Evangelizing to self-proclaimed "Gay Christians"?

When it just doesn't fit anywhere else.
silentreader
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Re: Evangelizing to self-proclaimed "Gay Christians"?

Post by silentreader »

Bootstrap wrote:
silentreader wrote:...acts on them...

What about Jesus' statement in:
Matthew 5:27-28English Standard Version (ESV)
Lust
27 “You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall not commit adultery.’ 28 But I say to you that everyone who looks at a woman with lustful intent has already committed adultery with her in his heart.
?
Here's how I understand this verse. The same word translated lust is used in the Septuagint in the commandment "thou shalt not covet thy neighbor's wife". It is also used when Jesus says he has set his heart on celebrating the last supper with the disciples. It means more than "feel attraction", it's more like "set your heart on", and it can refer to any desire - coveting your neighbor's ox or house, for instance - not just sexual desire. I think that's more than just feeling something, that's nursing the feeling and setting your heart on it. It's not wrong to notice a woman, but it's wrong to stare and dwell on it and feed on it.

Or as many country preachers put it, "you can't stop dogs from dropping by, but you can decide which ones to feed". I think that's biblical.
I agree with your definition, but Boot, if I was sensually attracted to something that God so clearly (IMO) declares illicit, and if I was to declare that as acceptable and perfectly normal for me, then I fear that I would be in a very dangerous position, perhaps even heading towards spiritual bondage.
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Bootstrap
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Re: Evangelizing to self-proclaimed "Gay Christians"?

Post by Bootstrap »

silentreader wrote:I agree with your definition, but Boot, if I was sensually attracted to something that God so clearly (IMO) declares illicit, and if I was to declare that as acceptable and perfectly normal for me, then I fear that I would be in a very dangerous position, perhaps even heading towards spiritual bondage.
Exactly.

And for me, that means that lusting after my neighbor's wife is the danger I need to avoid. Because I'm not at all tempted by her husband. Someone else may have to apply the same Scripture in the same way to the other spouse.
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Is it biblical? Is it Christlike? Is it loving? Is it true? How can I find out?
silentreader
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Re: Evangelizing to self-proclaimed "Gay Christians"?

Post by silentreader »

Bootstrap wrote:
silentreader wrote:I agree with your definition, but Boot, if I was sensually attracted to something that God so clearly (IMO) declares illicit, and if I was to declare that as acceptable and perfectly normal for me, then I fear that I would be in a very dangerous position, perhaps even heading towards spiritual bondage.
Exactly.

And for me, that means that lusting after my neighbor's wife is the danger I need to avoid. Because I'm not at all tempted by her husband. Someone else may have to apply the same Scripture in the same way to the other spouse.
Absolutely, I was in no way suggesting that this danger is exclusive to those with 'gay' attractions.
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temporal1
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Re: Evangelizing to self-proclaimed "Gay Christians"?

Post by temporal1 »

steve-in-kville wrote:Not trying to be a jerk... but I am really lost in that response. Being gay is a sin. Pure and simple. Why are we debating this? I was an addict at one time (tried to be a career alcoholic). Many can say that is an "illness" or "disease." Yes and no, it was a lot deeper than that.

I'll be banned from this place in the next 24 hours. I can see it.
the very few times any member was blocked from this site, they were first given counsel+warnings. no one wants to ban, it's a last resort, not taken lightly.

counsel+warnings come from admin/moderators, not general members.

i don't believe you're close to receiving even a first warning.
some discussions can become quite heated without (open) warning.

i'm not admin or mod. :-|
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Most or all of this drama, humiliation, wasted taxpayer money could be spared -
with even modest attempt at presenting balanced facts from the start.


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temporal1
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Re: Evangelizing to self-proclaimed "Gay Christians"?

Post by temporal1 »

OP, Page 1:
KingdomBuilder wrote:The title of this thread basically says it all.
I'm asking as a long time, dear friend of mine has had two somewhat recent developments of identity. First, she's identifying and practicing as a bisexual. Second, she's desiring to be a church-going Christian.
Surely this grieves me a lot, but what can I do? How can I be truth and light here?
one question about your plight.
on this forum, CM's sometimes describe different roles and relationships from the CM perspective.
one part of this is caution about mentoring or counseling the opposite sex. this makes me wonder if you're possibly attempting to take too much on (by yourself?)
you are saying she wants to be a church-going Christian. how to help her find females in a church group? .. or, consulting with church elders/pastor? the pastor's wife?

(i presume) she is confused about worldly messages that encourage, or demand, self-indulgence in the carnal? whereas, scriptures teach about the importance of self-control, and self-denial.
these are seriously competing choices, often not presented as choices, at all.

messages about how we are slaves of animal instincts are opposite of messages about how we are human, thus, we have choices. the former states we are fools not to indulge; the latter states our salvation depends on our ability to choose not to indulge, but to choose the higher path, with "everything to gain," not lose. the world denies+abhors the latter message.

today's world wants sexual sin to be "the exception" to human choice. it's definitely not.

attempting to have it both ways does not work. it will lead to confusion and misery.

one more thing.
we always want to see "God's results" from our actions in-the-moment.
often, this is not God's way. He uses us in His time, in His way, for His purposes.
if you do not sense your friend is getting your message .. do your best to share it, and model it, anyway. after that, it's truly the work of the Holy Spirit to determine outcomes. we can't honestly take credit.

when Truth gets through, the Holy Spirit deserves credit.
say and do the best you're able. then pray for the Holy Spirit to breathe life into it.

be prepared, it may take time, even years after you are parted, for these messages to come together for your friend. trust God's wisdom on the matter. you may or may not ever know the final outcome. trust, anyway.

as your friend witnesses your trust in the Holy Spirit, this, alone, may be the single weightiest message you will ever convey.

i hope you will find another, or others, that may be able to help your friend find direction+clarity.
this is a big burden to attempt to take on by yourself.
very important is that she wants to be a Christian and church member.
where there is life, there is hope. :D
0 x
Most or all of this drama, humiliation, wasted taxpayer money could be spared -
with even modest attempt at presenting balanced facts from the start.


”We’re all just walking each other home.”
UNKNOWN
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