Evolution

When it just doesn't fit anywhere else.

Do you believe in evolution

 
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Heirbyadoption
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Re: Evolution

Post by Heirbyadoption »

RZehr wrote:What do you old earth believers do with Biblical lineages and lifespans of people given in the bible?
I, too, have wondered about this... We humbly await enlightenment. :ugeek:
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MaxPC
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Re: Evolution

Post by MaxPC »

RZehr wrote:What do you old earth believers do with Biblical lineages and lifespans of people given in the bible?
As always I'll qualify my opinion with YMMV:

I'm not sure I can use the phrase "old earth". Compared to other cosmic structures the earth is quite young. Relational comparisons are part of the concept of "time".

The measurement of time is an artificial human construct to create common reference points, usually for occupations such as farming or business but also for other activities. The units created to mark time vary from one culture to the next. E.g.: the Chinese calendar vis a vis the Julian calendar, the Gregorian calendar, the Egyptian, the Mayan ... etc. each had different numbers of months and each had different numbers of days to mark those months.

Marking the passage of time started very early in human history using as reference points the observational data of astronomical bodies and their movements: the sun, the moon, and the stars.

As far as whether the 6 days are literal according to the modern calendar or whether it's referencing a different calendar system from long ago, I cannot say. I'm waiting for that information when I finally go to meet God at the end of my earthly existence. I certainly hope that's not going to be 900 years. Can you imagine my aspirin bill? :D

Thank you for your patience in reading this post: I tried to keep it shorter than a dissertation.
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Dan Z
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Re: Evolution

Post by Dan Z »

Heirbyadoption wrote:
RZehr wrote:What do you old earth believers do with Biblical lineages and lifespans of people given in the bible?
I, too, have wondered about this... We humbly await enlightenment. :ugeek:
I don't know about other "old earthers," but from my perspective, I believe the man, Adam, lived and walked on the earth about 6,000 - 12,000 years ago (extrapolating from the Biblical genealogies, but recognizing some "telescoping" in the lists of descendants might exist), and that he died at the ripe old age of 930 like scripture says.

By the way - I think it is worth noting that the old earth position does not necessarily mean a wholesale embrace of theistic evolution.
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Wayne in Maine
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Re: Evolution

Post by Wayne in Maine »

RZehr wrote:What do you old earth believers do with Biblical lineages and lifespans of people given in the bible?
For myself, I really have no opinion. Why the record in Genesis is written in the manner that it is, and why it describes the cosmos and early history humankind in the manner it does is a mystery to me.

The precision and accuracy or the possibility of allegory on the part of the writer of Genesis has no real bearing on my belief that Jesus is who He claimed to be or on my desire to follow after and obey Him. My faith is in Jesus, not someone's understanding of the books we call the bible. I simply don't want discrepancies between what is observable and measurable (call it science) and what was written in Genesis to hinder spreading the good news and expanding God's Kingdom.
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silentreader
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Re: Evolution

Post by silentreader »

Wayne in Maine wrote:
RZehr wrote:What do you old earth believers do with Biblical lineages and lifespans of people given in the bible?
For myself, I really have no opinion. Why the record in Genesis is written in the manner that it is, and why it describes the cosmos and early history humankind in the manner it does is a mystery to me.

The precision and accuracy or the possibility of allegory on the part of the writer of Genesis has no real bearing on my belief that Jesus is who He claimed to be or on my desire to follow after and obey Him. My faith is in Jesus, not someone's understanding of the books we call the bible. I simply don't want discrepancies between what is observable and measurable (call it science) and what was written in Genesis to hinder spreading the good news and expanding God's Kingdom.
Of whom John said...
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 He was in the beginning with God. 3 All things were made through him, and without him was not any thing made that was made. 4 In him was life, and the life was the light of men. 5 The light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome it.
6 There was a man sent from God, whose name was John. 7 He came as a witness, to bear witness about the light, that all might believe through him. 8 He was not the light, but came to bear witness about the light.
9 The true light, which gives light to everyone, was coming into the world. 10 He was in the world, and the world was made through him, yet the world did not know him. 11 He came to his own, and his own people did not receive him. 12 But to all who did receive him, who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God, 13 who were born, not of blood nor of the will of the flesh nor of the will of man, but of God.
14 And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we have seen his glory, glory as of the only Son[d] from the Father, full of grace and truth. 15 (John bore witness about him, and cried out, “This was he of whom I said, ‘He who comes after me ranks before me, because he was before me.’”) 16 For from his fullness we have all received, grace upon grace. 17 For the law was given through Moses; grace and truth came through Jesus Christ. 18 No one has ever seen God; the only God, who is at the Father's side, he has made him known.
...among other things.
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Hats Off
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Re: Evolution

Post by Hats Off »

My (other) Brethern friend was quite emphatic about Genisis 1, and I had to agree with him: If we don't accept the beginning, how do we decide where to start believing. Genisis is the foundation for everything else.
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Dan Z
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Re: Evolution

Post by Dan Z »

Hats Off wrote:My (other) Brethern friend was quite emphatic about Genisis 1, and I had to agree with him: If we don't accept the beginning, how do we decide where to start believing. Genisis is the foundation for everything else.
Brother...might your friend be confusing "belief" with "interpretation"?

In other words, what he is in reality saying is "If we don't accept [my interpretation of] the beginning, how do we decide where to start believing." Now, his interpretation is certainly a reasonable one - that the days are literal 24 hour days rather than periods of time, and that the days are consecutive with no gaps before or after, and that the passage is definitely not figurative or poetic in nature. Nevertheless, all of these interpretive assumptions have been made. Does that really mean that those who interpret the passage based on other reasonable interpretive assumptions lack belief? And what are the important beliefs that the passage is attempting to communicate anyway?
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Hats Off
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Re: Evolution

Post by Hats Off »

But what is Genisis if not the beginning? If Genisis is wrongly named, where is the actual beginning?
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Dan Z
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Re: Evolution

Post by Dan Z »

Hats Off wrote:But what is Genisis if not the beginning? If Genisis is wrongly named, where is the actual beginning?
I think the first three words of the passage unambiguously clear that up - at least for our universe. Unfortunately, those words don't have a time stamp on them.
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silentreader
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Re: Evolution

Post by silentreader »

Dan Z wrote:
Hats Off wrote:My (other) Brethern friend was quite emphatic about Genisis 1, and I had to agree with him: If we don't accept the beginning, how do we decide where to start believing. Genisis is the foundation for everything else.
Brother...might your friend be confusing "belief" with "interpretation"?

In other words, what he is in reality saying is "If we don't accept [my interpretation of] the beginning, how do we decide where to start believing." Now, his interpretation is certainly a reasonable one - that the days are literal 24 hour days rather than periods of time, and that the days are consecutive with no gaps before or after, and that the passage is definitely not figurative or poetic in nature. Nevertheless, all of these interpretive assumptions have been made. Does that really mean that those who interpret the passage based on other reasonable interpretive assumptions lack belief? And what are the important beliefs that the passage is attempting to communicate anyway?
Seems to me he was stating his belief in his interpretation, and to a greater or lesser extent, isn't that what we're all doing?
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Noah was a conspiracy theorist...and then it began to rain.~Unknown
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