Hindus, Muslims, and Christians

[Ken]

If they are truly alienated as you claim then they apparently have not learned to accept other people the way they are.

Alienated is perhaps a strong word. They still like him just fine. But their respect for him has diminished. This I know because our house is a favorite gathering place for band kids. During nice weather I sometimes set up an outdoor movie screen and projector and they come watch band movies and musicals and I overhear them.

And it's OK to have a reduced respect for a person who thinks the election was rigged, and also OK to have a reduced respect for a person who thinks they can change from being a man from being a woman. A person who understands that the election wasn't rigged shouldn't be forced to pretend that it was, and the person who understands that a man can't become a woman shouldn't have to refer to that man as "she."

He is hired to teach band. There are actual curriculum standards that attach to band just as there are for biology, English, and math. And they do not include covering the 2020 election or transgender policy or philosophy, regardless of where one comes down on either of those subjects.

When he is in class, he is not on his own time. He is being paid to teach band and not use the captive audience of students that he has to teach or promote anything else political, religious, or otherwise. This is basic pedagogy 101. Are there teachers who violate this rule or guideline? Of course. From all sides of the political and religious spectrum. And it is always a mistake unless the class in question is actually on that specific subject. Right now the pendulum has swung in the opposite direction and there are lefty teachers who are spouting anti-Israel, pro-Hamas nonsense in classes that have nothing to do with middle eastern affairs. This is equally wrong. And it will inevitably alienate students who don't share their views. So it is frankly dumb and bad teaching. There are also teachers who evangelize in class. And also those who denigrate religion. Both of those are equally wrong as well. This is all pretty simple.

[Josh]

I don’t see anything wrong with evangelising in class.

[Ken]

I don’t see anything wrong with evangelising in class.

What if the teacher is Mormon? Or Shia Muslim? or Church of Scientology? Or Westboro Baptist? Or an atheist intent on denigrating religion?

You good with your kids getting a dose of that every single day while they are a captive audience?

[Josh]

I don’t see anything wrong with evangelising in class.

What if the teacher is Mormon? Or Shia Muslim? or Church of Scientology? Or Westboro Baptist? Or an atheist intent on denigrating religion?

You good with your kids getting a dose of that every single day while they are a captive audience?

I don’t see anything wrong with evangelising for faith in Jesus and the Bible in class (or anywhere else).

[Ken]

I don’t see anything wrong with evangelising in class.

What if the teacher is Mormon? Or Shia Muslim? or Church of Scientology? Or Westboro Baptist? Or an atheist intent on denigrating religion?

You good with your kids getting a dose of that every single day while they are a captive audience?

I don’t see anything wrong with evangelising for faith in Jesus and the Bible in class (or anywhere else).

The founding fathers, Constitution, and courts disagree with you. As do a majority of Americans. If you want your children to have all their school lessons drenched in the specific religion of their teacher, that's what private schools are for.

[Josh]

What if the teacher is Mormon? Or Shia Muslim? or Church of Scientology? Or Westboro Baptist? Or an atheist intent on denigrating religion?

You good with your kids getting a dose of that every single day while they are a captive audience?

I don’t see anything wrong with evangelising for faith in Jesus and the Bible in class (or anywhere else).

The founding fathers, Constitution, and courts disagree with you. As do a majority of Americans. If you want your children to have all their school lessons drenched in the specific religion of their teacher, that's what private schools are for.

It is never wrong to share the good news of Jesus Christ through any means possible.

Incidentally, I now know of two public school employees who openly evangelise students and one quite successfully. (One is in the news in Amherst, the other is someone I casually know.) They recruit pupils to student led Bible studies and eventually to their church.

Lives are changed and turned around and the gospel’s power heals broken situations. The school district and administrators don’t have a problem with school employees who manage to take problem students and make the problems go away - or should I say, Jesus makes the problems go away.

[Ken]

I don’t see anything wrong with evangelising for faith in Jesus and the Bible in class (or anywhere else).

The founding fathers, Constitution, and courts disagree with you. As do a majority of Americans. If you want your children to have all their school lessons drenched in the specific religion of their teacher, that's what private schools are for.

It is never wrong to share the good news of Jesus Christ through any means possible.

Incidentally, I now know of two public school employees who openly evangelise students and one quite successfully. (One is in the news in Amherst, the other is someone I casually know.) They recruit pupils to student led Bible studies and eventually to their church.

Lives are changed and turned around and the gospel’s power heals broken situations. The school district and administrators don’t have a problem with school employees who manage to take problem students and make the problems go away - or should I say, Jesus makes the problems go away.

You never answered the question. Are you fine with Mormons, Muslims, Hindus, and Atheists doing the same exact thing in your children's 2nd grade classroom? Do you want them teaching your children that YOUR religion is a false religion because it is full of bigotry, intolerance, and sexism?

Or more generally, do you want to farm out or delegate to the state the religious instruction of your children?

[Bootstrap]

So then what's with these schools policies saying that they will accommodate requests for name and gender changes and keep private from the parents of the student involved?

If there is any record of this generated by the school then the parent is entitled to this information by law. The law is quite clear on that point. That does not mean it is the job or responsibility of the school to actively report to parents about everything that goes on in every classroom beyond the normal and usual communications home about grades, attendance, discipline, health issues and so forth. But if parents want that information they are entitled to it by law. This is the actual law in question (FERPA): https://www2.ed.gov/policy/gen/guid/fpc ... index.html

These same schools do notify parents if there are concerns about ADHD, if they get in a fight, if they need to start wearing deodorant, if they might need glasses, or if they are just not fitting in with other students. Parents don't have to actively contact their schools to ask if that is happening. And there may not be an official record of things that teachers tell parents about.

This seems like a really significant thing for parents to know. And they may have no idea there's anything to ask the schools about. Seems like schools should let parents know. Especially since the schools themselves are providing opportunities for children to explore these things in GSA and other settings. Especially if school counselors and GSA groups are helping children form an identity around these things.

[Bootstrap]

Or more generally, do you want to farm out or delegate to the state the religious instruction of your children?

So ... are you saying that the school system needs to actively respect the religion of the parents? And the way they choose to raise their children?

[Ken]

Or more generally, do you want to farm out or delegate to the state the religious instruction of your children?

So ... are you saying that the school system needs to actively respect the religion of the parents? And the way they choose to raise their children?

Public schools should not be doing any religious instruction one way or the other.

But they should accommodate the sincere religious beliefs of all their students and student's families in a reasonable manner. This already happens for mainstream Christian students. We typically have 2 weeks off for Christmas and Good Friday is typically an informal school holiday. Around here it is always a scheduled no school day (teacher work day or snow makeup day). School events are typically never scheduled on Sundays. We should do the same for children from families of other faiths. Accommodate Jewish, Muslim, and Hindu holidays by allowing for excused absences or accommodating them during the school day which is how we do it.

It also means allowing parents to opt out of lessons that they object to on the basis of faith. Typically this happens in health class and there will be students pulled out of the whole sex ed curriculum or just the small part of it that addresses LGBT issues. They will have to do some alternative assignment to get credit. They can't pull completely out of health and meet the state's graduation requirements so they would have to find some alternative. Around here schools are flexible about that. I keep expecting to have that happen during units on evolution during biology class but that has never once happened to me in either the Baptist heartland of Waco TX or here in Washington.

What this DOESN'T mean is giving parents a veto over what other children learn or do in school. Especially since curriculum at every level from K-12 is something that is painstakingly developed through long public processes starting with state boards of education that develop curriculum standards and local school boards who determine which materials to adopt and how to teach to those standards. The place to have your voice heard is DURING this public process when there are endless opportunities for public comment and input, and not after the fact.

So no, we don't allow the odd parent to object and veto an entire curriculum for the entire school that was developed through a long and extensive public process. We do let them opt their children out if they so wish. Likewise, we accommodate Muslim students during Ramadan by giving them space in some empty conference room to meet and do their prayers. But we don't shut down the cafeteria for all students during Ramadan just because there are a few students who may be fasting for religious reasons. We allow Muslim girls to wear head scarves, but we don't mandate them for all students because this isn't Iran or Saudi Arabia.

That is the balance that schools need to find. Do they get it wrong sometimes? Of course. These are continually moving targets and schools are being pulled in a lot of directions at once. For example, I have read about some school districts in Virginia that don't have opt-out procedures for some sex-ed lessons. Big mistake in my mind and it only causes unnecessary strife and friction in the community. Here in Washington State the opt-out procedures are mandated by state law so districts have no choice in the matter. Which is as it should be.