Amish Salve-maker in Jail, Facing Federal Prison

Events occurring and how they relate/affect Anabaptist faith and culture.
Post Reply
User avatar
mike
Posts: 5368
Joined: Wed Oct 19, 2016 10:32 pm
Affiliation: Conservative Menno

Re: Amish Salve-maker in Jail, Facing Federal Prison

Post by mike »

EdselB wrote:Porter's Liniment Salve--My mother was just talking about that the other week. It was a staple item in my grandparents' medicine cabinet. Grandpap used it to draw out things. He also went out to the woods each spring to cut sassafras root to make a tea to thin the blood. Drank some myself when I was young. Rather tasty. However, none of these beat the claims that I read in Die Botscahft about that virtues of B&W. Good for what ails you and helps you otherwise. :P
The manufacturer of B&W can't likely be held responsible for claims that resellers make in Botscahft ads. But I bet a shoo-fly pie that he is the source of many of them. :)
0 x
Remember the prisoners, as though you were in prison with them, and the mistreated, as though you yourselves were suffering bodily. -Heb. 13:3
User avatar
Jazman
Posts: 510
Joined: Sat Nov 05, 2016 7:30 am
Affiliation: Lanc Menno Conf

Re: Amish Salve-maker in Jail, Facing Federal Prison

Post by Jazman »

RZehr wrote:
Hats Off wrote:The injury healed with the burdock leaf treatment, but it may also have healed with time without the burdock treatment.
This is one of the problems I have with natural remedies. There just doesn't seem to be much double blind trials on this stuff. And without a baseline, these natural remedies just seem like a crap shoot to me.
Wade wrote:Keep in mind any natural health product can never be tested to the point of approval. There are too many variables within natural remedies. Each plant source can have a different amount of nutrients or toxins for medicinal purposes within depending on how they are grown. No two apples that are grown are exactly alike. And in order to reach certification the substance or product has to fit in very controlled guidelines to meet FDA regulations.
If there is too much variability in these things to be accurately tested, then how can they be considered medically consistent for people? Sounds like one batch might work and another batch might not be effective because of variability.
I'm not defending big pharmaceutical products. But it seems to me that they are held to a higher standard of proof than natural remedies. Of course there are cheaters - there is in any business.
But we don't each have enough time to prove every single medicine in life, so we depend on regulations and testing and trials done by others. If someone cheats, that doesn't mean that we should do without testing.
[my emphasis] And this is why I'm thankful for the FDA and other "big government" entities and why I'm continually disheartened when so many people (especially Christians) spend so much energy denigrating these institutions and scientists/researchers...(especially the current political/cultural anti-science, anti-expert atmosphere) Of course there's some overkill and missteps, but imo the good far outweighs the bad.
To close, I'll quote Edsel B;
"Caesar often demands more than what is his right to demand; he wants your ultimate allegiance, and your obedience; that only belongs to God, but on the other hand, where Caesar tells us to do things that do not contradict the law of God and our duty to God, even if we think they're stupid or inconvenient, we're honor-bound by God's command to obey them.
0 x
A history that looks back to a mythologized past as the country’s perfect time is a key tool of authoritarians. It allows them to characterize anyone who opposes them as an enemy of the country’s great destiny. - Heather Cox Richardson
joshuabgood
Posts: 2815
Joined: Fri Oct 21, 2016 5:23 pm
Affiliation: BMA

Re: Amish Salve-maker in Jail, Facing Federal Prison

Post by joshuabgood »

Generally I am in favor of folks being able to sell their products...quackery or not.

However, once you make the obviously fraudulent claim that your product "cures cancer" you cross over into another category. And the fact that you prey on people who are sick and feel hopeless is almost without excuse. And the fact that you are ignorant (perhaps believing falsely that your product "cures cancer") doesn't make much difference as you are responsible in this information age to apprise yourself before making such brash statements.
0 x
User avatar
mike
Posts: 5368
Joined: Wed Oct 19, 2016 10:32 pm
Affiliation: Conservative Menno

Re: Amish Salve-maker in Jail, Facing Federal Prison

Post by mike »

I know someone well who is in her late thirties and has breast cancer. A year ago, she observed a lump and went to some kind of herbalist or health practitioner who told her it was merely a cyst. She used whatever methods the herbalist prescribed for a year but it got worse and she finally went to a doctor a few weeks ago to learn that she has stage 2 cancer. Apparently it is treatable with chemotherapy, surgery, and radiation.

When I hear of these kinds of health practitioners and the false diagnoses and claims they make, and the consequences they have, it is hard not to get angry. I believe that there are such things as wrong diagnoses and wrong treatments that are a result of human error or incompetence. But there are also such things as lies and bold claims when one does not have the knowledge or tools to make a proper statement about something.
0 x
Remember the prisoners, as though you were in prison with them, and the mistreated, as though you yourselves were suffering bodily. -Heb. 13:3
User avatar
mike
Posts: 5368
Joined: Wed Oct 19, 2016 10:32 pm
Affiliation: Conservative Menno

Re: Amish Salve-maker in Jail, Facing Federal Prison

Post by mike »

Girod's trial supposedly is wrapping up today and a comment on a FB post says that he has been convicted of all charges. No official news about it yet that I could find. Some info (from a source likely biased in favor of the defendant) on the trial proceedings:

Trial Day 1:
http://www.kyfreepress.com/2017/02/fda- ... ial-day-1/

Trial Day 2:
http://www.kyfreepress.com/2017/03/tria ... rod-day-2/

Reading a bit on Day 2, it seems pretty apparent that Sam assumed a lot of things and didn't worry too much about informing his customers and resellers of FDA-mandated recalls. For example he told one of his resellers that turning over her records to the FDA would violate HIPAA which is not true. Not hard to see why he is getting the book thrown at him especially without the help of a lawyer.
0 x
Remember the prisoners, as though you were in prison with them, and the mistreated, as though you yourselves were suffering bodily. -Heb. 13:3
User avatar
Josh
Posts: 23813
Joined: Wed Oct 19, 2016 6:23 pm
Location: 1000' ASL
Affiliation: The church of God

Re: Amish Salve-maker in Jail, Facing Federal Prison

Post by Josh »

Sam then made a statement that God made the bloodroot plant complete, and when used whole there would be something good to counteract anything bad, but that wasn’t a question for the witness and was struck from the record.
That's definitely an interesting theological position.
0 x
ken_sylvania
Posts: 3969
Joined: Tue Nov 01, 2016 12:46 pm
Affiliation: CM

Re: Amish Salve-maker in Jail, Facing Federal Prison

Post by ken_sylvania »

A few gems from his previous filings:
Sam Girod on 05/09/2016 wrote:Now, comes the falsely accused, after removal of counsel, to hereby enters a Plea ofNonAssumpt by way of Confession. A plea was entered on behalf of not guilty and we will change that plea
to the more appropriate, Non-Assumpt by way of Confession.
I hope this finds you well,
Samuel, House of Girod
End of document
Now, comes the falsely accused, after removal of counsel, to hereby order the UNITED
STATES and any agencies thereof, specifically, but not limited to, the FDA to cease and desist, and
stand down from filing false and misleading document before this honorable court, effectively wasting
the time of the court and the accused in where no victim can be produced before the court. This is
shameful display of alleged Governmental overreach and must stop today.
Now, comes the falsely accused, after removal of counsel, to hereby Notice UNITED STATES
and any agencies thereof to the Fact, and Intent, that on or about May 10, 2016, we Intend to continue
to use Interstate commerce based upon this Honorable Courts decision and we have every lawful and
legal rite to do so.
"Our system, fostered by the Commerce Clause, is that every farmer and every craftsmen shall be
encouraged to produce by the certainty that he will have free access to every market in the Nation,
that no home embargos will withhold his exports; and no foreign state will by customs, duties
or regulations exclude them.
Likewise, every consumer may look to the free competition.from
every producing area in the Nation to protect him.from exploitation by any. Such was the vision of the
founders; such has been the Doctrine of this court which has given it reality. " H.P. Hood &Sons,
Inc.V. Du Mond, 336 U.S. 525,, 539; 69 S. Ct. 657, 665;93 L.Ed.865 (1949); Dennis v. Higgins, 439;
11 S. Ct. U.S. Neb., (1991)
To place this farmer under a home embargo is shameful display of alleged Governmental
overreach and stops tomorrow today.
Samuel Girod on 06/09/2016 wrote:The Plaintiff, UNITED STATES, through council, in another vain attempt to force Samuel to
stand as SAMUEL A. GIROD, an unincorporated creation, created by the Plaintiff, a PERSON and a
UNITED STATES CITIZEN and we believe this to be identity theft by deception, Samuel is not
representing himself, Samuel is himself. To re-present Samuel as anything other then a Man as
described in Scripture would be deceptive and easily confused with "men or other animals" as
described under 21 U.S.C., which has been agreed by both parties, 21 U.S.C. has no bearing in the
instant matter with the exception of § 335. Due to the fact that Due Process of Law under that title was
perverted and promptly ignored by all involved.
You can not legally or Lawfully salvage this Matter from self-destruction by the action or
inaction of the Plaintiffs employees. Making every claim under 21 U.S.C. Void, unless they want to talk
about any claim or claims under 18 U.S.C. without any reference to 21 U.S.C.. Our only question then
would have to be, why?
...
All the Kings horses and all the Kings men can not put this mess back together again and these
people know this to be true, due to the fact, of their ignorance of our Notice of Intent. Now, we have
established a Tacit agreement and we have our life back. Now, we need it in writing from the Court.
...
Again, agreed upon by both parties through tacit agreement. It's time to end this effort in
stupidity. Brought before this honorable court by the pharmaceutical companies Attorney's posing as a
Government agency.
.....
The Clerk of Court is hereby directed to cancel the pretrial motion hearing set for July 3th 2016
to save the valuable resources of the Court, that being the courts time. We will not be present at that
hearing. It is called upon for this Court to dismiss this matter and we can all call it a Day.
I hope this finds you well,
Samuel, House of Girod
0 x
User avatar
mike
Posts: 5368
Joined: Wed Oct 19, 2016 10:32 pm
Affiliation: Conservative Menno

Re: Amish Salve-maker in Jail, Facing Federal Prison

Post by mike »

ken_sylvania wrote:A few gems from his previous filings:
Quite interesting. Of course saying weird things is not a crime or we'd all be in trouble. But refusing to show up for court hearings is a bit of a problem.
0 x
Remember the prisoners, as though you were in prison with them, and the mistreated, as though you yourselves were suffering bodily. -Heb. 13:3
ken_sylvania
Posts: 3969
Joined: Tue Nov 01, 2016 12:46 pm
Affiliation: CM

Re: Amish Salve-maker in Jail, Facing Federal Prison

Post by ken_sylvania »

mike wrote:
ken_sylvania wrote:A few gems from his previous filings:
Quite interesting. Of course saying weird things is not a crime or we'd all be in trouble. But refusing to show up for court hearings is a bit of a problem.
I think that's what Sam is about to find out.
0 x
RZehr
Posts: 7024
Joined: Thu Oct 20, 2016 12:42 am
Affiliation: Cons. Mennonite

Re: Amish Salve-maker in Jail, Facing Federal Prison

Post by RZehr »

What a gong show.
Sam seems to be addressing every point that is not being made against him. But is he even denying that matter at hand, which my understanding is incorrect labeling?
0 x
Post Reply