Is it OK to refer to MAGA by name?

[GaryK]

The inconsistency in what you say versus what you practice on MN is evidence to me that it really is pointless to discuss earthly politics from a Christian perspective. Jesus could never have been an earthly politician because His Kingdom is not of this world. IMO, politics cannot be made Christian, so why try?

You're right that Jesus never was nor could be a politician... but he did discuss political things, all the time. It's one reason, maybe among many, that the religious leaders hated Him so much. He addressed their political ambitions which they often veiled in religious/God talk. (kind of like today). You're right, that "politics cannot be made Christian", but Christians are allowed to, in fact called to, address politics, in a 'christian' way and from a Kingdom of God point of view.

If you are talking about the Jewish system Jesus addressed, I agree. But I don't believe Jesus saw the Jewish system as an earthly political system. I believe He saw it as a religious system that had digressed quite far from what God intended when He set it up under the OT covenants.

[Bootstrap]

The inconsistency in what you say versus what you practice on MN is evidence to me that it really is pointless to discuss earthly politics from a Christian perspective. Jesus could never have been an earthly politician because His Kingdom is not of this world. IMO, politics cannot be made Christian, so why try?

You're right that Jesus never was nor could be a politician... but he did discuss political things, all the time. It's one reason, maybe among many, that the religious leaders hated Him so much. He addressed their political ambitions which they often veiled in religious/God talk. (kind of like today). You're right, that "politics cannot be made Christian", but Christians are allowed to, in fact called to, address politics, in a 'christian' way and from a Kingdom of God point of view.

If you are talking about the Jewish system Jesus addressed, I agree. But I don't believe Jesus saw the Jewish system as an earthly political system. I believe He saw it as a religious system that had digressed quite far from what God intended when He set it up under the OT covenants.

A lot of that had to do with their accommodation to Roman authority and their politics, didn't it? Consider Herod.

[GaryK]

You're right that Jesus never was nor could be a politician... but he did discuss political things, all the time. It's one reason, maybe among many, that the religious leaders hated Him so much. He addressed their political ambitions which they often veiled in religious/God talk. (kind of like today). You're right, that "politics cannot be made Christian", but Christians are allowed to, in fact called to, address politics, in a 'christian' way and from a Kingdom of God point of view.

If you are talking about the Jewish system Jesus addressed, I agree. But I don't believe Jesus saw the Jewish system as an earthly political system. I believe He saw it as a religious system that had digressed quite far from what God intended when He set it up under the OT covenants.

A lot of that had to do with their accommodation to Roman authority and their politics, didn't it? Consider Herod.

And yet you don't find Jesus saying much at all about Roman authority, do you?

[GaryK]

Now if you decide to stop admonishing everyone else to be more Christlike in their responses to "the other side" then I really don't care what you label "the other side". To me it's not about finding a term that I do not consider snarky. Politics has always been snarky.

Could you be specific about what you mean by "snarky"?

And FWIW, is there ANY timing that will seem fair to the Trumpies? Can't do it while he's a candidate, can't do it while he's a president, can't do it when he is no longer a president, can't do it before the primaries when he is not yet a candidate (now), can't do it when he is a candidate again ... every single time period seems suspect to them.

I think that's a given. If Trump is held accountable for anything at all, ever, Trumpies will object.

[Grace]

One example: you really disliked it when I used the term Trumpies. In this thread, I am asking you what term to use. And it feels like you don't want to let me have a term I can use to refer to MAGA at all. Shrug. At that point, it doesn't feel like there's any term that I can use without offending you.

There are plenty of terms to use that aren't snarky, Starting with "some Trump supporters".

It wasn't long ago when you I was accused of being hateful because I used the term "Biden Crime Family". Yet using "MAGA-affiliated" folks who live in "MAGA-land", and are a party of the "MAGA side", Trumpies", isn't? Why not hold to the same standard that you frequently say others should use.

[Valerie]

Now if you decide to stop admonishing everyone else to be more Christlike in their responses to "the other side" then I really don't care what you label "the other side". To me it's not about finding a term that I do not consider snarky. Politics has always been snarky.

Could you be specific about what you mean by "snarky"?

And FWIW, is there ANY timing that will seem fair to the Trumpies? Can't do it while he's a candidate, can't do it while he's a president, can't do it when he is no longer a president, can't do it before the primaries when he is not yet a candidate (now), can't do it when he is a candidate again ... every single time period seems suspect to them.

I think that's a given. If Trump is held accountable for anything at all, ever, Trumpies will object.

Pretty good belittling going on here. Mocking is not becoming of a Christian it is one thing that bothers me about Trump is his mocking/name calling even if it's to make a point, but to hear it from professing Christians is no different than my fb friends who poked fun & name called supporters. Of course we've been referred to as deorables by Dems. Again, not by a Christian.

[Josh]

The inconsistency in what you say versus what you practice on MN is evidence to me that it really is pointless to discuss earthly politics from a Christian perspective. Jesus could never have been an earthly politician because His Kingdom is not of this world. IMO, politics cannot be made Christian, so why try?

You're right that Jesus never was nor could be a politician... but he did discuss political things, all the time. It's one reason, maybe among many, that the religious leaders hated Him so much. He addressed their political ambitions which they often veiled in religious/God talk. (kind of like today). You're right, that "politics cannot be made Christian", but Christians are allowed to, in fact called to, address politics, in a 'christian' way and from a Kingdom of God point of view.

In fact, when we do not do this, I think politics has a tendency to take over churches. It certainly did that in Nazi Germany. I think I have seen that happen to MC-USA on the left and to the Southern Baptist Convention on the right.

Two-state theology has been an important foundation for Mennonites, both the Sattler and the Marpeck variety.

Yet oddly enough this hasn’t happened at all to the Amish, various conservative Mennonites, GBs…

[Neto]

In your prior post we were told to focus on the "Kingdom of God versus various political movements". Yet, then we were asked for a descriptive word for the political movement MAGA. You can criticize the MAGA political movement all you want. However don't come back and tell the rest of us we need to focus on the Kingdom of God and not political movements.

And I have discussed MAGA. The acronym Stands for Make America Great Again. It represents millions of people who believe in a good economy, low inflation, strong borders, affordable housing, energy independence, no proxy war, etc.

My outsider's understanding of it is that the basic idea or philosophy is "America First". My impression is that that's fine as a political ambition, but it doesn't mesh with Kingdom life. (But then no kind of politics does, in my opinion. Now I'll butt out of the politics section. Admittedly a sort of "hit & run" action. )

I understand where you are coming from. However the President or leader of any country is supposed to protect his own country first imo. In fact, by so doing thT nation or country is stronger then and is in more of a position to help others. Let's just take the border crisis. Trump has repeatedly contended for "legal" entry I to our country. It is for the protection of all. We have a legal system in place for this for good reason. That is not selfish. It is wise. It is careful. ALL kinds of harmful & evil people are mixing in the crossing and they're coming from many countries through the masses. We have been dealing with the vastly increasing deaths from illegal drugs. We know there are terrorists looking for opportunity. We k ow there's potential for many to be harmed. Trump was sick of the border CRISIS to continue ue.

Personally, I do not expect Mexico's president to have a Christian attitude & put us before his own country, do you?

The border crisis is just ONE of the many issues.

In 1976 i had an Ecology class teacher say "America is a lifeboat, but if a lifeboat takes on too many it will sink" That stuck with me.
MAGA fits- being "Great" means we need to clean up our act in an abundance damce of ways, to restore some values. People may disagree on which values. Everyone e agrees we need to do better.

If you are asking for a political opinion, then I already crossed that line by saying what I have now set in bold above, for this response. I am politically non-participant, so I don't see any point in saying more. I only intended to say how I understand the political philosophy behind the MAGA movement, and only said what I did beyond that to make it clear that I did not intend it as a negative comment.

[Neto]

You're right that Jesus never was nor could be a politician... but he did discuss political things, all the time. It's one reason, maybe among many, that the religious leaders hated Him so much. He addressed their political ambitions which they often veiled in religious/God talk. (kind of like today). You're right, that "politics cannot be made Christian", but Christians are allowed to, in fact called to, address politics, in a 'christian' way and from a Kingdom of God point of view.

In fact, when we do not do this, I think politics has a tendency to take over churches. It certainly did that in Nazi Germany. I think I have seen that happen to MC-USA on the left and to the Southern Baptist Convention on the right.

Two-state theology has been an important foundation for Mennonites, both the Sattler and the Marpeck variety.

Yet oddly enough this hasn’t happened at all to the Amish, various conservative Mennonites, GBs…

However, my wife & I were rather puzzled to see a group of Amish girls carrying large US flags (on horseback) in the Fall Festival parade here in Berlin last week-end. (But probably not members, so there is the difference, perhaps.)

[Josh]

Is displaying an American flag considered “politics taking over”? Isn’t a national flag politically neutral?