Evolution

When it just doesn't fit anywhere else.

Do you believe in evolution

 
Total votes: 0

silentreader
Posts: 2511
Joined: Wed Nov 02, 2016 9:41 pm
Affiliation: MidWest Fellowship

Re: Evolution

Post by silentreader »

RZehr wrote:Look what else has been thoroughly disproven by science.
Young earth
Jesus resurrection
Jesus virgin birth
Various and sundry miracles
Why do you choose faith over science on these issues?
Don't forget the resurrection of Lazarus and the Ascension of Jesus.
0 x
Noah was a conspiracy theorist...and then it began to rain.~Unknown
User avatar
Dan Z
Posts: 2648
Joined: Fri Oct 28, 2016 11:20 am
Location: Central Minnesota
Affiliation: Conservative Menno

Re: Evolution

Post by Dan Z »

silentreader wrote:
RZehr wrote:Look what else has been thoroughly disproven by science.
Young earth
Jesus resurrection
Jesus virgin birth
Various and sundry miracles
Why do you choose faith over science on these issues?
Don't forget the resurrection of Lazarus and the Ascension of Jesus.
For me, the issue in Genesis 1 is not science disproving a miracle, or choosing science over faith...but rather an issue of "rightly dividing the word of truth."

Creation, by any measure, is perhaps God's greatest miracle - out of nothing he spoke the universe into being! Science can't tell us how it (or any other miracle) happened, but if it did in reality happen there should be evidence of it's occurrence - and the evidence of that miracle is all around us isn't it? Look at the stars! The mountains!! The trees and birds and animals!!! Look at that moment when evidence shows all the matter in the universe burst forth from a single point in a flash of cosmic light!!! Science observes all of these things, and people of faith are right to ask - "Hath not the hand of the Lord done this?"

Science can't tell us how Christ rose from the dead - but the empty tomb bears witness! Hallelujah!! His bones are not there.

Science has no explanation for water turning into wine - yet the guests drank their fill! It has no explanation for the blind seeing or the deaf hearing or the lame walking - yet there they are - seeing and hearing and leaping for joy!

Science may doubt the existence of miracles - because it is it is bound to understand reality based on proven natural laws - but it cannot "disprove" a miracle has occurred...unless evidence shows that it didn't, or unless a second miracle conclusively covered up the evidence of the first - but that seems contrary to the nature of God doesn't it?
0 x
silentreader
Posts: 2511
Joined: Wed Nov 02, 2016 9:41 pm
Affiliation: MidWest Fellowship

Re: Evolution

Post by silentreader »

Dan Z wrote:
silentreader wrote:
RZehr wrote:Look what else has been thoroughly disproven by science.
Young earth
Jesus resurrection
Jesus virgin birth
Various and sundry miracles
Why do you choose faith over science on these issues?
Don't forget the resurrection of Lazarus and the Ascension of Jesus.
For me, the issue in Genesis 1 is not science disproving a miracle, or choosing science over faith...but rather an issue of "rightly dividing the word of truth."

Creation, by any measure, is perhaps God's greatest miracle - out of nothing he spoke the universe into being! Science can't tell us how it (or any other miracle) happened, but if it did in reality happen there should be evidence of it's occurrence - and the evidence of that miracle is all around us isn't it? Look at the stars! The mountains!! The trees and birds and animals!!! Look at that moment when evidence shows all the matter in the universe burst forth from a single point in a flash of cosmic light!!! Science observes all of these things, and people of faith are right to ask - "Hath not the hand of the Lord done this?"

Science can't tell us how Christ rose from the dead - but the empty tomb bears witness! Hallelujah!! His bones are not there.

Science has no explanation for water turning into wine - yet the guests drank their fill! It has no explanation for the blind seeing or the deaf hearing or the lame walking - yet there they are - seeing and hearing and leaping for joy!

Science may doubt the existence of miracles - because it is it is bound to understand reality based on proven natural laws - but it cannot "disprove" a miracle has occurred...unless evidence shows that it didn't, or unless a second miracle conclusively covered up the evidence of the first - but that seems contrary to the nature of God doesn't it?
I'm good with everything else you said, but I guess here we part ways, and that's fine, it seems that is the way it is going to be, let us go on to more edifying things, and I'm not referring to politics.
0 x
Noah was a conspiracy theorist...and then it began to rain.~Unknown
silentreader
Posts: 2511
Joined: Wed Nov 02, 2016 9:41 pm
Affiliation: MidWest Fellowship

Re: Evolution

Post by silentreader »

I've always been fascinated by light.

http://www.newsweek.com/photons-light-physics-808862
0 x
Noah was a conspiracy theorist...and then it began to rain.~Unknown
User avatar
JimFoxvog
Posts: 2891
Joined: Thu Nov 17, 2016 10:56 pm
Location: Northern Illinois
Affiliation: MCUSA

Re: Evolution

Post by JimFoxvog »

RZehr wrote:Look what else has been thoroughly disproven by science.
Young earth
Jesus resurrection
Jesus virgin birth
Various and sundry miracles
Why do you choose faith over science on these issues?
Miracles are not disproven by science. They are just contrary to the assumptions made when doing science. All that science can say is that virgin births, resurrections, and other miracles don't happen naturally. I agree.

The creation scientists try to make a case for a young earth. The case is stronger than traditional scientists presume, but I'm not sure it's convincing.
0 x
User avatar
Josh
Posts: 23806
Joined: Wed Oct 19, 2016 6:23 pm
Location: 1000' ASL
Affiliation: The church of God

Re: Evolution

Post by Josh »

One of my complaints with creation “science” is they try to make a case for non-miraculous creation.
0 x
Hats Off
Posts: 2532
Joined: Thu Feb 09, 2017 6:42 pm
Affiliation: Plain Menno OO

Re: Evolution

Post by Hats Off »

Josh wrote:One of my complaints with creation “science” is they try to make a case for non-miraculous creation.
I would say the"Anabaptist Forum" group are not making a case for non-miraculous creation, but they seem to arguing for a scientific explanation to prove the miracle of God's creation, one that proves that all other scientific explanations for how life and matter came about, are wrong.
0 x
User avatar
Josh
Posts: 23806
Joined: Wed Oct 19, 2016 6:23 pm
Location: 1000' ASL
Affiliation: The church of God

Re: Evolution

Post by Josh »

Hats Off wrote:
Josh wrote:One of my complaints with creation “science” is they try to make a case for non-miraculous creation.
I would say the"Anabaptist Forum" group are not making a case for non-miraculous creation, but they seem to arguing for a scientific explanation to prove the miracle of God's creation, one that proves that all other scientific explanations for how life and matter came about, are wrong.
That seems dangerous. Phyiscal evidence helps me believe in God’s word but it can’t be the main reason. Especially when creation “science” keeps changing throughout the years. It’s basically a foundation built on sand.

We should believe in the simple message of the gospel (the evidence is Jesus’ resurrection and seeing changed lives set free from sin), and the simple message that God created the heavens and earth and called it good. How exactly he did that is a mystery!
0 x
joshuabgood
Posts: 2815
Joined: Fri Oct 21, 2016 5:23 pm
Affiliation: BMA

Re: Evolution

Post by joshuabgood »

Dan and Wayne, in your interpretation was Adam a literal man and the first man? And does it matter if he wasn't...in your view? And do you think there was a literal global Flood?
0 x
User avatar
Dan Z
Posts: 2648
Joined: Fri Oct 28, 2016 11:20 am
Location: Central Minnesota
Affiliation: Conservative Menno

Re: Evolution

Post by Dan Z »

Most miracles are considered miracles because they run counter to the laws of nature (e.g.the dead coming to life, water turning to wine, the Sun standing still, etc.). But this understanding of the miraculous is too narrow...

God's greatest miracle is Creation itself - and the natural laws that Scripture says he has set in place to give it order. Who among us has not marveled at the wonder of it all - and felt God's presence in the witness of his handiwork? David certainly did as he recognized the stars declared the glory of God. God told Job to ask the animals and birds who has done all this. And the miracle of new life has been recognized for all of time. Nature is miraculous...it is "God's other book" because it bears the fingerprints of the character, power, and creative genius of the Creator.

In this sense, as science learns about the laws and functioning of nature it proves the miraculous - and the more it discovers, the more miraculous it all becomes - especially to those who recognize the hand of the Creator it behind it all. It is one of the prime reasons I love science!
0 x
Post Reply