Dangerous Calling

[Wade]

I agree with that. Any thoughts on what makes us lose respect for our leaders? Is it their actions, our character problems or a mixture of both? Or something else entirely?

I think how we view leaders is much at the core of the problem. People say they will go ask their Pastor when someone has a question and haven't really spent the time to learn themselves, some say the are not qualified to lead out a bible study, some say they weren't ordained to preach so they don't bother to share the good news publicly, and etc. If we fall into these types of mindsets we are likely expecting too much from a leader in doing our work for us and we will get frustrated.

A way for leaders to handle this is to place a bit more responsibility on people. An example: I received an email some time ago about an upcoming Sunday school lesson and this persons mass disappointment in it. I think he was so upset he was ready to divide... I really couldn't understand his perspective very well and so I ended up asking him to lead out since he had spent more time looking at it than me. The calm reply and shift of responsibility resulted in slowing down to think, and then he apologize. Sunday school went smoothly as we came into it with a better perspective on what we should expect from one another. The original email was a cause of a bit of stress and some sincere prayers but I am grateful this brother was willing to speak up in the first place - I let him know I was glad too.

I believe it is critical for a leader to find ways to get people involved.

I ask the people we fellowship with if they are comfortable with things and if I should change anything I am doing to better glorify Christ? Even if they don't have any insight I have noticed just me asking this changes their demeanor in how we relate to one another.

The high lighted sentence above would make a world of difference to me. I resent being blown off.

Sorry to hear that.
If you were here you might be saying like what others are implying - that I don't step in enough...

[temporal1]

OP, Page 1. July 30, 2019:

In 2012 Paul Tripp published a book titled. "Dangerous Calling - Confronting the Unique Challenges of Pastoral Ministry".
Ironically the promo blurbs on the back cover of the first edition feature 5 pastors - 3 of which have subsequently been disgraced by significant sin or falling away from the faith. One of those was Josh Harris which is what caught my attention due to the recent news.

In addition to those three disgraced pastors on the cover of the book, (James MacDonald, Josh Harris, Tullian Tchividjian) there have been a rash of others in the past couple years such as Mark Driscoll, Bill Hybels, Perry Noble, Darrin Patrick, Rob Bell, Andy Savage, and the list could go on and on. These are just some of the more well known ones in the evangelical world. There have been numerous scandals in the Catholic world and then we could go back to the Jim Bakker, Jimmy Swaggart, Ted Haggard, and other scandals of earlier times plus thousands of lessor known pastors whose failures didn't make the news but who did great damage to their churches and families.

And while it might be easy for us to point our fingers at the mega churches and other groups we in the Mennonite world seem to have our own share of these problems.

My question is, what is the problem? Why? What can we do to prevent it?

It’s been a month, it seems longer, ‘thought this thread might be useful for review.

[undershepherd]

Thanks for bumping this temporal1. And thanks to all of you who have responded.

[Ms. Izzie]

My question is, what is the problem? Why? What can we do to prevent it?

When this was asked it was in relation to well-known pastors becoming disgraced.

I have wondered about how our preachers, especially the popular ones, travel around preaching at different churches. Or even the not so well-known preachers who come for week or weekend meetings. Is there any accountability for what these preachers preach about? Should there be if there isn't any?

For example: Would it be possible for a Mennonite preacher who is having relationship problems with people in his church to go to a church where nobody really knows him and preach about how to do relationships? Does it matter if he would? What could happen to the heart of a preacher if he would do this?

This is just an example. I don't know if it has happened.

[RZehr]

Another way to look at it, is simply, who hasn’t had relationship problems? If someone hasn’t, I guess he can tell us how to not have problems, but how can he tell us how to repair or repent if he has never had to do so? The key for me, is that he actually has some knowledge on the matter and isn’t in a spat, but rather is at peace.

Unless there is a specific topic for him, I don’t think we tell preacher what they can or can’t preach about. If there is any concern, get someone else. And if he is worth his salt, he should refuse the request if he is in the middle of working through something.

[Ms. Izzie]

Another way to look at it, is simply, who hasn’t had relationship problems? If someone hasn’t, I guess he can tell us how to not have problems, but how can he tell us how to repair or repent if he has never had to do so? The key for me, is that he actually has some knowledge on the matter and isn’t in a spat, but rather is at peace.

Unless there is a specific topic for him, I don’t think we tell preacher what they can or can’t preach about. If there is any concern, get someone else. And if he is worth his salt, he should refuse the request if he is in the middle of working through something.

My example is simply that--an example of a preacher not being at peace on a subject and then traveling somewhere and giving a sermon on how to do what he himself hasn't learned yet. Would this be harmful in any way to him spiritually? And could it happen?

In your second paragraph, I hear you saying there is no accountability for a preacher who travels. He is on his own as far as what he does or says while he is gone. Thank you for answering my question on that.

[RZehr]

My example is simply that--an example of a preacher not being at peace on a subject and then traveling somewhere and giving a sermon on how to do what he himself hasn't learned yet. Would this be harmful in any way to him spiritually? And could it happen?

It could happen. It could happen knowingly, such as a preacher living in secret sin and still preachering on that sin. That would be harmful.
It could happen if the preacher is particularly interested in a certain topic, preaches on it, then years later with much more knowledge, thinks differently on the matter. This may or may not be as consequential.

In your second paragraph, I hear you saying there is no accountability for a preacher who travels. He is on his own as far as what he does or says while he is gone. Thank you for answering my question on that.

I think this is pretty much the case. You see trust is core. If you don’t trust a guy, instead of telling him what he can or can’t preach, just don’t have him preach. If he is a Godly man, I don’t see this freedom as a negative. The alternative might include squelching what he may feel the H.S. wants him to say, or it may include manipulative host preachers using him as a tool, telling him to preach for or against something.
If the program is public, and the church knows he was given the topic, they can listen according and know where the topic came from. Clarity should be practiced. In our churches, it is assumed that the visitor choose his own topic unless announced otherwise, either verbally or print.
I’d feel duped if a visitor spoke on a local divisive issue, and found out after the fact that our local preacher told him to.

[Ms. Izzie]

I agree with a lot of what you said. Maybe the accountability should lie more with the church that knows him best--his own.

[barnhart]

My question is, what is the problem? Why? What can we do to prevent it?

I think a major factor in burn out is unmet expectations. Sometime they may be legitimate expectations but often they were expectations (internal or put on by others) that shouldn't have been there in the first place.