The Sociology of Team Loyalty

[Ken]

But this particular point has nothing to do with Christianity. It is about political group loyalty and partisanship. And in the context of that discussion, both gay marriage and no-fault divorce are clearly centrist policies supported by a broad majority of Americans rather than just a political fringe.

Actually, no they aren't. I don't think it's "partisan" to think fatherless children, having children out of wedlock, and no fault divorce are bad things. They are very bad things. That's not a political position or a political statement.

Much as Josh might wish that was not the case, it is.

No one ever promised that TRUE Christianity would be popular. Of course that leaves a whole other discussion about where fighting about these issues rank in priority compared to others like helping the poor, feeding the hungry, healing the sick, being peacemakers, and everything else that Jesus taught.

Ken, one of the rudest and most hurtful things about how liberals treat conservative Christians is how you just assume that Christian conservatives don't help the poor, feed the hungry, help the sick, or try to be peacemakers. Indeed you seem to think you have a monopoly on what Jesus taught. It essentially boils down to, "I don't really believe in Jesus as the Son of God and the only hope for mankind, but I'll tell you what I think he taught and then I'll criticise you because you don't practice my version of what it would be that I don't even practice myself".

It may be true that the "centrist" position is that it's OK to cheat on your wife, have children out of wedlock, and get an abortion. But those things are wrong and will ultimately destroy a society.

Oh stop. I said no such thing and you know it. I said we can debate where the three "culture war" issues that you cited rank in the overall teachings of Jesus. Nothing more than that.

[Franklin]

I am sorry but this thread misses the point. While I think the charges against Trump are nonsense, this isn't the point. The point is that the Democratic Party have established a pattern of ruthless evil over the last few years, and the Trump trial is just another example in a long line of examples. I am most annoyed with the Republicans for being spineless and not understanding that this is war, and that Republicans should be totally ruthless and without morals when dealing with Democrats. The only real solution to the current situation is described in Genesis 13, namely separation. Until that solution can be implemented, this is the correct response:



One point that I disagree with in this video is calling Democrats "Communists". In fact Democrats are Fascists. The communists side with the workers against big business. The Democrats and Fascists side with big business against the workers.

One last point is that all this has almost nothing to do with Trump. I despise Trump. The issue here is the pure evil of Democrats, and how to deal with this evil.

This is another example of what I write about in the OP.

No, actually this is the inverse of your OP. Maybe I should have been clearer. In this case, I waited for the facts to come out before posting what I did. I waited for the charges to be revealed at which point it became undeniable that this case is a political hit job. This is what your OP calls "wisdom". But in the future I will be what you call "tribal" but what I call inductive reasoning. With this case, in combination with all of its other recent crimes, the Democratic Party has established itself as a purely evil criminal organization. So now I can use inductive reasoning to predict that everything that democrats will say will be lies and everything that they do will be evil. Do you oppose inductive reasoning?

[Ken]

With this case, in combination with all of its other recent crimes, the Democratic Party has established itself as a purely evil criminal organization. So now I can use inductive reasoning to predict that everything that democrats will say will be lies and everything that they do will be evil. Do you oppose inductive reasoning?

Uh, no. All this case established is that Trump is accused of 34 felony counts in a court of law.

The Democratic party has not been accused or found guilty of anything. Nor is there the slightest shred of evidence that this case is a political prosecution or that the Democratic party had anything to do with it. There is no evidence or even any hint of evidence that Bragg consulted with or coordinated with any Democratic Party officials in any of this. Falsification of business records is actually the most commonly prosecuted financial crime dealt with by the Manhattan DA and they deal with more of those prosecutions than any other jurisdiction because the financial markets and so many finance and banking firms are there. They also win over 99% of their cases so they appear to know what they are doing. So there is probably a greater than 99% chance that Trump is guilty.

How about you use your inductive reasoning to conclude that if the leader of the Republican party is a criminal and a liar then all Republicans are criminals and liars and everything THEY say will be evil.
'

[Bootstrap]

But this particular point has nothing to do with Christianity. It is about political group loyalty and partisanship. And in the context of that discussion, both gay marriage and no-fault divorce are clearly centrist policies supported by a broad majority of Americans rather than just a political fringe.

I think this has a lot to do with Christianity. How did Jesus relate to those who do wrong in a society that was off track? We should do the same.

[Josh]

If a majority of people support something evil that doesn’t mean as Christians we should support it. Quite the opposite.

[Robert]

Could you clarify who is doing this?

Most of those posting.

Those who take up right wing talking points continue to defend rightwing people and policies.
Those who take up left wing talking points continue to defend leftwing people and policies.

Right here on this thread...

The forcetribe is strong in these ones.

For some, being right is more important that being relational. I know the feeling. I have been there. I am sure I will go there again in the future on some issue. For some reason we feel we have a lot to loose or gain with the politics of the world. What we focus on, we get more of.

Well, off to the funny and garden threads. Might post a picture of our ducks too.

[temporal1]

If a majority of people support something evil that doesn’t mean as Christians we should support it.
Quite the opposite.

Flip-flops can be entertaining.
Libs LOVE heralding minority causes, ever waving self-righteous banners, victimhood, even claims of Christianity, to prevail.

Once there, once succeeding in accomplishing some definition of “centrist” or majority status, without a breath, in the same breath, the new mantra becomes, “we’re the majority! - naturally, we win!” STEP ASIDE!

Heads we win, tails, we win.

Once Christianity becomes a clear minority, may we look forward to becoming legal and cultural super-citizens?
i’ve been waiting for many years to qualify for “almighty” minority status.

i agree with you. Jesus did not arrive looking for the majority to follow. He certainly could have.

[steve-in-kville]

Team loyalty is supporting your team even when they are losing. I have several coworkers that are huge sports fans. Even when their favorite team doesn't make the play off's, the attitude typically is "better luck next year."

[temporal1]

Team loyalty is supporting your team even when they are losing. I have several coworkers that are huge sports fans. Even when their favorite team doesn't make the play off's, the attitude typically is "better luck next year."

i live near a big state university, college sports are STRONG in this area, showing up everywhere, including in business, strongly in business. my husband was a big fan of college sports, esp basketball and football; alumni donations are BIG business.

i enjoyed being with him at sporting events. after he passed, i ended season tickets and alumni donations.
i had “other-worldly” thoughts as i sat on the 50 yard line, watching crowds of 70,000 enthusiastic fans cheer on their teams.
it’s quite a production. unapologetic tribalism. encouraged tribalism.

but, really. what is the ripple effect after the games end? it goes on+on .. it’s tribalism. pro sports are the same.
it’s training for how we live the rest of our lives. in business, politics ..

it’s a conundrum. students go to college to learn and learn to think. then are strongly encouraged to primitive tribalism. which doesn’t require diplomas or degrees of any description.

i did not bother my husband with my thoughts. a lot of people really enjoy this stuff. other college departments can become annoyed with the money involved/generated via college sports.

anyway. yes, i believe what happens in tribal college sports directly affects the mentality of graduates who go on to gainful employment, taking their alma mater souveniers and invitations to donate along with them.

being loyal is an honorable trait, esp in hard times. being loyal without question can be a pitfall. it becomes something else.
if only it stayed in the stadiums.

[Ken]

I think universities drum up a lot of that school spirit stuff in order to raise money from alumni. I know I have gotten endless fundraising letters and phone calls from my alma matter including one a week or two ago despite the fact that I graduated decades ago.

And it is like a multi-level marketing scheme where they try to suck you into higher and higher levels of spending with the club concourse seating, special perks, etc. At UW you have to make thousands of dollars of donations to the university before you are even eligible to buy season tickets in the good sections of the stadium.

The most egregious new trend is that some universities are cutting deals with online sports betting companies and they advertise gambling to students INSIDE the stadium. It is all about the money. Here is Michigan State advertising online sports betting on your phone to students inside its own stadium with the 'Official Sports Betting Partner of Spartan Athletics, Caesar's Casino"

It is all rotten to the core