A hero of our time: Tou Thao

[Grace]

Floyd served eight jail terms on various charges,between 1997 and 2005, including drug possession, theft, and trespass. He pointed his gun at the pregnant belly of a woman he was robbing. He didn't deserve to die, but neither should he be labeled a hero as many have made him to be. I am NOT defending what Chauvin did, but could it be that the police get so tired of criminals like Floyd who are in and out of prison for various crimes, who harm others, and he allowed emotion/anger to control him and he lost it.

[Valerie]

Guten tag, PetrC.

PetrC:
.. Plea deals are as American as apple pie ..

i would word it, “secular law” has become as American as apple pie.

Sorry to say, the reality is BOLDLY reflected even on this forum, the influence may be impossible to extract from (our) brains.
It’s a deep shame how love of human legal reasoning, esp “the end justifies the means,” has eclipsed Jesus-modeled honor, self-sacrifice .. with love of self and (cough) pride.

It’s chilling to recognize how much of this was inadvertantly put in process in the 1960’s; but, heavens, it was (law school educated) WJ Clinton as POTUS, that personified it, putting it all on steroids, ripple effects have not ended.

To think, NIXON’s resignation may have been the last of the last of its kind in U.S. politics.
No resignation for WJC! - o.no. not on his radar. It’s all about manipulating legal language, continuing in pride, no matter what.

i see this as abandoning any semblance of worship and submission to God, replaced with worship of self, seeking after human law/human reasoning/government as god. A false god.

There is much to grieve.

Szd:
.. He’s not a hero.

Neither is/was George Floyd.
All lives matter, even lives of sinners and criminals.

In this case, i’m dumbfounded police unions were not held materially accountable for returning a recognized bad apple to active duty, which resulted in a death of a resisting criminal under arrest. Stop this union practice of directly enabling the incompetent and corrupt, it might quickly end these incidents. Unions are known for this.

i’m NOT against unions, per se.
NO human endeavor can be trusted to be faultless, all require strict accountability, or evil will settle in.
Unions demand loyalty. The human-contrived recipe for disaster.

What some of our neighbors are saying:

DOC RICH / CANDACE OWENS
The media is LYING to you about George Floyd and Ma'Khia Bryant / -22min



TY SMITH / CANDACE OWENS
Breaking News! Candace Owens documentary -The Greatest Lie Ever Told George Floyd & the Rise of BLM / -10min


PetrC,
i believe the root of what you’re saddened by is the turn away from Jesus-centered honor, on personal and cultural levels,
to seek after secular pride and “the end justifies the means.”

It’s a grave twist, there is no bottom to the secular pit.

Thank you for sharing Candace Owen's videos

[RZehr]

I don't think it matters what Chauvin's intentions were. I doubt he woke up in the morning with premeditated murder in his heart. But as Bootstrap point out, shooting someone because of an argument is still murder even if you didn't intend to do it. I think manslaughter is usually related to neglect.

I do think Chauvin demonstrated a disregard for Floyd's life and I think the charges and conviction were appropriate.

I think intent is always important. And for a "justice" system to disregard intent, is unjust.

How do you objectively prove intent in a court of law? Is it enough for Chauvin to say, “Oops, I didn’t mean to do it?”

This isn’t a court of law. You are allowed to have an opinion on intent.

Chauvin richly deserves to be in prison, just based on his lack of respect and humanity. It’s time that the police are held to account.

And Floyd was irrational in the extreme, probably on drugs, hyperventilating with irrational fear. He wasn’t cooperating, he is 6’ 4”, and explaining that he had Covid, has claustrophobia, that he couldn’t breath, long before the knee came. Up until this point the officers haven’t used excessive force. But as Floyd keeps hyperventilating for seemingly no rational reason, it seems like he is just being uncooperative.
He would not get in the car, and when they did manage to get him in, he bailed back out, saying he couldn’t breathe. As he flopped out of the car, handcuffed, the officers subdued him. And he continued to frantically resist and couldn’t breathe.

This is just a really tragic happening. And as long as we have people who behave irrationally while being uncooperative, to police officers who are used to getting away with everything, and being allowed to lie to the public, and getting away with who knows what all, these events will continue.

I certainly would not trust the police very far.

[Bootstrap]

Floyd served eight jail terms on various charges,between 1997 and 2005, including drug possession, theft, and trespass. He pointed his gun at the pregnant belly of a woman he was robbing. He didn't deserve to die, but neither should he be labeled a hero as many have made him to be.

I think there is a HUGE difference between:

1. Saying this killing was an outrage, and
2. Saying Floyd was a hero.

Floyd was clearly a victim, though. A victim of a murder. And 2005 was 15 years before this happened - people do change. Floyd was still struggling with drug and alcohol, sometimes doing better, sometimes doing worse, but that doesn't justify killing him.

I am NOT defending what Chauvin did, but could it be that the police get so tired of criminals like Floyd who are in and out of prison for various crimes, who harm others, and he allowed emotion/anger to control him and he lost it.

Are you defending what he did and saying it was understandable?

Or do you agree that police who do this kind of thing need to be put in jail? Police should not kill people because they lose control of their emotion.

[temporal1]

Okay, whatever. But I don't believe that you don't have any opinion on whether Derek C. intended for Floyd to die that day.

boot:
Floyd was clearly a victim, though. A victim of a murder.

The prosecution doesn’t rest?

[RZehr]

I am NOT defending what Chauvin did, but…

Are you defending what he did…?

[Bootstrap]

I am NOT defending what Chauvin did, but…

Are you defending what he did…?

Interesting phrase, isn't it? This kind of phrase is often a way to deny responsibility for doing exactly what they claim not to be doing.

• "I'm not one to complain, but ..." usually means "I'm going to complain now".
• "I don't like to gossip, but ..." usually means "I have some really juicy gossip and I can't wait to share it with you".
• "I'm not trying to be rude, but ..."
• "I don't want to be judgmental, but ..."
• "I don't want to be nosy, but ..."
• "I'm not trying to start an argument, but ..."
• "I don't mean to be sarcastic, but ..."

It's sometimes called a "preemptive disclaimer".

[Szdfan]

Okay, whatever. But I don't believe that you don't have any opinion on whether Derek C. intended for Floyd to die that day.

boot:
Floyd was clearly a victim, though. A victim of a murder.

The prosecution doesn’t rest?

The protection did rest. Chauvin was found guilty by a jury of twelve people of 2nd and 3rd degree murder, as well as manslaughter. It's Matt Walsh and yourself who keep trying to poke holes into the conviction. Chauvin has appealed. His appeals have been denied. Unless some conclusive new evidence shows up that merits a retrial, this conviction is a done deal.

[temporal1]

boot to Grace:
Or do you agree that police who do this kind of thing need to be put in jail?
Police should not kill people because they lose control of their emotion.

Grace was speculating about loss of control, which is allowed, you’re increasing the speculation with your own speculation/bias, allowed.

i don’t sense Derek C lost control of his emotions. (he didn’t pull a gun or threaten with a gun? he legally could have?)
i didn’t see loss of control in the tapes i saw, which i believe were clips of tapes.
i don’t believe many saw the full tapes, in public, maybe none of us.

- - - - - - -

i almost did not view this tape below, i’m glad i did. Young men reacting to a VINCE EVERETT ELLISON interview:
These are not Anabaptists or COs.

CartierFamily / “Best Tucker Episode Ever.. Was BLM A Scam? George Floyd Autopsy Reveal Will Blow You Away”.. / 33min


https://yaf.org/people/vince-everett-ellison/

Author and Commentator
Vince Everett Ellison was born on a cotton plantation in Haywood County, Tennessee. His parents at that time were sharecroppers. Through hard work and a belief in Jesus Christ, his parents pulled him and his seven siblings out of poverty. His family started the Ellison Family Gospel singing group, where Vince sang and played multiple instruments as a child and young adult. Vince worked for five years as a Correctional Officer at the Medium/Maximum Kirkland Correctional Institution in Columbia, SC. Afterward, Vince worked in the nonprofit arena.

In 2000, Vince received the GOP nomination for the South Carolina 6th Congressional District. In 2019, Vince wrote The Iron Triangle: Inside the Liberal Democrat Plan to Use Race to Divide Christians and America in their Quest for Power and How We Can Defeat Them, and 25 Lies, which both became Amazon #1 bestsellers. Vince's upcoming book from Posthill/Simon & Schuster “Crime Inc., will be coming soon. He has appeared numerous times on Hannity, The Laura Ingraham Show, Newsmax, OAN, The Joe Pags Show, The Brian Kilmeade Show, The Howie Carr Show, and many other radio and television programs.

Vince is also the producer and writer of the upcoming documentary Will You Go To Hell For Me scheduled for release on February 24th.

Vince is a member of Project 21 and has written numerous articles for American Greatness magazine, Bizpacreview.com, and other publications.

[temporal1]

Page 9:

boot:
In Minnesota, if you kill someone while trying to commit another felony, that can be considered murder. In this case, the other felony was assault.

Clearly, Chauvin intentionally assaulted Floyd,

and that resulted in Floyd's death.
I think a lot of people would consider that murder, even in colloquial usage.

i don’t think many of your “clearlys” are clear.

i’m not convinced that an active duty police officer, responding to someone resisting arrest, could easily be accused of assault.
That doesn’t mean they can “do anything” in the process, but i expect there’s a wide margin for police to achieve arrest and avoid being injured/killed.

You don’t have to like a guy while still believing he deserves to be treated fairly.