Amish Salve-maker in Jail, Facing Federal Prison

[JohnHurt]

I also believe that whoever was injured by Mr. Girod should be the only persons able to press charges, and then only fine Mr. Girod for the amount of the actual damages inflicted on the injured person, not the "supposed potential damages to society as a whole" that is being dreamed up by some lawyer on retainer by Big Pharma.

This law of the injured being the only one able to bring a suit should also apply to the Pharmaceutical industry and Vaccine industry. (And it doesn't - you cannot sue a vaccine maker when you are damaged by a vaccine.)

I understand now why lawyers were banned in early America.

And you can't say it about lawyers and the legal profession any better than this:

Luke 11:(46) And he said, Woe unto you also, ye lawyers! for ye lade men with burdens grievous to be borne, and ye yourselves touch not the burdens with one of your fingers.

Still true, 2,000 years later.

[appleman2006]

I am curious how your justice system works. In our system by the time it gets to sentencing the decision of guilt or innocence as far as the law is concerned has already been decided. The only thing that happens at a sentencing hearing is the type of sentence that is to be meted out. In many cases the judge's hands are tied and he can only prescribe a variety of times within a preset minimum and maximum.

I am not clear here but it almost seems like people think him being released will be a determination of innocence whereas as I see it, if the judge could even do that it would simply be an act of mercy. And from my experience judges are usually not very merciful if there is still open defiance of the law and no admitting of guilt.

But I am aware you judicial system is a little more politically motivated so perhaps this is different.

[appleman2006]

I also believe that whoever was injured by Mr. Girod should be the only persons able to press charges, and then only fine Mr. Girod for the amount of the actual damages inflicted on the injured person, not the "supposed potential damages to society as a whole" that is being dreamed up by some lawyer on retainer by Big Pharma.

This law of the injured being the only one able to bring a suit should also apply to the Pharmaceutical industry and Vaccine industry. (And it doesn't - you cannot sue a vaccine maker when you are damaged by a vaccine.)

I understand now why lawyers were banned in early America.

And you can't say it about lawyers and the legal profession any better than this:

Luke 11:(46) And he said, Woe unto you also, ye lawyers! for ye lade men with burdens grievous to be borne, and ye yourselves touch not the burdens with one of your fingers.

Still true, 2,000 years later.

John rather than restating it in different words this is still how I feel about this case a repeat of what I said way back on page 2.

"I imagine that Amish man is feeling persecuted for being a small businessman and he just wants to be left alone to do his own thing which he thinks will never actually hurt anybody.
But here is the thing. If there were no regulations in these areas I am betting that his product would barely see the light of day as there would be tons of large companies doing something similar to what he his doing. In fact the market would probably be so full of these products that people would hardly notice his. Or the alternative may have happened which is just as likely if not more so.

The sheer volume of these products on the market would of already either proved that they do not really work or in some cases have even harmed people and so people may have learned to be really leery of this type of thing.

If you have a natural alternative health product that really is as great as you say it is then go through the regular legal means of marketing it. And if it really does work you will be wealthy beyond your wildest dreams if that is what you dream about. If what you dream about is just helping people you will have the ability to actually help far more people than you do now.
There are no short cuts to success and I am not sure that there should be."

[Josh]

Sentencing is entirely separate from judgment, just like the English and Canadian systems.

Given the offender's obstinance and possible mental issues, I suspect he will receive some kind of community release. The community isn't helping themselves though by insisting he did nothing wrong. A judge wants to see a safe environment that will help an offender not re-offend, not an environment full of enablers which means he'll be right back in the same courtroom.

[appleman2006]

Sentencing is entirely separate from judgment, just like the English and Canadian systems.

Given the offender's obstinance and possible mental issues, I suspect he will receive some kind of community release. The community isn't helping themselves though by insisting he did nothing wrong. A judge wants to see a safe environment that will help an offender not re-offend, not an environment full of enablers which means he'll be right back in the same courtroom.

Ok and in this case the judge would have the leeway of anything from total release to a considerable time in jail? Is that correct?

[ohio jones]

Ok and in this case the judge would have the leeway of anything from total release to a considerable time in jail? Is that correct?

He could probably sentence him to the time already served, which would amount to a release. I'm not really expecting the judge to be that lenient.

[appleman2006]

Ok and in this case the judge would have the leeway of anything from total release to a considerable time in jail? Is that correct?

He could probably sentence him to the time already served, which would amount to a release. I'm not really expecting the judge to be that lenient.

Yes sorry, That is what I meant. Time already served would I think be an option here if there was true remorse shown. I too am skeptical that a bunch of people from his community showing up here declaring he has done no wrong is going to help him much. Might actually hurt him.

[ken_sylvania]

I too am skeptical that a bunch of people from his community showing up here declaring he has done no wrong is going to help him much. Might actually hurt him.

I suspect you might be right.

[Bootstrap]

And you can't say it about lawyers and the legal profession any better than this:

Luke 11:(46) And he said, Woe unto you also, ye lawyers! for ye lade men with burdens grievous to be borne, and ye yourselves touch not the burdens with one of your fingers.

Umm ... try reading that passage in context to see what "lawyers" refers to in the passage.

Woes to the Pharisees and Lawyers

While Jesus was speaking, a Pharisee asked him to dine with him, so he went in and reclined at table. The Pharisee was astonished to see that he did not first wash before dinner. And the Lord said to him, “Now you Pharisees cleanse the outside of the cup and of the dish, but inside you are full of greed and wickedness. You fools! Did not he who made the outside make the inside also? But give as alms those things that are within, and behold, everything is clean for you.

“But woe to you Pharisees! For you tithe mint and rue and every herb, and neglect justice and the love of God. These you ought to have done, without neglecting the others. Woe to you Pharisees! For you love the best seat in the synagogues and greetings in the marketplaces. Woe to you! For you are like unmarked graves, and people walk over them without knowing it.”

One of the lawyers answered him, “Teacher, in saying these things you insult us also.” And he said, “Woe to you lawyers also! For you load people with burdens hard to bear, and you yourselves do not touch the burdens with one of your fingers. Woe to you! For you build the tombs of the prophets whom your fathers killed. So you are witnesses and you consent to the deeds of your fathers, for they killed them, and you build their tombs. Therefore also the Wisdom of God said, ‘I will send them prophets and apostles, some of whom they will kill and persecute,’ so that the blood of all the prophets, shed from the foundation of the world, may be charged against this generation, from the blood of Abel to the blood of Zechariah, who perished between the altar and the sanctuary. Yes, I tell you, it will be required of this generation. Woe to you lawyers! For you have taken away the key of knowledge. You did not enter yourselves, and you hindered those who were entering.”

As he went away from there, the scribes and the Pharisees began to press him hard and to provoke him to speak about many things, lying in wait for him, to catch him in something he might say.

[Judas Maccabeus]

Ok and in this case the judge would have the leeway of anything from total release to a considerable time in jail? Is that correct?

He could probably sentence him to the time already served, which would amount to a release. I'm not really expecting the judge to be that lenient.

The feds have minimum sentencing guidelines, and good ole' Jeff Sessions (Our Attorney General) has told his prosecutors not to undercharge or go lenient on criminals. My suspicion is that he will likely wind up in a federal pen. Pity, as this is a waste of money, and of someone's life that could likely do good, if he turns to another line of work. Could they send someone to smash his salve making equipment, and the to get his bishop to promise to discourage him from buying any more?

J.M.