Meanwhile, back in the United States ...

Events occurring and how they relate/affect Anabaptist faith and culture.
User avatar
Josh
Posts: 24202
Joined: Wed Oct 19, 2016 6:23 pm
Location: 1000' ASL
Affiliation: The church of God

Meanwhile, back in Canada ...

Post by Josh »

Speaking of arson, charges have been filed against someone for starting one of the worst fires in Maritime Canada:

https://atlantic.ctvnews.ca/man-22-char ... -1.6731499
0 x
User avatar
Bootstrap
Posts: 14597
Joined: Thu Oct 20, 2016 9:59 am
Affiliation: Mennonite

Re: Meanwhile, back in the United States ...

Post by Bootstrap »

Josh wrote: Fri Jan 19, 2024 10:15 am In the case of church arson, it does seem to be taken seriously, but it also seems to be, much like domestic violence, a crime mostly perpetrated by "insiders".
I have been unable to find any reliable information on the percent of church arsons that are perpetrated by "insiders". What are you basing this claim on?
Josh wrote: Fri Jan 19, 2024 10:15 amArson and vandalism tend to be copycat as well. Which is why it's good to clamp it down as soon as it starts. This is one reason I'm in favour of "broken windows" policing - the visual environment should be kept free of vandalism, graffiti, broken windows, and so forth. Doing so leads to less crime overall, or so research claims.
CISA has a guide on this:

Mitigating Attacks on Houses of Worship: Security Guide
CISA emphasizes, however, that such attacks remain statistically rare even
as they appear to be on the rise. Each is a moment of profound trauma to
those directly affected and to society at large. While these attacks have
terrible impacts, it is important to maintain the social bond that make houses
of worship a unique and integral part of the community. Houses of worship
can accomplish many security measures without detracting from that special
character. This guide intends to help houses of worship find the balance that
fits best with their unique needs and circumstances.
It has a section on "insider threats", but no statistics. I think it would be hard for our church to know how to relate to this section. We think we can trust each other, and that's important to our church.
CISA defines an insider as any person who has or had authorized access to or knowledge of
an organization’s resources, including personnel, facilities, information, equipment, networks,
and systems. Simply put, this is a person the organization and community members trust. An
insider threat is the potential for an insider to use their access or special understanding to
harm that organization through violence, espionage, sabotage, theft, or cyber means.
0 x
Is it biblical? Is it Christlike? Is it loving? Is it true? How can I find out?
User avatar
Josh
Posts: 24202
Joined: Wed Oct 19, 2016 6:23 pm
Location: 1000' ASL
Affiliation: The church of God

Re: Meanwhile, back in the United States ...

Post by Josh »

Bootstrap wrote: Fri Jan 19, 2024 11:51 am
Josh wrote: Fri Jan 19, 2024 10:15 am In the case of church arson, it does seem to be taken seriously, but it also seems to be, much like domestic violence, a crime mostly perpetrated by "insiders".
I have been unable to find any reliable information on the percent of church arsons that are perpetrated by "insiders". What are you basing this claim on?
CISA defines an insider as any person who has or had authorized access to or knowledge of
an organization’s resources, including personnel, facilities, information, equipment, networks,
and systems. Simply put, this is a person the organization and community members trust. An
insider threat is the potential for an insider to use their access or special understanding to
harm that organization through violence, espionage, sabotage, theft, or cyber means.
I'm not using that definition; generally speaking, I don't think arson attacks on churches are cybersecurity related. By "insider" I meant someone who is acquainted with or otherwise associated with the church or community in question. For example, if it's an Armenian church, an "insider" would be someone who is Armenian, and/or perhaps had a parent who attended there, and so forth. As opposed to completely random attacks, or attacks against a church the attacker is not related to in any way at all.
0 x
User avatar
Bootstrap
Posts: 14597
Joined: Thu Oct 20, 2016 9:59 am
Affiliation: Mennonite

Re: Meanwhile, back in the United States ...

Post by Bootstrap »

JohnHurt wrote: Fri Jan 19, 2024 9:02 am Nearly every home has security cameras, and a security system. Same for church buildings.
Does anyone have reliable numbers for this? I found a source that said about half of homes have security cameras. I haven't found a source for church buildings.
1 x
Is it biblical? Is it Christlike? Is it loving? Is it true? How can I find out?
Ken
Posts: 16239
Joined: Thu Jun 13, 2019 12:02 am
Location: Washington State
Affiliation: former MCUSA

Re: Meanwhile, back in the United States ...

Post by Ken »

Bootstrap wrote: Fri Jan 19, 2024 1:49 pm
JohnHurt wrote: Fri Jan 19, 2024 9:02 am Nearly every home has security cameras, and a security system. Same for church buildings.
Does anyone have reliable numbers for this? I found a source that said about half of homes have security cameras. I haven't found a source for church buildings.
I doubt most rural churches (many of which are half-abandoned) have security cameras.

And I doubt they would do much good anyway. Arsonists can just wear ski masks or otherwise hide their identity.
0 x
A fool can throw out more questions than a wise man can answer. -RZehr
User avatar
JimFoxvog
Posts: 2897
Joined: Thu Nov 17, 2016 10:56 pm
Location: Northern Illinois
Affiliation: MCUSA

Re: Meanwhile, back in the United States ...

Post by JimFoxvog »

Bootstrap wrote: Fri Jan 19, 2024 1:49 pm
JohnHurt wrote: Fri Jan 19, 2024 9:02 am Nearly every home has security cameras, and a security system. Same for church buildings.
Does anyone have reliable numbers for this? I found a source that said about half of homes have security cameras. I haven't found a source for church buildings.
Around this part of the country, the proportion would be much less than half. None in the church, although we are thinking about it as an allegation of sexual abuse in the church building years ago recently came to light.
0 x
User avatar
JohnHurt
Posts: 864
Joined: Sun Mar 19, 2017 8:04 pm
Location: Buffalo Valley, TN
Affiliation: Primitive Christian
Contact:

Re: Meanwhile, back in the United States ...

Post by JohnHurt »

For structure fires, the FBI is clearing by arrest or exceptional means a total of 28.1% of all arsons:

https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/20 ... able-2.xls

"Exceptional means" indicates that the perpetrator was identified but could not be arrested due to death or other reasons:

https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/20 ... clearances

It would be interesting to see the FBI arson clearing stats on churches. If they are the same clearing percentages as the arson for other structures, then the media is hyping the church fires up for political purposes.

If there is a significantly lower clearance of church fire arsonists, then there is a problem with the FBI.

I would think it is the media hyping this situation, and not a problem with the FBI. You also have other government agencies, like the State Fire Marshall's office that would be involved. There is usually not a lack of government response with these fires.

It is most likely another media circus.
0 x
"He replaced the teachings of Christ with his own opinions, and gave us a religion based on the doctrines of men."
Post Reply