Personality traits

[steve-in-kville]

ADHD, ADD, autism, etc are not “personality traits”.

Feel free to call it whatever you want. It was what popped in my head. Not sure I feel the need to get all legalistic about it.

I also don’t think being autistic or ADHD is an excuse for being rude, unkind, or behaving in socially inappropriate manners.

I agree. I missed where someone here suggested it was.

And I would add that none of us self-diagnosed ourselves by what we read on the internet. Most of us saw a professional. How we deal with it after that is up to us.

Not sure why this has you so hot and fired up, Josh?

[Soloist]

I think when someone consistently deals with unkind people who seem to lack empathy or understanding of their own actions, there tends to be certain assumptions made as a human way of excusing bad behavior.
The alternative is to think the person just is that nasty.

I’m one of those self diagnosed people. I don’t think we need a psychologist to evaluate everything. The whole reason to get evaluated is either to get help or some financial reasoning.

I’ve been accused of having OCD on this forum. It didn’t offend me, it was more amusing really.

The point of the accusation was to diminish a stance or make themselves feel better for not taking a stance.

[Robert]

I’ve been accused of having OCD on this forum. It didn’t offend me, it was more amusing really.

Many people at work think that of me, I am sure. I have to keep over organized or I can't find anything. Organization covers for my weak memory recall. I can walk in in the morning and look at my truck and immediately know if someone got something from it. I will run them down to make sure I get things restocked and replaced. Since they all call me whenever they need anything, they will just have to deal with it so I can have what is needed for their calls.

[steve-in-kville]

I also don’t think being autistic or ADHD is an excuse for being rude, unkind, or behaving in socially inappropriate manners.

I don't think we should use such things as an excuse for bad behavior. That I agree with.

[MaxPC]

I also don’t think being autistic or ADHD is an excuse for being rude, unkind, or behaving in socially inappropriate manners.

I don't think we should use such things as an excuse for bad behavior. That I agree with.

Likewise.

[Verity]

Forbes Health and Harvard Health both recently published peer-reviewed articles on neurodivergence. Numerous government and medical sites also have a wealth of information. My filter does not allow access to these so I cannot post links, but a quick check on a library computer confirmed that they are not difficult to find if you are interested in learning more. https://www.mentra.com/neurodiversity gives a concise overview of neurodivergence in the workplace. I know of several companies involved in security and computer science who prefer employees who are neurodivergent.

15-20% of the world's population are considered neurodivergent. All this umbrella term means is that the brain utilizes different pathways than are considered typical. This difference results in a unique set of strengths, as well as unique challenges. It is interesting that decades ago when studies were first being done on autism, individuals diagnosed with it were generally seen as very low IQ or extremely high IQ (Einstein is one example). Since the nineties, those numbers have shifted drastically, with 45% of people diagnosed with autism having an average IQ and 32% above average. When you consider that only 2% of the general population have above average IQ, those numbers are significant. Many highly intelligent neurodivergent individuals go undiagnosed until later in life. Growing awareness and screening in health care, schools, the military and some workplaces is changing this.

I lived in a university community and related to various professionals involved in research and therapy surrounding brain health. High rates of neurodivergence (well beyond the scope of autism) among plain communities is catching the interest of researchers. "Neurodivergent" has been used commonly by these professionals for the past twenty years. Even our old school family doctor used it. Every individual I know who is neurodivergent was diagnosed by more than one professional. The process is rigorous, not a simple "Well it looks like you have ----" by your family doctor. Typically there are multiple referrals and analysis that happen before a diagnosis is made. For my child this happened after a severe head injury that cause significant change of personality and how he related to life. As parent and professionals, we never slapped a label on or used it as an excuse for inappropriate behavior. Rather, it was information that equipped us in therapy. Years later, this child is doing well and we thank God. As a teen this child is still ignorant that a neurodivergent diagnosis was ever given. We treated the brain injury, not the label. With support, their unique strengths can shine.

Neuroplasticity is well worth looking into as well. We are fearfully and wonderfully made by Divine design.

[Josh]

Since the nineties, those numbers have shifted drastically, with 45% of people diagnosed with autism having an average IQ and 32% above average.

And then 23% would be below average.

When you consider that only 2% of the general population have above average IQ, those numbers are significant.

50% of the population has above average IQ. IQ is measured with Z scores on a standard distribution.

IQ is defined as the average person scoring 100; about 70% of people range from 85 to 115. The top 5% score 130 or higher and the top 2% score 145 or over. Z scores are just another way to describe percentiles.

On test instruments in use today it is impossible to score over 150 or 155, although theoretically such a person exists.

Going back to your example, all IQ means is we take a collection of people and sort them from lowest general intelligence to highest. We then assign “average” to the person who is right in the middle. Test instruments are then designed to make sure they match this.

IQ tests designed back in the 1930s and 1940s specifically were crafted to include autistic type of people, people who are marginal such as homeless, prisoners, etc., people in mental wards, housewives, brilliant and famous people, very ordinary people, rural people, urban people, people of different races (in America), men, women, people from the north and the south, college educated, uneducated, and so on. Significant differences between populations were carefully removed from the test instruments. (A general IQ test is designed to give the same result for a well educated lesson versus someone who isn’t well educated, for example.)

[Verity]

Two books that are helpful for parents and teachers, whether or not their children are neurodivergent:

Despite the title, Debi Pearl's book is applicable to men as well. There is an entire chapter on the effects of porn on the brain.

Create a Better Brain.JPG (28.96 KiB) Viewed 108 times

Dr. Oliver Sack's books are informative and entertaining. Musicophilia is a favorite.

[MaxPC]

Every individual I know who is neurodivergent was diagnosed by more than one professional. The process is rigorous, not a simple "Well it looks like you have ----" by your family doctor. Typically there are multiple referrals and analysis that happen before a diagnosis is made. For my child this happened after a severe head injury that cause significant change of personality and how he related to life. As parent and professionals, we never slapped a label on or used it as an excuse for inappropriate behavior. Rather, it was information that equipped us in therapy. Years later, this child is doing well and we thank God. As a teen this child is still ignorant that a neurodivergent diagnosis was ever given. We treated the brain injury, not the label. With support, their unique strengths can shine.

As it should be. Unfortunately, the popular grocery store mags have started running their own "are you neurodivergent" checklist articles in order to grab attention and increase sales. I suppose that will happen with every new label and identified condition. Profit drives misuse.

Neuroplasticity is well worth looking into as well. We are fearfully and wonderfully made by Divine design.

Indeed and agreed. The David Snowdon studies in the late 1980s opened that particular door to the study of neuroplasticity. It certainly is a worthwhile discipline of study.

[Josh]

Two books that are helpful for parents and teachers, whether or not their children are neurodivergent:

Despite the title, Debi Pearl's book is applicable to men as well. There is an entire chapter on the effects of porn on the brain.

Create a Better Brain.JPGChildhood Development.JPG

Dr. Oliver Sack's books are informative and entertaining. Musicophilia is a favorite.

I would stay far away from Mike & Debi Pearl’s books, particularly anything having to do with child training. One of the most harmful doctrines they teach is you can spank your kids mercilessly and not worry about killing them. Unfortunately, several parents have done just that under their teaching and killed the kids.

I would also express extreme caution about a man who mocks nonresistance and teaches against the head covering:

https://nogreaterjoy.org/letters/pacifi ... ment-17653

We have a Mennonite neighbor who practiced non-resistance under all circumstances. Some evil men found out about it and came into his home demanding to take sexual liberties with all his daughters. He did not resist but gave them his younger daughters as well. The men returned. His daughters became pregnant and bore little b<<foul language removed>>ds. No man ever wanted them for wives. He stood by and watched the evil men strip and rape his daughters. It destroyed the family. They had to move so as to cease being used by evil men at their will. He was a fool. His doctrine was of the Devil. He should have risen up in righteous wrath and slain the enemy, like Joshua of old.

I have been struck and pushed and cursed for the gospel’s sake. I have had my life threatened several times. I have been non-resistant in all cases, but when I came across a man raping a woman in the woods, I reached for my pistol and saved her life. To this day she is thankful that I was not a pacifist. She didn’t need a spectator; she needed a deliverer.

Edit: removed foul language from the cut and paste from the nogreaterjoy website