IQ by religion

[Sliceitup]

Maybe it makes a difference when it’s part of a comprehensive evaluation. I know they did the WISC-5 and the KTEA-3 with our kids. It was usually a multi day process. A few hours each day. Or once it was 5 hours straight, but that was an older child.

A WISC-R which I am familiar with is closer to 1 hour. The WISC-V is even faster if the examiner has the latest software based one that uses a tablet.

Back in the 50s/60s some schools administered them to basically every student.

Did they use the results in any way that was beneficial to the educational process? Or was it just a different way of doing standardized testing?

[temporal1]

Josh:
Back in the 50s/60s some schools administered them to basically every student.

i’m not sure if you’re correct or not, but this is as i remember.

School was based on MERIT, grades, accomplishments. I.Q. scores were important, but somewhat mysterious. Maybe controversial.

Schools i attended were religiously, culturally, racially, socio-economically mixed, teachers taught and graded based on merit.
Straight-A students carried weight and respect. U.S. schools led the world. (as i recall.) Most children-teens were in public schools, from poverty to local elite. It was about merit. No matter what was going on at home.

There weren’t many private schools or home schools, so nearly all students were in public schools.

Mid-60’s, things began to change. Strange things. Merit was altered. Instead of walking a half-mile to a mile each way to school, i began catching a bus, just a few houses away.

My impression is, all this current talk about Asians being great students is, basically, in their homes, they value merit in education much like we did before the mid-60’s. In general, they didn’t give up the old ways. For this they get a lot of criticism, too.

i’m a bit surprised when i hear anyone mention I.Q., my impression is it’s all-but passe’ in today’s schools.
i’m not sure my now-adult children had I.Q. tests, i think not.

When we were meeting with the dean of engineering, he explained they were looking for well-rounded students, not necessarily straight-A students, as they would have in the past.

i enjoyed school and tried hard to be a straight-A student. That was a rarity for me, i found it hard to avoid Bs, the occasional C would rear its ugly head. i was fortunate. My parents were appreciative and helpful, and laughed, didn’t scold. They were not well educated but both loved reading, they read everything. i was not aware of them ever being criticized for lack of education.

i’m not a fan of brow-beating students to achieve. Merit has value.

“ditches on both sides of the road?”

My takeaways, comparing:

Merit has value. Kindness has value.
Walking to+from school has value. Carrying books.
2-parent homes have value.

[Franklin]

Josh:
Back in the 50s/60s some schools administered them to basically every student.

i’m not sure if you’re correct or not, but this is as i remember.

School was based on MERIT, grades, accomplishments. I.Q. scores were important, but somewhat mysterious. Maybe controversial.

I also remember being tested. I think the explanation is simple. This was at a time when America valued intelligence, so the government wanted to know how intelligent the population was. Makes sense. Today America values stupidity, so the IQ test is pointless.

[temporal1]

Josh:
Back in the 50s/60s some schools administered them to basically every student.

i’m not sure if you’re correct or not, but this is as i remember.

School was based on MERIT, grades, accomplishments. I.Q. scores were important, but somewhat mysterious. Maybe controversial.

I also remember being tested. I think the explanation is simple. This was at a time when America valued intelligence, so the government wanted to know how intelligent the population was. Makes sense. Today America values stupidity, so the IQ test is pointless.

Major competition with USSR, space race, etc.

[temporal1]

i’m not sure if you’re correct or not, but this is as i remember.

School was based on MERIT, grades, accomplishments. I.Q. scores were important, but somewhat mysterious. Maybe controversial.

I also remember being tested. I think the explanation is simple. This was at a time when America valued intelligence, so the government wanted to know how intelligent the population was. Makes sense. Today America values stupidity, so the IQ test is pointless.

Major competition with USSR, space race, etc.

Franklin,
One of the scariest fears of the Cold War (fears of being bombed were in young children, we had drills at school) - was learning the CRAZY idea that, in Russia, so many men were missing from their homes (they died in wars) that women were forced to do ALL kinds of men’s work, from labor to professional work, doctors and scientists -AND- their babies+children were put in gov institutions for care!!

As a child, i couldn’t imagine my father not present, or going to any kind of childcare. This fear was as scary as bombs.

i began public school first grade at the ripe old age of 7!! (my parents didn’t believe in kindergarten.) In my very mixed school, divorce was unheard of and taboo, not for children to discuss. Rich or poor, dads were present.

Decades later, in the U.S., divorce is celebrated, voters clamor for the gov to TAKE their children!! The earlier the better.
Merit is racist. Teen mobs are terrorizing - for fun+thrills - at will. Hedonism is king.

You cannot make this up.

[Sudsy]

I suppose that most of this meets our expectations: Jews are better than Unitarians who are better than Mainline Protestants who are better than Catholics who are better than Muslims who are better than Evangelical Protestants. I was surprised by the good results for Mormons /how come?) And of course I would have liked to see results for Mennonites.3

Personally, I have no expectations regarding which of these groups are 'better than' others in IQ. IQ is man's evaluation of how intelligent people are and sadly many with high intelligence according to man often have trouble with simple faith and trust in Jesus. What is more important than IQ is wisdom. James says wisdom is what we should seek after and God will give it to those who ask.

Those who place high IQ as being important in knowing God lack wisdom.

[Josh]

Did they use the results in any way that was beneficial to the educational process? Or was it just a different way of doing standardized testing?

I consider the education received in the 1950s/1960s to have been excellent, particularly when compared to today (and GRE scores agree with me, which peaked in 1960). My dad went on to Rice and my mom went on to Franciscan and Purdue for her master's. They were both very well prepared, my dad at a rust belt city school, my mom at a tiny rural school.

But in any case, such testing was also done for the good of the country and to benefit IQ testing research, and also identify if perhaps some regions may have been lagging behind the rest of the country. Back in the 50s/early 60s, people wanted to do things for the good of the country, instead of only beneficial to themselves.That's a rather stark difference compared to today.

[Josh]

Personally, I have no expectations regarding which of these groups are 'better than' others in IQ. IQ is man's evaluation of how intelligent people are and sadly many with high intelligence according to man often have trouble with simple faith and trust in Jesus. What is more important than IQ is wisdom. James says wisdom is what we should seek after and God will give it to those who ask.

Those who place high IQ as being important in knowing God lack wisdom.

IQ is almost entirely hereditary and there rest is due to prenatal or early childhood environmental factors, so it is best to see it as a talent or a gift. The man with 10 talents needed to use them, but even the one with 1 talent needed to use it wisely and not just bury it. So the smarter anyone is, the more he should use it as a gift to help serve others.

[temporal1]

Did they use the results in any way that was beneficial to the educational process? Or was it just a different way of doing standardized testing?

I consider the education received in the 1950s/1960s to have been excellent, particularly when compared to today (and GRE scores agree with me, which peaked in 1960). My dad went on to Rice and my mom went on to Franciscan and Purdue for her master's. They were both very well prepared, my dad at a rust belt city school, my mom at a tiny rural school.

Yes. As well, those were years when H.S. diplomas were still of great value. Graduates were expected to be young adults at 18, prepared to work, marry, begin families.

OJT was common, not near as many LICENSES and certificates required (i.e., colleges and the state replaced OJT).

Today, 18 year olds are treated like babies, college is greatly compromised, seen as the place for kids to experiment with drugs+sex.
Some courses that were formerly part of H.S. are now offered in college.

Many diplomas+degrees do not carry the weight they once did. In the past, ANY college degree equaled gainful employment.

[Sudsy]

I agree with this statement -

The one who uses all God gave them for God’s glory is the smartest.