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OK - I'll admit it, for many reasons (not least my life and career journey I suspect) I'm an intuitionalist.

That being said, as an outside observer, it makes no sense to me whatsoever why the Republican Party would look to Jim Jordan, an illiberal ideologue and proven election denier with a "burn the place down" mentality, to lead the party in getting anything positive or helpful done for conservatism in Washington. Thus, I appreciate the 20 or so Republican Congressmen and women who have thus-far shown the strength of conviction not to yield to his candidacy.

Dan Z wrote: ↑Thu Oct 19, 2023 5:12 pm That being said, as an outside observer ...

You very narrowly escaped being represented by Mr. Jordan a few years ago.

Dan Z wrote: ↑Thu Oct 19, 2023 5:12 pm OK - I'll admit it, for many reasons (not least my life and career journey I suspect) I'm an intuitionalist.

That being said, as an outside observer, it makes no sense to me whatsoever why the Republican Party would look to Jim Jordan, an illiberal ideologue and proven election denier with a "burn the place down" mentality, to lead the party in getting anything positive or helpful done for conservatism in Washington. Thus, I appreciate the 20 or so Republican Congressmen and women who have thus-far shown the strength of conviction not to yield to his candidacy.

In stark contrast to the Democrats, the Republicans seem to empower their most extreme fringe. That is how we got to this place in the first place. A few fringe Congressmen were empowered to bring down the speaker and now they don't have any viable replacement.

By contrast, the Democratic leadership in the House is tightly controlled by veteran mainstream types. The don't let fringe types like Rashida Talib, OAC, or Ilhan Ohmar make policy or determine who their speaker is.

Who knows how this is all going to end. We are completely off the map at this point. My own guess is that we wind up back with Kevin McCarthy. Who has gotten more votes than any other alternative. But that will take the rest of the Republican caucus getting fed up enough to force Gaetz and his small band of radicals back in line. Or else cutting some deal with the Democrats to get a few Democratic votes to get McCarthy over the top.

I don't think it will be Jordan. He is too unpopular. There are enough mainstream Republicans who don't like his scorched earth tactics so he seems to be bleeding support not gaining it. They are smart enough to know that if he is going to run a leadership election this way, he'll run the House the same way. And they want no part of that.

But who knows? No one at this point I suspect.

ohio jones wrote: ↑Thu Oct 19, 2023 6:19 pm

Dan Z wrote: ↑Thu Oct 19, 2023 5:12 pm That being said, as an outside observer ...

You very narrowly escaped being represented by Mr. Jordan a few years ago.

And you weren’t so fortunate…

Ken wrote: ↑Thu Oct 19, 2023 6:34 pm

In stark contrast to the Democrats, the Republicans seem to empower their most extreme fringe.

Oh, the Democrats do that too.

I personally think Jim Jordan would be a good speaker. I have listened to several committees he was on and I liked his presentation.

Don't get caught up on how the media paints him.

My representative has ben one of the hold out votes. I actually sent him a message on X and said I would not vote for him if he does not vote to instate Jordan as speaker.

Dan Z wrote: ↑Thu Oct 19, 2023 6:52 pm

ohio jones wrote: ↑Thu Oct 19, 2023 6:19 pm

Dan Z wrote: ↑Thu Oct 19, 2023 5:12 pm That being said, as an outside observer ...

You very narrowly escaped being represented by Mr. Jordan a few years ago.

And you weren’t so fortunate…

Actually I was, and even with a one-county buffer. But the latest regerrymandering has kaptured my county in an urban Democratic district, which has a latta people upset.

One concern I have about the ongoing collapse of the right is the lack of a meaningful counterbalance may activate and energize the lefty left.

barnhart wrote: ↑Thu Oct 19, 2023 10:16 pm One concern I have about the ongoing collapse of the right is the lack of a meaningful counterbalance may activate and energize the lefty left.

I'm not sure what your concern is. The House is still in GOP hands no matter how incompetently they manage their speaker election. The left has zero power in the House.

In any event, no significant legislation will get through Congress regardless of the state of the House without reaching 60 votes in the Senate and that means gathering up 8 or so Republican votes.

Dan Z wrote: ↑Thu Oct 19, 2023 5:12 pm That being said, as an outside observer, it makes no sense to me whatsoever why the Republican Party would look to Jim Jordan, an illiberal ideologue and proven election denier with a "burn the place down" mentality, to lead the party in getting anything positive or helpful done for conservatism in Washington.

I think many others in the party also have the "burn the place down" mentality believing that the government is the problem and it is better for it to be dysfunctional. This probably isn't a majority of the party, but the political pressure from this faction may be hard to resist.

barnhart wrote: ↑Thu Oct 19, 2023 10:16 pm One concern I have about the ongoing collapse of the right is the lack of a meaningful counterbalance may activate and energize the lefty left.

I think the country is best served by two healthy parties with different perspectives, working together. Extremists on either end are a problem.

Jim Jordan has done a lot to disrupt things, but he has passed almost no bills in 16 years, and he has done very little to try to build consensus or work together with others to identify problems and solve them. He thrives on negative attention, and that's basically his personal brand. Case in point: he is happy to close down the House entirely, at a time that it is sorely needed, in order to strong-arm people and try to force the House to accept him.

I don't want a government that can't do anything but fight with each other. Jordan seems like a bad pick. "Burn the place down" doesn't build a better future for anyone.

GOP will remain in control of the House. They can surely find someone better than Jim Jordan.