US Supreme Court in 2023

[Ken]

So, according to you, since Goshen and EMU’s founding, they were built by the pro-divorce, pro-LGBT liberal wing of the old MC?

Here we go with the strawmen again. Which is your pattern when you are wrong about things.

Feel free to take issue with anything that I actually wrote.

[Josh]

So, according to you, since Goshen and EMU’s founding, they were built by the pro-divorce, pro-LGBT liberal wing of the old MC?

Here we go with the strawmen again. Which is your pattern when you are wrong about things.

Feel free to take issue with anything that I actually wrote.

Yet Goshen and EMU and AMBS all ended up being the vanguard for the most extreme pro homosexual elements of the old MC and GC, despite the majority of what was then MC and GC not holding that position. So how did that happen?

You keep criticising conservatives and plain people for not embracing higher education. Could you point us to a plan for higher education that doesn’t result in becoming a pro homosexuality indoctrination facility?

[Ernie]

Conversely, institutions that evangelical fundamentalists built have been stolen by liberals. Look at Goshen and EMU.

That is an absurd statement and not remotely accurate.

For their entire history, both Goshen and EMU have ridden squarely in mainstream of the mainstream Mennonite Church which has now become MC-USA. And for their entire history there has been tension between conservatives and liberals within both the churches themselves and colleges. These are not colleges that were built by evangelical fundamentalists. They were built by Mennonites who have always ranged from liberal to conservative. And far more effort and money was put into building those institutions by people on the liberal side of the Mennonite Church rather than the conservative side who questioned the need for colleges in the first place.

Yes, Kauffman and company were considered liberal at their time, even though they were fundamentalists.

And just because an institution has been mainstream all its life does not mean... well.... really... anything.
All you can say is, "the institution used to operate by this set of principles, and now they operated by a different set of principles." And you can list the principles and identify the origins of the ideas behind those principles.

[Ken]

Yes, Kauffman and company were considered liberal at their time, even though they were fundamentalists.

And just because an institution has been mainstream all its life does not mean... well.... really... anything.

All you can say is, "the institution used to operate by this set of principles, and now they operated by a different set of principles." And you can list the principles and identify the origins of the ideas behind those principles.

From the college's own web site. Which part of this do you think is new and different and in conflict with the original principles of the college?

From its inception, Goshen College has been known for its high ideals and energetic vision, inspired by a deep desire to prepare students as engaged church leaders and responsible world citizens. Soon after establishing the Goshen campus in 1903, President Noah Byers suggested a college motto that has stood the test of time: “Culture for Service.” This motto has inspired generations of students to follow the example of Jesus as they equip themselves for lives of service.

In 2002, the college re-articulated the core values that have long been woven into the cultural fabric of the institution: We are a Christ-centered community committed to passionate learning, global citizenship, compassionate peacemaking and servant-leadership.

A sense of vibrant connectedness to the larger world has been integral to the college since its beginnings, when three students were sent to India for mission and famine relief work in 1898. One of the college’s distinctive features is its Study-Service Term (SST) program, which was started in 1968 as a cutting-edge international education program, built on the experiences of many faculty members who had lived, studied and served abroad.

One of the college’s distinctive features is its Study-Service Term program, which was implemented in 1968 as a cutting-edge international education program. Since then, more than 8,000 students and 230 faculty members have journeyed to 25 countries significantly different from the United States through the semester-long, immersion experience of SST, which features the uncommon combination of cultural education and service-learning. And in 2023, after a 20 year journey, the U.S. Department of Education designated the college as a Hispanic-Serving Institution.

Today, more than 20,000 Goshen College alumni, reside throughout the world in more than 85 countries, and the campus has expanded to 135 acres with 19 major buildings. The college now offers 40 majors and 49 minors of academic study, as well as select graduate programs, with quality professional programs and facilities. In addition to academic programs, co-curriculars, internships, athletics and religious life programs offer students rich and balanced opportunities for personal, intellectual, spiritual, physical, social and professional growth.

The college has long been guided by a Christian theology of creation care and good stewardship of both environmental and financial resources. Merry Lea Environmental Learning Center of Goshen College annually hosts more than 7,000 school children for educational programs on its 1,189-acre natural sanctuary. In 2008 its ecological field station – Rieth Village – received the 42nd Platinum rating in the country from the U.S. Green Building Council’s Leadership in Energy and Environmental Design (LEED) program. The college offers various related undergraduate majors in environmental science and a master’s degree in environmental education. And in 2007, President Jim Brenneman signed the American College & University Presidents’ Climate Commitment to work toward a carbon neutral campus.

Much has changed since the college’s beginnings, but the familiar sound of train whistles brings a reminder that many things remain the same. Goshen College – rooted in the Anabaptist tradition of answering Christ’s call to reconciliation, community and service in the world – is thriving as a liberal arts college pursuing exceptional academic inquiry.

[Josh]

How much student debt do they saddle their students with?

And that list of things is basically identical to any other liberal arts school. Nothing distinctively Anabaptist at all, really.

[RZehr]

From the college's own web site. Which part of this do you think is new and different and in conflict with the original principles of the college?

From its inception, Goshen College has been known for its high ideals and energetic vision, inspired by a deep desire…

…Much has changed since the college’s beginnings, but the familiar sound of train whistles brings a reminder that many things remain the same. Goshen College – rooted in the Anabaptist tradition of answering Christ’s call to reconciliation, community and service in the world – is thriving as a liberal arts college pursuing exceptional academic inquiry.

Much has changed but I guess we are to be content with the train whistle staying the same. I bet they’d have changed that too, if they could get the Norfolk Southern to quit causing a racket.

[Ken]

From the college's own web site. Which part of this do you think is new and different and in conflict with the original principles of the college?

From its inception, Goshen College has been known for its high ideals and energetic vision, inspired by a deep desire…

…Much has changed since the college’s beginnings, but the familiar sound of train whistles brings a reminder that many things remain the same. Goshen College – rooted in the Anabaptist tradition of answering Christ’s call to reconciliation, community and service in the world – is thriving as a liberal arts college pursuing exceptional academic inquiry.

Much has changed but I guess we are to be content with the train whistle staying the same. I bet they’d have changed that too, if they could get the Norfolk Southern to quit causing a racket.

Well yes. We no longer live in 1898. Not even the Amish.

[ohio jones]

At least they have labs. Goshen that is, not sure about the Supreme Court.