Define: “Woman”

[Ken]

How do you feel about marriage? According to Wikipedia:

As of November 2019, 38 states have set an absolute minimum marriage age by statute, which vary between 14 and 17. In the remaining states, minors can marry with parental consent, and legal exceptions may exist which allow underage marriage, mostly requiring both parental and judicial authorization, which is often allowed only in cases of pregnancy. 16 states do not have a legal minimum marriage age when judicial exceptions are taken into account. Although in these states there is no set minimum age by statute, the traditional common law minimum age is 14 for boys and 12 for girls - ages which have been confirmed by case law in some states.

In 18 states, children under 16 can marry. Over the past 15 years, more than 200,000 minors married in US, and in Tennessee girls as young as 10 were married in 2001, before the state set a minimum age of 17 in 2018.

Which raises the question in my mind if any of this happens in conservative Mennonite and Amish communities? I honestly don't know the answer. Has there ever been any tradition or tolerance of underage marriage in the Mennonite or Amish churches?

Back when parental consent was required for young folks to marry under the age of 21 in PA, it was traditional for Mennonite parents to refuse official consent. If young folks wanted to marry younger they would go to Maryland.

That is good to hear. My impression is that tolerance of child marriage has been more of a rural southern thing in the US. It has never remotely been a thing in my more mainstream and moderately conservative Mennonite extended clan. But I'm no expert in customs and practices of every sect and branch of Anabaptism.

[Judas Maccabeus]

How do you feel about marriage? According to Wikipedia:

As of November 2019, 38 states have set an absolute minimum marriage age by statute, which vary between 14 and 17. In the remaining states, minors can marry with parental consent, and legal exceptions may exist which allow underage marriage, mostly requiring both parental and judicial authorization, which is often allowed only in cases of pregnancy. 16 states do not have a legal minimum marriage age when judicial exceptions are taken into account. Although in these states there is no set minimum age by statute, the traditional common law minimum age is 14 for boys and 12 for girls - ages which have been confirmed by case law in some states.

In 18 states, children under 16 can marry. Over the past 15 years, more than 200,000 minors married in US, and in Tennessee girls as young as 10 were married in 2001, before the state set a minimum age of 17 in 2018.

Which raises the question in my mind if any of this happens in conservative Mennonite and Amish communities? I honestly don't know the answer. Has there ever been any tradition or tolerance of underage marriage in the Mennonite or Amish churches?

Back when parental consent was required for young folks to marry under the age of 21 in PA, it was traditional for Mennonite parents to refuse official consent. If young folks wanted to marry younger they would go to Maryland.

Maryland is 18. No blood test either, witch used to take tie in New York. People used to come down on the train. First stop in maryland is Elkton. Used to have "wedding chapels" there.

J.M.

[Joy]

Entomology of woman is womb man: human with a womb.

Are you trying to bug us??

[Josh]

I wonder how this august forum would feel about Joseph and Mary

[temporal1]

I wonder how this august forum would feel about Joseph and Mary

i don’t know how the forum would respond, but, the western world would counsel Mary to not tell her parents or Joseph, but rely on government support+funding to secretly secure an abortion.

taxpayer dollars are pirated to undermine families, to altogether ignore minor/dependent status.
in my view, all of this should be criminal, with harsh penalties.

if it were not gov sanctioned and funded, it would be criminal.
if a private citizen did such a thing to a minor (or “for” a minor) it would be criminal.

there is tremendous “magic” in gov’s ability to sanitize crime/sin, and, make it highly profitable for those carrying out the actions. this is not an accident or incompetence, it’s the result of powerful lobbies influencing laws of the land. it’s a huge deliberate effort.

none of this is done “pro-bono.” therein lies a big clue, ya’ll.

Mary was not a full-grown woman.

[temporal1]

It’s a puzzle why God designed human reproductive systems to develop BEFORE overall human maturity to match, but, that’s reality. These things do NOT match.

It’s incumbent upon families and societies to protect children and teens, from themselves, and from others.

[JimFoxvog]

Mary was not a full-grown woman.

We do not know that. All we know is that it is likely that she had reached the acceptable age for marriage in her culture. Her response to the angel sounds mature.

[temporal1]

Mary was not a full-grown woman.

We do not know that. All we know is that it is likely that she had reached the acceptable age for marriage in her culture. Her response to the angel sounds mature.

It was a miracle.
Children and teens can be remarkably insightful. “From the mouths of babes” ..
That does not equate to being adults. Children can be superior to adults. Jesus thought so.

That does not make them adults.

[Josh]

Mary was not a full-grown woman.

We do not know that. All we know is that it is likely that she had reached the acceptable age for marriage in her culture. Her response to the angel sounds mature.

It was a miracle.
Children and teens can be remarkably insightful. “From the mouths of babes” ..
That does not equate to being adults. Children can be superior to adults. Jesus thought so.

That does not make them adults.

Maybe you should define “adult”. The modern world defines of age 18. Ancient Jewish culture had a rather different view.

[temporal1]

We do not know that. All we know is that it is likely that she had reached the acceptable age for marriage in her culture. Her response to the angel sounds mature.

It was a miracle.
Children and teens can be remarkably insightful. “From the mouths of babes” ..
That does not equate to being adults. Children can be superior to adults. Jesus thought so.

That does not make them adults.

Maybe you should define “adult”.
The modern world defines of age 18. Ancient Jewish culture had a rather different view.

In the OP, i’m trying to point out how current legal language is SLIDING in ways that erode or remove legal definitions in the modern world, 18, or 21, depending. i don’t want to see this, for several reasons.

In the OP, notice how pregnant children and teens are inexplicably described as “women.”
this incorrect label is being used to remove legal protections of children and parents’ rights.
this is my protest.

throughout history, even U.S. history, without benefit of contemporary medical science, children were viewed differently in different cultural settings. that’s just fact. even today, cultures vary.

however, just as pregnancy does not transform a child or teen into a woman, neither does a marriage certificate, military registration, or cultural norms/views.

“woman” is a mature female. babies are female. they are not women.