Meanwhile, in Ireland

When it just doesn't fit anywhere else.
temporal1
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Re: Meanwhile, in Ireland

Post by temporal1 »

Hats Off wrote:Individuals living abroad are paying thousands of dollars just to go home and vote yes. It seems to me that government legislation mandating "no" isn't going to solve the issue. I don't believe I could vote "no" on an issue like this; the people will do what they want regardless of how I would vote. What are the chances of a child having a good life or learning the way of Jesus when he/she was brought into the world because mother wanted an abortion but did not have the resources? What kind of life will an unwanted child have?
it is a matter for voters.
from what i read, political Canada is run-away with far left agenda, not confined to abortion.

i would have to vote no, if i voted.
i’m acutely aware of poor circumstances many are born into.
it’s not man’s decision to decide God would not do better for that child, or, that the child would not be a force for good on earth. humans do not have that knowledge.

what we humans can do, esp believers, is emphasize the importance of valuing life, valuing self and family, in context of worship of God, not self .. better care for mothers in harsh circumstances, care for their children, “love them both,” and, choices for adoptions made known, not hidden, with abortion “featured.”

i see evidence of lots of improvement in these areas, and they are critically important.
i agree with you, i believe it would be inhumane to simply end abortion access without direct support for better alternatives. i wholeheartedly agree with this. it’s happening.

there are many wonderful people who are devoting their lives to help women choose life, and, to cope with life.

right now, Trump has submitted a plan to withdraw funding to clinics that do abortions - the plan is to direct those funds, $60 million, to EXISTING clinics that provide overall women’s HEALTHCARE, not abortions.

$60 million is only a portion of the stated $500 million PP is reported to receive in tax dollars.
mind-boggling numbers in my world.

for me, it only makes sense.
as more+more science is learned, as advances are made in displaying beyond question the humanity of the not yet born, aside from psychopathy, the human heart would protect human life.
in ways humans have hearts for all life, including animals and trees, the oceans, et al.

https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefings-st ... le-x-rule/

you and i were born into a world wherein pregnancies happened, most knew if they engaged in sexual intercourse, a baby could result! this was not usually a surprise. there was far less divorce, families adjusted to make room at their tables for the new family members.

i was not planned, were you? :)
but, i was welcomed and cared for. i learned, my existence certainly changed the course of my family’s lives! .. that was normal life for everyone. after me, there came 2 more. 3 before. not planned. accepted as a result of married life. life was tough. no social services. but, life was valued.

abortions happened. divorce happened. murders happened. life was not “ideal.”
but, wholesale abortion, euthenasia, divorce, etc., were unthinkable.

with today’s many advances, on paper, “we” should be doing better, not worse!

an aside ..
early in my life, young women might not realize they were pregnant for weeks-months after conception. lots of young women learned of their pregnancies through older women in the family who recognized signs BEFORE the mother!

lots of women found out they were pregnant through their mother or mil telling them, “you’re pregnant!” there was no “morning after” anything. most did not speak of pregnancy until they began to show, maybe 6 months, esp with first pregnancies.

modesty during pregnancy, not exhibitionism, was valued.
pregnancy was an intimate, sacred part of marriage.

science which should be helping women and families, so far, does much destruction of women and families. i pray this changes.
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temporal1
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Re: Meanwhile, in Ireland

Post by temporal1 »

abortion is one of many topics that should NEVER be politicized.
this is a human heart matter.

it has been politicized because for-profit-corporate-abortion demands politicizing.
they make it about big money and world power.

this should not be.

remove money+power, there would be silence.
there is no core concern about women, children, families.
that’s a “big lie.”

another factor in Ireland:
hatred of Ireland’s Catholic history. young people are taught to hate religion, particularly Christians, of Christians, particularly Catholics. that’s part of this picture, too.
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temporal1
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Re: Meanwhile, in Ireland

Post by temporal1 »

The Catholic Church has done so much for prolife, including adoption services, orphanages, now prolife services, including services like, “Save the Storks,” which, i read is very effective. it’s impossible (for me) to imagine the world without all they’ve done.

Save the Storks Bus
https://savethestorks.com/stork-bus/?na ... 27025664:1

to be honest, only in recent years did i grasp it.
now these are years when secularists are doing everything possible to overtake these functions, to make all of it functions of government, political, to the point of not tolerating Catholic services!!

it’s one thing to ask for alternative choices.
it’s another to remove, ban+replace what others have provided.

this is where the world is: intolerance draped in falsified words, like, “inclusion.”
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temporal1
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Re: Meanwhile, in Ireland

Post by temporal1 »

Hats Off wrote:Individuals living abroad are paying thousands of dollars just to go home and vote yes.

It seems to me that government legislation mandating "no" isn't going to solve the issue. I don't believe I could vote "no" on an issue like this; the people will do what they want regardless of how I would vote. What are the chances of a child having a good life or learning the way of Jesus when he/she was brought into the world because mother wanted an abortion but did not have the resources? What kind of life will an unwanted child have?
Some voters are delayed at the airport:
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/h ... 68641.html

i have read ..
some students have received grants to pay for their travel;
that Soros’ money is funding the repeal/yes vote;
that some older voters learned their names were removed from voting lists, they were turned away;
that no reporting is allowed until votes are complete.

i read that some are returning to vote no. (presumably, “on their own dime.”)

no matter today’s outcome, esp if close, there are enough questions to predict it may take some time before they arrive at a final vote. historically, the Irish can be “feisty” over things.

personally, if there are valid questions, i see no reason not to investigate, to arrive at the correct outcome. mistakes happen, so does intentional fraud.
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MaxPC
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Re: Meanwhile, in Ireland

Post by MaxPC »

Parishes are praying for Ireland as I write this.
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Max (Plain Catholic)
Mt 24:35
Proverbs 18:2 A fool does not delight in understanding but only in revealing his own mind.
1 Corinthians 3:19 For the wisdom of this world is folly with God
francis
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Re: Meanwhile, in Ireland

Post by francis »

In my experience, a lot of the "yes" votes are coming because of the Catholic Church's damaged reputation. When they've been responsible for covering up child abuse and murder:https://www.irishmirror.ie/news/irish-n ... 00-9979348
Not that I'm excusing pro-abortion advocacy, but my Irish friends say that the Catholic Church has lost credibility, and thus their position on the 8th amendment is also dismissed. Agreeing that when this issue is politicized, people vote for the wrong reasons. As much as the RCC is pushing the "no" vote now, it doesn't have the same impact that it used to.
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MaxPC
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Re: Meanwhile, in Ireland

Post by MaxPC »

francis wrote:In my experience, a lot of the "yes" votes are coming because of the Catholic Church's damaged reputation. When they've been responsible for covering up child abuse and murder:https://www.irishmirror.ie/news/irish-n ... 00-9979348
Not that I'm excusing pro-abortion advocacy, but my Irish friends say that the Catholic Church has lost credibility, and thus their position on the 8th amendment is also dismissed. Agreeing that when this issue is politicized, people vote for the wrong reasons. As much as the RCC is pushing the "no" vote now, it doesn't have the same impact that it used to.
Very true and the Vatican has stated the same thing as you did, Francis. The Church has appointed some new Bishops with excellent reputations to replace those who neglected their flock.
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Max (Plain Catholic)
Mt 24:35
Proverbs 18:2 A fool does not delight in understanding but only in revealing his own mind.
1 Corinthians 3:19 For the wisdom of this world is folly with God
temporal1
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Re: Meanwhile, in Ireland

Post by temporal1 »

latest i’ve read, results are not expected before Saturday morning CDT.
continuing prayers.

it’s so sad.
Ireland is a small country, this should not be a grand matter of international concern.
countries should be allowed to establish their policies, without being made examples of, and/or used to establish legal precedent, to make or break political parties.

politicians, lawyers, actvists, lobbies, are out of control.
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temporal1
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Re: Meanwhile, in Ireland

Post by temporal1 »

Praying for the young, foolish, and fooled.
Many laughed+partied as they traded their souls for the price of plane fare. :(

It would have been quite a feat for Ireland to stand against at-will abortion.
They are surrounded by it, with few exceptions; Poland, Hungary, Malta, i believe, are exceptions.

Not a close vote:
https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/ ... a3efa0b166
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Bootstrap
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Re: Meanwhile, in Ireland

Post by Bootstrap »

Sad.

We Christians don't run the government. There's still a lot we can do with service, persuasion, and prayer. Just as we do in the United States.
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Is it biblical? Is it Christlike? Is it loving? Is it true? How can I find out?
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