to be some reasonable restrictions on the availability to buy and possess guns. I don’t think that’s just about control.

True. i can agree with that also.

its just that reasonable restrictions mean different things to different people.

Absolutely. This is why compromise and consensus building through a political process is so important. However, compromise and consensus are almost is almost impossible during times of extreme polarization like what we’re going through.

I think polarization is a symptom of the same kind of alienation that’s contributing to these mass shootings.

[Szdfan]

... a growing lack of connection to community and each other.

i think that is the root cause. and of course, access to guns combined w the root cause of lack of connection to each other is a recipe for disaster.
the question is, which is easier to fix?
access to guns needs to be controlled, it can't be fixed
connection to each other needs to be fixed, not controlled. control and connection don't mix.

i think maybe i might just have talked myself into understanding why gun control is such a hot topic. side #1 says: don't make me give up my guns, i don't want to be controlled. but i don't want to work on my relationships either. and side 2 says: i'm not putting in the effort to fix relationships, i like control, so lets focus on gun control. you need to give up your guns.

I really struggle with the idea that our country specifically would have relationship/community issues in numbers so much larger than other countries. I’m not saying it’s not a problem here, just that it likely exists in many places.

I’ve come to see it as basically a “means and motive” issue. I think maybe with mass shooters one of the ways to sum up their motive is “a desire for death, coupled with intense anger or apathy towards humanity.” The means to follow up with violence are unfortunately too easy to access.

I agree that a lot of societies probably deal with the same problems that the US does. All societies have alienated, mentally ill, angry and sociopathic people who are a danger to themselves and others. I think one of the main differences is that it’s a lot easier for these people to obtain high powered weapons than in other countries.

There were two mass shootings in Serbia this past week. Part of what made it so shocking was that mass shootings have been incredibly rare in Serbia since the end of the civil war in Yugoslavia.

[Sudsy]

Looking at causes of increased violence I think this is a reaping of what has been sown over more recent years. When killings are glorified the way they are on TV, video games and movie theaters, the affect on how life is not treated as sacred will naturally influence a certain number of people. Just like watching sex movies and advertisements, what we allow into our thoughts will have it's influence. But as long as these make money they likely will not get restrictions.

I'm somewhat surprised things have not got worse in mass killings sooner than they have.

I thought this was interesting from Bahai teachings -

https://bahaiteachings.org/effects-viol ... -tv-shows/

[Szdfan]

Looking at causes of increased violence I think this is a reaping of what has been sown over more recent years. When killings are glorified the way they are on TV, video games and movie theaters, the affect on how life is not treated as sacred will naturally influence a certain number of people. Just like watching sex movies and advertisements, what we allow into our thoughts will have it's influence. But as long as these make money they likely will not get restrictions.

I'm somewhat surprised things have not got worse in mass killings sooner than they have.

I thought this was interesting from Bahai teachings -

https://bahaiteachings.org/effects-viol ... -tv-shows/

I think there are probably several overlapping reasons why mass shootings are a problem in the US. To borrow one of Robert’s arguments, most people who watch violent TV or play violent video games don’t end up shooting people.

I do think that something has gone wrong in our society, I’m just not convinced that it’s as simple as a single cause.

[Robert]

To borrow one of Robert’s arguments, most people who watch violent TV or play violent video games don’t end up shooting people.

And most people with guns do not do these things either.

Western culture is loosing the value of life. In individualism, life is the core and central part of the individual. Life is precise. When large governments take control, the individual life means very little. Systems and structures are more important because that is what it needs to keep control.

Violence has now become the primary way many see in promoting their ideology or taking power. People no longer believe that the pen is mightier than the sword. Most protests turn into riots because of this. Mass shootings are way of expressing oneself now and a way to become famous and known.

[Jazman]

To borrow one of Robert’s arguments, most people who watch violent TV or play violent video games don’t end up shooting people.

And most people with guns do not do these things either.

Western culture is loosing the value of life. In individualism, life is the core and central part of the individual. Life is precise. When large governments take control, the individual life means very little. Systems and structures are more important because that is what it needs to keep control.

Violence has now become the primary way many see in promoting their ideology or taking power. People no longer believe that the pen is mightier than the sword. Most protests turn into riots because of this. Mass shootings are way of expressing oneself now and a way to become famous and known.

I would argue, as do other historically marginalized groups, that "Western culture" (yes, even in its Judeo/Christian guise) has often failed to value life, more than it values property/profit/individualism... we just happen to be experiencing another aspect of its centuries long devaluation of life of one kind or another. Maybe it's just more random now. In the past it was certain designated outgroups; heathens, the un-'elect', etc... All part of the imago Dei that many 'christian' Westerns considered disposable/usable/mere means to their ends. (and just because atheist/Marxists may have been a tad worse, doesn't excuse Western culture and its warped / imperfect valuing of life). Some would argue that we are now reaping because of that past and one of our idols is now fully turned on us and is exacting its dues...
And oddly or maybe not, as I've observed and experienced first hand, the 'christian' west in this country (maybe they're actually being true to character) happens to be the group most invested in maintaining and propping up the idol...

[MaxPC]

On a positive note - paraphrase - Romans 5:20

“For wherever sin exists in abundance and is multiplying and constantly expanding, that is precisely the time and place where grace is poured out in a far greater, surpassing quantity.”

I can look at the situation with doom and gloom or rather be excited and ready to be involved in this time where grace abounds. I talked with a fellow believer yesterday and he spoke the often quoted phrase regarding the state of the world saying 'come Lord Jesus'. And as much as I look forward to that day of His return and a new heaven and new earth, seeing grace being poured out as sin increases is also an exciting thought and one to be involved in.

Indeed and amen.

[Robert]

I would argue, as do other historically marginalized groups, that "Western culture" (yes, even in its Judeo/Christian guise) has often failed to value life, more than it values property/profit/individualism

My point is individualism values life while collectivism/communism/socialism does not.