Global Warning/Climate Change

Things that are not part of politics happening presently and how we approach or address it as Anabaptists.
appleman2006
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Re: Global Warning/Climate Change

Post by appleman2006 »

Bootstrap wrote: That's certainly valid - science can be wrong. Remember the 1970s, when we were going to run out of gas within a decade? That was clearly wrong. But it was also the best answer science had at the time, and we often have to navigate based on our best understanding.
Was it really the best answer science had at the time. Or does this in fact prove Wayne's point that in fact it was simply a very politicized statement created to push ahead certain agendas? I fully expect in 20 to 30 years our children will look at the climate debate in the same way.

If I am right then we will have wasted trillions of dollars that could of been better spent to relieve people's misery right now. If I am wrong well then it appears we will still have spent trillions of dollars that really will not make a significant difference because nobody believed the theory enough to change their lifestyle to really make a difference.

Yup. Just call me very cynical.
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PeterG
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Re: Global Warning/Climate Change

Post by PeterG »

Who will acknowledge that their own side in the climate debate has been highly politicized?
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Bootstrap
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Re: Global Warning/Climate Change

Post by Bootstrap »

PeterG wrote:Who will acknowledge that their own side in the climate debate has been highly politicized?
Clearly, both sides have been highly politicized.

That doesn't mean that all science is driven by politics. The most highly politicized part shows up in the lay-level debates.
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KingdomBuilder
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Re: Global Warning/Climate Change

Post by KingdomBuilder »

Bootstrap wrote:
PeterG wrote:Who will acknowledge that their own side in the climate debate has been highly politicized?
Clearly, both sides have been highly politicized.

That doesn't mean that all science is driven by politics. The most highly politicized part shows up in the lay-level debates.
I'll say I'm a bit confused when people say that the __________ are pushing climate change as part of some agenda. What exactly is said "agenda"? I've seen no meaningful advance caused by an acknowledgement of climate change.
Can anyone give me a quick rundown without getting their blood pressure too high? (jokes) 8-)
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Wayne in Maine
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Re: Global Warning/Climate Change

Post by Wayne in Maine »

KingdomBuilder wrote:
Bootstrap wrote:
PeterG wrote:Who will acknowledge that their own side in the climate debate has been highly politicized?
Clearly, both sides have been highly politicized.

That doesn't mean that all science is driven by politics. The most highly politicized part shows up in the lay-level debates.
I'll say I'm a bit confused when people say that the __________ are pushing climate change as part of some agenda. What exactly is said "agenda"? I've seen no meaningful advance caused by an acknowledgement of climate change.
Can anyone give me a quick rundown without getting their blood pressure too high? (jokes) 8-)
Redistribution of wealth, among other things. Some environmental organizations are pushing for particular energy sources such as wind and solar (certainly not nuclear, there is though a consensus among scientists that nuclear is the best option to reduce Carbon Dioxide emissions). I'll let other speak to this...
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Wayne in Maine
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Re: Global Warning/Climate Change

Post by Wayne in Maine »

PeterG wrote:Who will acknowledge that their own side in the climate debate has been highly politicized?
I'm only taking the side of science and rational economic policy that thoroughly analyzes the consequences of environmental regulations. Believe it or not a scientist can find a flaw in a hypothesis and not be motivated by politics. :o
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KingdomBuilder
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Re: Global Warning/Climate Change

Post by KingdomBuilder »

Wayne in Maine wrote:Redistribution of wealth, among other things..

Thanks for the reply, Wayne. The portion I quoted seems to line up with what I think some others around me have said. It's still curious to me though, as I don't imagine such a redistribution would hardly be possible.
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appleman2006
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Re: Global Warning/Climate Change

Post by appleman2006 »

PeterG wrote:Who will acknowledge that their own side in the climate debate has been highly politicized?
I assume that both sides have but here in Canada not so much. To take my side here is Canada would be political suicide. In the old days I would of been run out of town on a plank and tarred and feathered. I would be castigated as a stupid uneducated red neck that does not care about the earth and the environment and therefor not about people either when in fact the only reason I keep speaking up is because of the vast pressure that I see it's demands will put on the poorest of the world. Ultimately I see the trillions of dollars being spent on things that may or may not make a different in the future when in fact those dollars could be spent in far better ways that would benefit those that really need it now.

Green energy is touted as the only way to go and the only thing that will save our environment but when in fact eclectic rates rise to the point of almost causing a revolt there is a sudden back peddling and a desperate way of looking for other ways of trying to keep rates down. If you do not understand by now why a person like me is really cynical you should take a lesson in reading comprehension or I should take a lesson in communication. :)
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Wayne in Maine
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Re: Global Warning/Climate Change

Post by Wayne in Maine »

KingdomBuilder wrote:
Wayne in Maine wrote:Redistribution of wealth, among other things..

Thanks for the reply, Wayne. The portion I quoted seems to line up with what I think some others around me have said. It's still curious to me though, as I don't imagine such a redistribution would hardly be possible.
United States delivers first payment to global climate fund

What is the green climate fund?

Corruption threatens progress on climate change.
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appleman2006
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Re: Global Warning/Climate Change

Post by appleman2006 »

KingdomBuilder wrote:
Wayne in Maine wrote:Redistribution of wealth, among other things..

Thanks for the reply, Wayne. The portion I quoted seems to line up with what I think some others around me have said. It's still curious to me though, as I don't imagine such a redistribution would hardly be possible.
I am not sure it is as much a redistribution that people are after as it is for the privileged and the wealthy to maintain that privilege and even improve on it. That is both on the international level between various nations as well as the individual level.

A case in point is the war on the car. I never really saw the significance of this until after spending 4 days in downtown London. The cost of the downtown levy makes it very impractical for the ordinary person to drive a car down there. Other than buses, taxis and delivery vehicle the only cars you see in the downtown area are cars costing well over 100,000 dollars and they get around with surprising ease. See how it works? Push the grand unwashed off the streets and the rich can have the open road. I am convinced that that is at least somewhat the motivation of some of the things that are happening here in Canada.
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