Windows 10 system intermittent freeze problem

[Neto]

I have a strange issue that I have not 'yet' been able to track down.
It's a rebuild job, running an MSI B150m Pro-VDH motherboard. I installed a WD SATA SSD (this board doesn't have an M.2 slot - that started with the 250 chipset boards, at least for MSI). I do not think it ever froze up before I connected it to the internet in order to register Office 2019 Pro PLUS. I first re-ran the drivers for the board from the original disk, then noticed some things in the Device Manager, so I downloaded the latest drivers that MSI has up on their site for this model board. The Chipset driver install process paused to inform me that the drivers I was trying to install were older than the ones already installed. I went ahead and replaced them, because the image I use was created on a 300 chipset series board, and then updated on later boards (400, 500, & 600 chipsets). (I also ran the Memory Diagnostic on the system RAM, and everything checks out OK.)

I pulled the SSD and installed it in another system, running the same series board. Froze there too. I had previously taken an image of the SSD (after all of the drivers updates, etc. - Actually just this morning), so I applied that to another drive (an HDD), and started testing on that as well. Meanwhile, I ran Seagate's drive integrity tests on the SSD, all of which it passes.

So, the odd part. The image from the SSD has not (yet) failed (this HDD is installed in the re-built system, so no hardware difference other than the drive itself), and the SSD passes all of the tests I've run on it so far. Needless to say, I cannot figure out what I'm dealing with here. (And I've already surpassed the total billable time for a job like this, so now I'm "running on fumes".)

[Neto]

Update:
I ran the extended drive test on the SSD last night, and it passed.
I tested the original system with the HDD that was imaged off of the SSD again this morning (various times, while doing other work), and it continues to start normally every time. It has not yet did the freeze deal the SSD is doing.

So, all of my own testing indicates that the SSD is bad, while all of the Acronis True Image diagnostic tests (Seagate version) indicate that it is fine. To have a return/replacement request honored, it is generally expected that the tests show some type of failure. But what type of file corruption (due to a bad drive) would not be transferred from the image created from the bad drive to another drive? I would expect the issue to still be there, but so far there is no evidence of this.

I have downloaded the Western Digital version of Acronis TI, and also the WD Dashboard (diagnostic tool) this noon time, but I don't know if I'll be able to go up & do more testing, because my wife is taking care of our 2 year old grandson today, and she has a dental appointment this afternoon, so "Ba-ba" ('grandpa') will be staying with him.

[ohio jones]

I have downloaded the Western Digital version of Acronis TI, and also the WD Dashboard (diagnostic tool) this noon time, but I don't know if I'll be able to go up & do more testing, because my wife is taking care of our 2 year old grandson today, and she has a dental appointment this afternoon, so "Ba-ba" ('grandpa') will be staying with him.

I thought the little guy was in school?

[Neto]

I have downloaded the Western Digital version of Acronis TI, and also the WD Dashboard (diagnostic tool) this noon time, but I don't know if I'll be able to go up & do more testing, because my wife is taking care of our 2 year old grandson today, and she has a dental appointment this afternoon, so "Ba-ba" ('grandpa') will be staying with him.

I thought the little guy was in school?

The nine year old is in 4th grade. (Will be 10 next month.) This is the next one. Then there are twins, 8 months old, also boys. I was supposed to be getting the 2 year old to take a nap. Fat chance. He just wanted to play, and sing Twinkle, Twinkle Little Star, the words for which I cannot remember anymore - not all of them. (When I was in school I made up different words, for Earth Day or something. "Twinkle, twinkle, little star, How I wonder where you are. Used to shine up in the sky, Now smoke's all that meet my eye. Twinkle, twinkle ...." Now I can't remember the real words anymore.)

[Pelerin]

When you say freeze do you mean it freezes up permanently or hangs for a few seconds?

[Neto]

When you say freeze do you mean it freezes up permanently or hangs for a few seconds?

It stops responding momentarily. I haven't timed it, but it's a couple of minutes or so. The mouse still responds, in that you can move the pointer. Depending on what sort of action you attempt to take while it's frozen, it will perform that action when it recovers.

It often does this immediately, at the log in screen (lock screen). In that case you cannot enter the user password until it recovers, perhaps because it doesn't have the password blank selected, or because the process times out before it comes back on line.

I tend to think that the (new) SSD is bad/failing, but I think that I need to get some sort of fail test results in order to be able to get an RMA from Western Digital.

[Josh]

You can usually just RMA parts even without a failure report. That’s what I do. Out of curiosity what model is it (I might want to avoid that model in the future)?

The last SATA SSDs I bought were Crucial 500’s. NVM3, WD Black.

In a case like this I usually just start swapping parts until it works, RMA as much as I can, and toss anything out of warranty on the junk pile.

[Neto]

You can usually just RMA parts even without a failure report. That’s what I do. Out of curiosity what model is it (I might want to avoid that model in the future)?

The last SATA SSDs I bought were Crucial 500’s. NVM3, WD Black.

In a case like this I usually just start swapping parts until it works, RMA as much as I can, and toss anything out of warranty on the junk pile.

This job is a rebuild, after the business that purchased it new (Summer of 2017) had me pick it up to resell on consignment. The motherboard is a 150 chipset, MSI B150M Pro VDH. It is about 6 1/2 years old. I rebuilt it for a customer in KY. (So once I ship it, I will not be able to do any on-site troubleshooting.)

I suspect, however, that you are asking about the model of the SSD. Because this board was manufactured before they started putting the M.2 slots on the board, I had to use an SATA type SSD. It is the Western Digital model 1TB SATA III, 2.5” WD Blue SA510 #WDS100T3B0A. But I have used quite a few of them w/o any issues. (The only SSD that I've had come back as a failed drive was a Kingston, but while I still think that's a good brand, I now use only Western Digital SSDs.) I use the Western Digital M.2 NVMe SSDs any time I’m working with a board that has a slot for them.

Your trouble shooting approach is the same as what I do.

[I do have test equipment for PSUs, but it doesn't really seem to be helpful. The major issue I've seen with PSUs is that some develop an additional sensitivity to the power coming into them, that they automatically shut down the system, usually in an orderly fashion. But the businesses where I've had encountered that issue are all Amish-owned businesses, and none of them are on line power. I suspect it's the frequency (hertz) that is off on their generators. I had one case where a brand new Antec PSU was automatically shutting down the system after being powered up for some time. I changed out the motherboard on-site, because that's what it seemed to be from what ‘symptoms’ I observed. It did it again the next day. So I brought the whole system back to my shop, and ran it for several days solid, and it never shut down. That's when I thought of the PSU, because I'd already seen this issue with some that had been in service for 4 or so years. But never before with a brand new one. I put in another new one, and it was fine, no more shut-downs. I have been using that PSU in my own shop ever since, and it has never shut down. But of course I'm on line power.]

I tried several types of drivers updates first, ran memory diagnostics, then I pulled the SSD, and ran it on an identical MSI 150 chipset board. It froze there as well. So at that point I concluded that either the SSD (new) was bad, or something had become corrupted on the drive - system files. Well, there was also a third possibility, because before the issue appeared the first time, I had cleared the old HDD that was the main drive in the consigned computer, formatted it, and modified the location of the user's documents folder (and some others) and the Public Docs and Photos folders to be redirected to the secondary drive, the used HDD. So I thought that if that drive was failing, the system might freeze when it failed to be able to connect to those re-directed folders. So I changed the locations of those folders back to their defaults, and disconnected the secondary drive. Still froze.

Then I created an image of the SSD as a backup, and applied that image to a used HDD. Installed that in the computer, and it worked fine. I have watched it over some hours of operating time, during the last day and a half or so, and it has never frozen up.

Then I ran the Seagate Sea Tools diagnostics on the SSD, and it passes all of the tests. This afternoon I installed the Western Digital DashBoard diagnostic tool and ran both of the available drive tests. It passes both of them, no drive errors found.

So, the HDD ‘cloned’ from the SSD never freezes. (This is while installed in the very same computer in which the SSD was initially configured.) The SSD passes every diagnostic tool I have available, but continues to freeze up from time to time, for about a minute to 80 seconds. It also freezes on other computer boards. So my testing via substitution of components indicates that the SSD is bad, but all of the diagnostic tools say that it is fine. The fact that the HDD that was cloned off of the SSD never freezes indicates that there is no file corruption in either drive.

Where I’m at right now:
After running the WD diagnostics I got a notice that the new SSD’s firmware version was not the latest. Ran the update. Same problem. After that I ran Windows Updates, and it installed a half a dozen. At that point I was out of time, because we had a members’ meeting at the church house this evening. So I haven’t yet done more testing to see if it is still freezing. We’ll see tomorrow.

[Oh, the only hint I have as to what software issue might have caused it was that as far as I can recall, it NEVER froze during all of the initial configuration work. Then the customer told me that he’d also like to have Microsoft Office Pro, so I purchased a license from a Microsoft product discount store (SoftwareKeep), but they almost always substitute the Pro PLUS version for the normal Pro version, and I had purchased the 2019 version. I had forgotten that the 2019 Pro Plus version only authenticates with an internet connection, something I otherwise always do by telephone. So I had to connect it to the internet for that registration process. I first blocked Windows Update, then registered the Office product. It was only after that that I started seeing the freeze issue. But if that was the cause, then the cloned HDD should do it as well.]

[Neto]

Still doing the same thing.
Looking in the Event Log. See several errors to do with iaStorA. (Intel Rapid Storage Driver)
Is it logical that an SSD would do the freeze, and the HDD not?
Will try it this afternoon, to do what I saw on a u-tube video.
(Then the next step will be to order another SSD, I guess.)

[Josh]

Still doing the same thing.
Looking in the Event Log. See several errors to do with iaStorA. (Intel Rapid Storage Driver)
Is it logical that an SSD would do the freeze, and the HDD not?
Will try it this afternoon, to do what I saw on a u-tube video.
(Then the next step will be to order another SSD, I guess.)

What are the exact iastor errors? (If you install Intel Rapid Storage / RST, it should show you detailed error messages.)

If the SSD freezes but the HDD does not, I would guess the SSD has gone bad. How full was it? If customers keep their SSD at or near capacity it significantly shortens their life.