"Drunk in the Spirit"

Messages, Lectures and talks that relate, or connect to Anabapatist theology.
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Outsider
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Re: "Drunk in the Spirit"

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Sudsy wrote: Fri Feb 03, 2023 5:59 pm One of these are physical healings which are talked about often as being a certain percent healed. They are told to keep 'pressing in' to get full healing. Can't find any healings in scripture that were not completely 100% or they were not healed. Anyway, they do attract people who want to see signs and wonders and are open to all kinds of things that appear to be supernatural works of God.


Well, there is that time Jesus got the blind man half-healed, and had to daub more mud on his eyes before he was fully healed.

Mark 8
22 And they came to Bethsaida; and they bring to him a blind man, and they besought him that he would touch him.

23 And taking the blind man by the hand, he led him out of the town; and spitting upon his eyes, laying his hands on him, he asked him if he saw any thing.

24 And looking up, he said: I see men as it were trees, walking.
I guess if Jesus had to do a thing twice, a lesser man might have to work a bit harder to get something done. In today's world of weakened faith, one might have to "seek God diligently" to get the sought outcome. So I can see the reasoning.
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1 Peter 4:11
If any man speak, let him speak as the oracles of God;

Hebrews 1:14
Are not all angels ministering spirits sent to serve those who will inherit salvation?
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Re: "Drunk in the Spirit"

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Ken wrote: Fri Feb 03, 2023 6:18 pm Why aren't the old Mennonite ladies in in conservative Menno churches suddenly falling into the aisles and wreathing with the Spirit? Or jumping up and speaking in tongues in the middle of the service? Why don't we ever see that in Episcopal Churches or Lutheran Churches? Surely there is at least ONE good Christian in all those other churches who is going to be seized by the Holy Spirit on occasion if it is actually a real thing.
Maybe they don't want to do those things?

1 Corinthians 14:32
And the spirits of the prophets are subject to the prophets.
The Holy Spirit is not like a demon possession. The believer has the Spirit under his/her will.
2 x
1 Peter 4:11
If any man speak, let him speak as the oracles of God;

Hebrews 1:14
Are not all angels ministering spirits sent to serve those who will inherit salvation?
temporal1
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Re: "Drunk in the Spirit"

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Outsider:
.. The Holy Spirit is not like a demon possession.
The believer has the Spirit under his/her will.
No demons, no theatrics. (Put the mic down.) :-|
Outsider wrote: Fri Feb 03, 2023 3:10 am This is what happens when you ignore scripture and rely only on the Spirit.
Consider: https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?s ... ersion=DRA

https:/
Your OP referenced scripture:
1 Corinthians 14
Douay-Rheims 1899 American Edition
14 Follow after charity, be zealous for spiritual gifts; but rather that you may prophesy.
2 For he that speaketh in a tongue, speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man heareth. Yet by the Spirit he speaketh mysteries.
3 But he that prophesieth, speaketh to men unto edification, and exhortation, and comfort.
4 He that speaketh in a tongue, edifieth himself: but he that prophesieth, edifieth the church.
5 And I would have you all to speak with tongues, but rather to prophesy. For greater is he that prophesieth, than he that speaketh with tongues: unless perhaps he interpret, that the church may receive edification.
6 But now, brethren, if I come to you speaking with tongues, what shall I profit you, unless I speak to you either in revelation, or in knowledge, or in prophecy, or in doctrine?
7 Even things without life that give sound, whether pipe or harp, except they give a distinction of sounds, how shall it be known what is piped or harped?
8 For if the trumpet give an uncertain sound, who shall prepare himself to the battle?
9 So likewise you, except you utter by the tongue plain speech, how shall it be known what is said? For you shall be speaking into the air.
10 There are, for example, so many kinds of tongues in this world; and none is without voice.
11 If then I know not the power of the voice, I shall be to him to whom I speak a barbarian; and he that speaketh, a barbarian to me.
12 So you also, forasmuch as you are zealous of spirits, seek to abound unto the edifying of the church.
13 And therefore he that speaketh by a tongue, let him pray that he may interpret.
14 For if I pray in a tongue, my spirit prayeth, but my understanding is without fruit.
15 What is it then? I will pray with the spirit, I will pray also with the understanding; I will sing with the spirit, I will sing also with the understanding.
16 Else if thou shalt bless with the spirit, how shall he that holdeth the place of the unlearned say, Amen, to thy blessing? because he knoweth not what thou sayest.
17 For thou indeed givest thanks well, but the other is not edified.
18 I thank my God I speak with all your tongues.
19 But in the church I had rather speak five words with my understanding, that I may instruct others also; than ten thousand words in a tongue.
20 Brethren, do not become children in sense: but in malice be children, and in sense be perfect.
21 In the law it is written: In other tongues and other lips I will speak to this people; and neither so will they hear me, saith the Lord.
22 Wherefore tongues are for a sign, not to believers, but to unbelievers; but prophecies not to unbelievers, but to believers.
23 If therefore the whole church come together into one place, and all speak with tongues, and there come in unlearned persons or infidels, will they not say that you are mad?
24 But if all prophesy, and there come in one that believeth not, or an unlearned person, he is convinced of all, he is judged of all.
25 The secrets of his heart are made manifest; and so, falling down on his face, he will adore God, affirming that God is among you indeed.
26 How is it then, brethren? When you come together, every one of you hath a psalm, hath a doctrine, hath a revelation, hath a tongue, hath an interpretation: let all things be done to edification.
27 If any speak with a tongue, let it be by two, or at the most by three, and in course, and let one interpret.
28 But if there be no interpreter, let him hold his peace in the church, and speak to himself and to God.
29 And let the prophets speak, two or three; and let the rest judge.
30 But if any thing be revealed to another sitting, let the first hold his peace.
31 For you may all prophesy one by one; that all may learn, and all may be exhorted:
32 And the spirits of the prophets are subject to the prophets.
33 For God is not the God of dissension, but of peace: as also I teach in all the churches of the saints.
34 Let women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted them to speak, but to be subject, as also the law saith.
35 But if they would learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home. For it is a shame for a woman to speak in the church.
36 Or did the word of God come out from you? Or came it only unto you?
37 If any seem to be a prophet, or spiritual, let him know the things that I write to you, that they are the commandments of the Lord.
38 But if any man know not, he shall not be known.
39 Wherefore, brethren, be zealous to prophesy; and forbid not to speak with tongues.
40 But let all things be done decently, and according to order.
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Most or all of this drama, humiliation, wasted taxpayer money could be spared -
with even modest attempt at presenting balanced facts from the start.


”We’re all just walking each other home.”
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Re: "Drunk in the Spirit"

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temporal1 wrote: Fri Feb 03, 2023 10:34 pm
Outsider:
.. The Holy Spirit is not like a demon possession.
The believer has the Spirit under his/her will.
No demons, no theatrics. (Put the mic down.) :-|
I don't understand what you're trying to say. Are you agreeing that the Holy Spirit doesn't FORCE anyone to stand up in Church and start speaking in tongues, etc., or are you saying something else?

Ken seemed to be saying that people would be out of control, being compelled by the Spirit to act looney in Church services- which a good Christian wouldn't. If I'm wrong, Ken is free to correct my misconception.
0 x
1 Peter 4:11
If any man speak, let him speak as the oracles of God;

Hebrews 1:14
Are not all angels ministering spirits sent to serve those who will inherit salvation?
temporal1
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Re: "Drunk in the Spirit"

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Outsider wrote: Sat Feb 04, 2023 12:46 am
temporal1 wrote: Fri Feb 03, 2023 10:34 pm
Outsider:
.. The Holy Spirit is not like a demon possession.
The believer has the Spirit under his/her will.
No demons, no theatrics. (Put the mic down.) :-|
I don't understand what you're trying to say. Are you agreeing that the Holy Spirit doesn't FORCE anyone to stand up in Church and start speaking in tongues, etc., or are you saying something else? ..
Just that i agree it’s not about demon possession;
my reference to mics was about the OP video, with (pastors?) “overcome” with (??) dramatic displays, but not so overcome to stop them from clutching microphones and holding them to their mouths.

The Holy Spirit is of great importance in my faith experience, i’m a believer. Some things i see or read about .. are not of my experience.
40 But let all things be done decently, and according to order.
2 x
Most or all of this drama, humiliation, wasted taxpayer money could be spared -
with even modest attempt at presenting balanced facts from the start.


”We’re all just walking each other home.”
UNKNOWN
Ken
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Re: "Drunk in the Spirit"

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Outsider wrote: Sat Feb 04, 2023 12:46 am
temporal1 wrote: Fri Feb 03, 2023 10:34 pm
Outsider:
.. The Holy Spirit is not like a demon possession.
The believer has the Spirit under his/her will.
No demons, no theatrics. (Put the mic down.) :-|
I don't understand what you're trying to say. Are you agreeing that the Holy Spirit doesn't FORCE anyone to stand up in Church and start speaking in tongues, etc., or are you saying something else?

Ken seemed to be saying that people would be out of control, being compelled by the Spirit to act looney in Church services- which a good Christian wouldn't. If I'm wrong, Ken is free to correct my misconception.
What I arm saying is that I think there are many millions of devout Christians in other denominations who are open to having the Holy Spirit lead them in whatever direction he leads. Why is it that not ONE ever gets led into speaking in in unintelligible jibberish tongues or wreathing on the floor “drunk in the spirit” or any of the other theatrics that happen in these sort of Pentecostal churches?

Are the Pentecostals the only Christians on the planet who are actually being led by the Holy Spirit? They might think so. But I have my doubts. I think that is more proof of the opposite. That today in 2023 the Holy Spirit doesn’t actually lead people to speak in jibberish or wreath around on the floor in a facsimile of a grand mal seizure. Because if that was actually the case we would see devout Mennonites and Lutherans and Methodists who open themselves to the Holy Spirit doing it as well. At least a few of them here and there. I mean wouldn’t one would think?
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Re: "Drunk in the Spirit"

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temporal1 wrote: Sat Feb 04, 2023 1:04 am
Outsider wrote: Sat Feb 04, 2023 12:46 am
temporal1 wrote: Fri Feb 03, 2023 10:34 pm No demons, no theatrics. (Put the mic down.) :-|
I don't understand what you're trying to say. Are you agreeing that the Holy Spirit doesn't FORCE anyone to stand up in Church and start speaking in tongues, etc., or are you saying something else? ..
Just that i agree it’s not about demon possession;
my reference to mics was about the OP video, with (pastors?) “overcome” with (??) dramatic displays, but not so overcome to stop them from clutching microphones and holding them to their mouths.

The Holy Spirit is of great importance in my faith experience, i’m a believer. Some things i see or read about .. are not of my experience.
40 But let all things be done decently, and according to order.
Oh, OK. I see. I agree with all of that. I wasn't trying to make apologetics for the displays of disorder, btw.
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1 Peter 4:11
If any man speak, let him speak as the oracles of God;

Hebrews 1:14
Are not all angels ministering spirits sent to serve those who will inherit salvation?
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Re: "Drunk in the Spirit"

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Ken wrote: Sat Feb 04, 2023 1:06 am That today in 2023 the Holy Spirit doesn’t actually lead people to speak in jibberish or wreath around on the floor in a facsimile of a grand mal seizure.
OK. I get what you're saying. And I agree with the latter sentiment- as I don't recall anyone in the Bible getting a grand mal seizure when they received the Spirit.

However, the "jibberish" part, I take issue with. "Of men and Angels" - Paul says. Just because it isn't a human language doesn't mean it's without meaning. Who knows what tongue the Disciples were speaking in on Pentecost, wherein every man who heard them heard them in their native tongue. I wouldn't be so quick to judge that...
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1 Peter 4:11
If any man speak, let him speak as the oracles of God;

Hebrews 1:14
Are not all angels ministering spirits sent to serve those who will inherit salvation?
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Re: "Drunk in the Spirit"

Post by Swiss Bro »

Outsider wrote: Sat Feb 04, 2023 4:29 am
Ken wrote: Sat Feb 04, 2023 1:06 am That today in 2023 the Holy Spirit doesn’t actually lead people to speak in jibberish or wreath around on the floor in a facsimile of a grand mal seizure.
OK. I get what you're saying. And I agree with the latter sentiment- as I don't recall anyone in the Bible getting a grand mal seizure when they received the Spirit.

However, the "jibberish" part, I take issue with. "Of men and Angels" - Paul says. Just because it isn't a human language doesn't mean it's without meaning. Who knows what tongue the Disciples were speaking in on Pentecost, wherein every man who heard them heard them in their native tongue. I wouldn't be so quick to judge that...
We know exactly what tongues. Acts 2,8-11: The dialects and tongues of the Parthians, and Medes, and Elamites, and those who inhabit Mesopotamia, and Judaea, and Cappadocia, Pontus and Asia, both Phrygia and Pamphylia, Egypt, and the parts of Libya which adjoin Cyrene, and the Romans, both Jews and proselytes, Cretans and Arabians.

No jibberish.
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Re: "Drunk in the Spirit"

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Outsider wrote: Fri Feb 03, 2023 3:10 am This is what happens when you ignore scripture and rely only on the Spirit. Consider: https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?s ... ersion=DRA

So are you saying these groups are relying on the Holy Spirit?
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2Tim. 3:16,17 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.
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