Mennonite in Supreme Court Case?

[Z_DC]

I'm just curious about the court case on religious freedom being heard by the Supreme Court this coming Tuesday. The issue is regarding a postal worker in southern Lancaster County, Gerald Groff, who refused to work on Sundays. The link below indicates he was a former Mennonite missionary. Does anyone know if he is still a Mennonite?

https://www.hcamag.com/us/specializatio ... ion/442806

[Soloist]

Now that is interesting, my first job as a nurse was a Thursday through Sunday position. I took it because I had arranged a long term shift trade with another nurse. They knew I would quit if it ever fell through and they still hired me. I ended up quitting when that fell through but I stayed there nearly a year as a sub nurse basically working full time. Now I just refuse and in home health it works out decent enough.

[Soloist]

It was also the reason Wilcox farms didn’t hire me they claimed to not hire me because I didn’t know how to repair tractors. They hired a friend of mine, who also didn’t know how to repair tractors but was willing to work on Sunday.

[Ken]

I'm willing to bet that when he does his Sunday postal deliveries in Lancaster County he passes hundreds of Mennonite and Amish dairy farms where Amish and Mennonite farmers are busy at work feeding and milking cows 2 or 3 times per day including Sundays.

And I'm willing to bet that those same Amish and Mennonite farmers, if they have a farm accident or car accident or family member in labor, they won't wait until Monday morning but instead will rush to the local hospital and expect that there are doctors and nurses working there on Sunday to take care of them.

No one really wants to work on Sunday. I know that I don't. But it is unfair to expect others to pick up your slack if you are in a job for which it is a requirement. My wife has Sunday call once a month. She would be extremely unhappy if that went up to twice a month because she had co-workers who didn't want to work on Sunday. If an employer is going to make Sunday work optional, then it should be equally optional for everyone, not just those who cite a religious reason. The single mother who's kids are home and not at school in Sunday. The dad who wants to coach and attend his kid's games on Sunday. The pro-football fan who wants to watch the NFL on Sunday. The golfer who's friends have a regular Sunday golf game. The equitable First Amendment approach would be to give all workers the same equitable treatment and not to expect one group to pick up the slack for another, regardless of the reason.

Also Sunday mail delivery is not actually a completely new thing. It was the norm for the first 100 years in this country. Canceling mail delivery on Sundays came in the late 19th Century as part of a wave of Protestant anti-Catholic legislation that did things like implement Blue Laws across the country targeted at Catholics. Ending Sunday mail delivery itself came about as sort of a one-time alliance between organized labor (who wanted a 6-day work week) and Protestant ministers: https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/ ... 12/281370/

[Valerie]

I'm willing to bet that when he does his Sunday postal deliveries in Lancaster County he passes hundreds of Mennonite and Amish dairy farms where Amish and Mennonite farmers are busy at work feeding and milking cows 2 or 3 times per day including Sundays.

And I'm willing to bet that those same Amish and Mennonite farmers, if they have a farm accident or car accident or family member in labor, they won't wait until Monday morning but instead will rush to the local hospital and expect that there are doctors and nurses working there on Sunday to take care of them.

No one really wants to work on Sunday. I know that I don't. But it is unfair to expect others to pick up your slack. My wife has Sunday call once a month. She would be extremely unhappy if that went up to twice a month because she had co-workers who didn't want to work on Sunday.

Also Sunday mail delivery is not actually a completely new thing. It was the norm for the first 100 years in this country. Canceling mail delivery on Sundays came in the late 19th Century as part of a wave of Protestant anti-Catholic legislation that did things like implement Blue Laws across the country targeted at Catholics. Ending Sunday mail delivery itself came about as sort of a one-time alliance between organized labor (who wanted a 6-day work week) and Protestant ministers: https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/ ... 12/281370/

Amish and Mennonite are about the only people left in our country that still honor the Lord's Day as the Lord's day for the most part.

They will not do business on Sundays, that's different than applying scriptures regarding milking your cows and necessary duties so I don't put those in the same category as conducting business or working at a job that requires you to work on sunday. Jesus made it clear that Mercy is to be applied when the Pharisees accused him of working on the Sabbath so he made that distinction but never conveyed to not make the Lord's Day a Holy Day. I think it is awesome that the Anabaptist people represent a remnant of people that still honor the Lord's Day the way they do. I grew up when most things were closed on sunday. I was a child when the local mall started opening up at 12:00 on sundays. This was surprising to people but at least people were able to still go to church and it was assumed most did. Now the Lord's day is not treated any differently than any other day of the week

When i was hired at present job i said only time i wasn't available is Sunday. . This meant i work every Saturday. Most i work with don't attend Church. It doesn't matter to them if you don't want to work on the Lord's day don't apply for jobs that would possibly require you to do so it's that simple. When the man originally hired in at the postal service the postal service didn't used to work on Sundays right?

[Ken]

I'm willing to bet that when he does his Sunday postal deliveries in Lancaster County he passes hundreds of Mennonite and Amish dairy farms where Amish and Mennonite farmers are busy at work feeding and milking cows 2 or 3 times per day including Sundays.

And I'm willing to bet that those same Amish and Mennonite farmers, if they have a farm accident or car accident or family member in labor, they won't wait until Monday morning but instead will rush to the local hospital and expect that there are doctors and nurses working there on Sunday to take care of them.

No one really wants to work on Sunday. I know that I don't. But it is unfair to expect others to pick up your slack. My wife has Sunday call once a month. She would be extremely unhappy if that went up to twice a month because she had co-workers who didn't want to work on Sunday.

Also Sunday mail delivery is not actually a completely new thing. It was the norm for the first 100 years in this country. Canceling mail delivery on Sundays came in the late 19th Century as part of a wave of Protestant anti-Catholic legislation that did things like implement Blue Laws across the country targeted at Catholics. Ending Sunday mail delivery itself came about as sort of a one-time alliance between organized labor (who wanted a 6-day work week) and Protestant ministers: https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/ ... 12/281370/

Thomas and Mennonite are about the only people left in our country that still honor the Lord's Day as the Lord's day for the most part.

They will not do business on Sundays, that's different than applying scriptures regarding milking your cows and necessary duties so I don't put those in the same category is conducting business or working at a job that requires you to work on sunday. Jesus made it clear that Mercy is to be applied when the Pharisees accused him of working on the Sabbath so he made that distinction but never conveyed to not make the Lord's Day a Holy Day. I think it is awesome that the anabaptist people represent a remnant of people that still honor the Lord's Day the way they do. I grew up when most things were closed on sunday. I was a child when the local mall started opening up at 12:00 on sundays. This was surprising to people but at least people were able to still go to church and it was assumed most did. Now the Lord's day is not treated any differently than any other day of the week

Sure, that's fine. He is just in the wrong job then. The issue isn't working on Sundays. It is holding down a job that has mandatory Sunday hours and then expecting others to cover your slack every single week. Unfortunately the terms of his job changed on him and the Sunday mail delivery is a relatively new thing. But job requirements change all the time and he had no lifetime employment contract guaranteeing him Sunday's off.

He is telling his co-workers that "my religious reasons for taking Sunday off trump your personal reasons, whatever they may be."

[Valerie]

I'm willing to bet that when he does his Sunday postal deliveries in Lancaster County he passes hundreds of Mennonite and Amish dairy farms where Amish and Mennonite farmers are busy at work feeding and milking cows 2 or 3 times per day including Sundays.

And I'm willing to bet that those same Amish and Mennonite farmers, if they have a farm accident or car accident or family member in labor, they won't wait until Monday morning but instead will rush to the local hospital and expect that there are doctors and nurses working there on Sunday to take care of them.

No one really wants to work on Sunday. I know that I don't. But it is unfair to expect others to pick up your slack. My wife has Sunday call once a month. She would be extremely unhappy if that went up to twice a month because she had co-workers who didn't want to work on Sunday.

Also Sunday mail delivery is not actually a completely new thing. It was the norm for the first 100 years in this country. Canceling mail delivery on Sundays came in the late 19th Century as part of a wave of Protestant anti-Catholic legislation that did things like implement Blue Laws across the country targeted at Catholics. Ending Sunday mail delivery itself came about as sort of a one-time alliance between organized labor (who wanted a 6-day work week) and Protestant ministers: https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/ ... 12/281370/

Thomas and Mennonite are about the only people left in our country that still honor the Lord's Day as the Lord's day for the most part.

They will not do business on Sundays, that's different than applying scriptures regarding milking your cows and necessary duties so I don't put those in the same category is conducting business or working at a job that requires you to work on sunday. Jesus made it clear that Mercy is to be applied when the Pharisees accused him of working on the Sabbath so he made that distinction but never conveyed to not make the Lord's Day a Holy Day. I think it is awesome that the anabaptist people represent a remnant of people that still honor the Lord's Day the way they do. I grew up when most things were closed on sunday. I was a child when the local mall started opening up at 12:00 on sundays. This was surprising to people but at least people were able to still go to church and it was assumed most did. Now the Lord's day is not treated any differently than any other day of the week

Sure, that's fine. He is just in the wrong job then. The issue isn't working on Sundays. It is holding down a job that has mandatory Sunday hours and then expecting others to cover your slack every single week. Unfortunately the terms of his job changed on him and the Sunday mail delivery is a relatively new thing. But job requirements change all the time and he had no lifetime employment contract guaranteeing him Sunday's off.

He hired in when it was KNOWN the only day of the week the postal service didn't operate was on the Lord's day. It was a safe place for him to apply. I don't think it's fair and I hope he wins his case. It's not a matter of picking up the slack the average person could care less about working on Sundays unless their children are involved in sports which the last few decades seems to be important to play on Sundays

[Ken]

Thomas and Mennonite are about the only people left in our country that still honor the Lord's Day as the Lord's day for the most part.

They will not do business on Sundays, that's different than applying scriptures regarding milking your cows and necessary duties so I don't put those in the same category is conducting business or working at a job that requires you to work on sunday. Jesus made it clear that Mercy is to be applied when the Pharisees accused him of working on the Sabbath so he made that distinction but never conveyed to not make the Lord's Day a Holy Day. I think it is awesome that the anabaptist people represent a remnant of people that still honor the Lord's Day the way they do. I grew up when most things were closed on sunday. I was a child when the local mall started opening up at 12:00 on sundays. This was surprising to people but at least people were able to still go to church and it was assumed most did. Now the Lord's day is not treated any differently than any other day of the week

Sure, that's fine. He is just in the wrong job then. The issue isn't working on Sundays. It is holding down a job that has mandatory Sunday hours and then expecting others to cover your slack every single week. Unfortunately the terms of his job changed on him and the Sunday mail delivery is a relatively new thing. But job requirements change all the time and he had no lifetime employment contract guaranteeing him Sunday's off.

He hired in when it was KNOWN the only day of the week the postal service didn't operate was on the Lord's day. It was a safe place for him to apply. I don't think it's fair and I hope he wins his case. It's not a matter of picking up the slack the average person could care less about working on Sundays unless their children are involved in sports which the last few decades seems to be important to play on Sundays

He could pay his co-workers to take his Sunday shifts and we would quickly find out how much they value their Sundays. That would be an equitable free-market way of doing it. And we would actually find out if you are correct that the "average person could care less about working on Sundays".

[Valerie]

Sure, that's fine. He is just in the wrong job then. The issue isn't working on Sundays. It is holding down a job that has mandatory Sunday hours and then expecting others to cover your slack every single week. Unfortunately the terms of his job changed on him and the Sunday mail delivery is a relatively new thing. But job requirements change all the time and he had no lifetime employment contract guaranteeing him Sunday's off.

He hired in when it was KNOWN the only day of the week the postal service didn't operate was on the Lord's day. It was a safe place for him to apply. I don't think it's fair and I hope he wins his case. It's not a matter of picking up the slack the average person could care less about working on Sundays unless their children are involved in sports which the last few decades seems to be important to play on Sundays

He could pay his co-workers to take his Sunday shifts and we would quickly find out how much they value their Sundays. That would be an equitable free-market way of doing it. And we would actually find out if you are correct that the "average person could care less about working on Sundays".

We have about 80 employees at my store. As far as I know, I'm the only one besides one who doesn't work there anymore that said they were not available on Sunday. I miss a lot of things because I therefore am required to work on Saturdays. A lot of things I enjoyed doing before this job I can't do anymore but it's a choice I made to honor the Lord's Day and church is important to me. I have worked for other employees before on Sunday because I feel like that would be applying the Lord's teaching about applying Mercy on the Sabbath although Sunday is not the Sabbath it's the Lord's day I still appreciate and feel it's a good witness for people to see that there are those that honor the Lord's day as the Lord's day. I have never once in 8 and 1/2 years heard anyone complaining about me taking Sundays off. I still work 5 days a week

[Josh]

There are zero reasons (0) for the post office to be requiring anyone to work on Sundays. We get junk mail delivered 6 days a week. We can wait until Monday for the weekend's batch.