Bunny Trails: Politics

[temporal1]

search 2017 inauguration riots, and/or, Disrupt J20.
i ignored all that at the time, as i’m ignoring the present “peaceful” protests.

the media is remarkably effective in grooming the masses to have no memory outside the moment.
memories should be encouraged. in history, human memory was important and valued.
i hope that’s not altogether forgotten (technology does not seem to be a friend to memory skills).

[temporal1]

.. It may come from the Democrats by way of their liberal social policies become involved mandatory. ..

One of the most heinous destructive methods is to claim scriptures support sin; for instance, twisting words to say abortion is a blessing, and other serious lies. People believe what they want to believe.

Appropriating scriptures, remaking them into the lib vision, is faster, more efficient, than changing laws. It enables+hastens changes in laws.

There can be no surprise about what’s ahead. There are no secrets.

[Ken]

.. It may come from the Democrats by way of their liberal social policies become involved mandatory. ..

One of the most heinous destructive methods is to claim scriptures support sin; for instance, twisting words to say abortion is a blessing, and other serious lies. People believe what they want to believe.

Appropriating scriptures, remaking them into the lib vision, is faster, more efficient, than changing laws. It enables+hastens changes in laws.

There can be no surprise about what’s ahead. There are no secrets.

I'm not sure who is claiming that the scriptures support sin. I've never heard that. But sin and law are rightly two separate spheres.

For example, Christian Conservatives like to claim that the Ten Commandments are the foundation of American Law. To the point of displaying them prominently in American courthouses. But how many of the Ten Commandments are actually expressed in American law? Do you know the answer without looking it up? Hint...just two. And they are the two that are universally expressed in the legal codes of every single country regardless of religion. So hardly of uniquely Christian origin.

Which is another example of why I support the longstanding Anabaptist tradition of disentangling faith and politics and maintaining a more rigid separation of church and state. And lesson I hope some churches will draw from the DC riots.

[Soloist]

Which is another example of why I support the longstanding Anabaptist tradition of disentangling faith and politics and maintaining a more rigid separation of church and state. And lesson I hope some churches will draw from the DC riots.

Do you vote? Our lives are a reflection of our belief.

[Ken]

Which is another example of why I support the longstanding Anabaptist tradition of disentangling faith and politics and maintaining a more rigid separation of church and state. And lesson I hope some churches will draw from the DC riots.

Do you vote? Our lives are a reflection of our belief.

Yes, I live in both worlds like everyone else. I also conduct commerce, use government-backed money rather than barter or some form of Christian script, drive on taxpayer funded highways, pay my taxes, follow the law, and so forth. We live in both worlds and can't escape it. Unless we escape to a desert island and live on fish and coconuts. But I'm not interested in using the legal system to impose my faith on others. And I'm not interested in the government regulating my faith.

[Soloist]

Yes, I live in both worlds like everyone else. I also conduct commerce, use government-backed money rather than barter or some form of Christian script, drive on taxpayer funded highways, pay my taxes, follow the law, and so forth. We live in both worlds and can't escape it. Unless we escape to a desert island and live on fish and coconuts. But I'm not interested in using the legal system to impose my faith on others. And I'm not interested in the government regulating my faith.

Yet you vote.

[Neto]

I was not intending to enter into this discussion at all, and I will say at the outset that I have read only a very small bit of what has been posted here already.

But two things came up today that I will mention here. One, an article from some years back regarding Mennonite responses to opposition they faced in Kansas during the first world war came up in a Mennonite History FaceBook group of which I am a member. Some of these men were your people, and some were mine. Some reacted in ways that would be championed by some here, and others would satisfy some different folks here. My point in posting this link is to help readers "get inside" of what has happened in the past around the question of response to living in the midst of violence.
https://www.kshs.org/p/kansas-historica ... Alyar0aXLs

(It might be well for those who are unfamiliar with what was happening with Mennonites in Russia in this same period to read up on that, too.)

The second thing is an email I received this morning (from a former missionary co-worker) who was actually at the rally to which this thread is referring.

I am writing to ask you to pray for our country and to warn you not to believe what you are hearing on news channels. I was at the rally and the violence started before those who listened to Trumps speech even arrived at the capital building. I want to be brief but be assured that although I was an eye-witness, I didn't break any laws or even cross the barricade line after it was taken down. This is a coup against Trump not by him. However, be aware that legal means are still underway to follow the legitimate election outcome. Much prayer is needed. There are turbulent times ahead and we are being silenced. ....
Please pray and remember that God is in control and He cares. May God be honored in all that takes place.

[Ken]

The Mennonites I know in Canada don't partake in the "free" health care here(Canadian healthcare funds abortions through tax money) The Mennonites, again in Canada I know, pay hospital bills out of pocket and support one another through brotherly love. Is this not how it is in other countries?

It depends on the country’s healthcare system. Here in the US, there are a number of options, including mutual aid or Mennonite run health insurance like Everence. In other countries with single-payer systems, it’s harder to do that. Of course abortion isn’t always the same cultural wedge issue that it’s here.

After reunification, the German Baptists took over a couple of former East German hospitals in Berlin-Brandenburg. I recall that it was controversial when these hospitals stopped providing abortions, but it wasn’t near the vehemence that it is in the US.

While abortion is controversial in more conservative Catholic counties (like Ireland), I get the sense that in general abortion is not the same culture war defining issue in other countries that it is in the US.

I think that's because most other countries don't have our winner-take-all 2-party system where culture war issues take on more resonance. In a multi-party parliamentary system you can have purer religious or conservative parties and then the compromises happen in the formation of governments between political party leaders. In the US the coalitions form within the parties themselves which makes those sorts of issues much more politically charged. So, for example, in a country like Italy there are about 12 different political parties and you can vote for the one that exactly matches your political and religious ideology and there really isn't much inter-party argument. The arguments are all out of the voters hands when multi-party coalitions are formed. But in the US the parties are broad coalition parties. Republicans range from libertarian business-types to Evangelical Christians to conservative Catholics, to country-club banker types from the Northeast. So litmus-test issues become much more important and are fought out much more in the primaries and general elections.

[Josh]

Came across this today and found it interesting: https://www.economist.com/middle-east-a ... her-faiths

Disenchanted Iranians are turning to other faiths

For father mansour, Christianity in Iran has all the excitement of the persecuted early church. In homes across the country he delivers his sermons in code, calling Jesus “Jamsheed”. He leads songs of praise in silence. “We lip-synch because we can’t worship out loud,” he says. The risks are great: proselytisation is banned; dozens of missionaries have been jailed. But so too are the spiritual rewards. Local pastors report hundreds of secret churches attracting hundreds of thousands of worshippers. Evangelicals claim Christianity is growing faster in Iran than in any other country.

The spiritual gap between Iran’s Shia ayatollahs and the people they rule is widening. The strictures of the theocracy and the doctrine of Shia supremacy alienate many. So growing numbers of Iranians seem to be leaving religion or experimenting with alternatives to Shiism. Christians, Zoroastrians and Bahais all report soaring interest. Leaders of other forms of Islam speak of popular revivals. “There’s a loyalty change,” says Yaser Mirdamadi, a Shia cleric in exile. “Iranians are turning to other religions because they no longer find satisfaction in the official faith.”

…The repression isn’t working. The state says over 99.5% of Iran’s 82m people are Muslim. But its numbers are not reliable. A poll of more than 50,000 Iranians (about 90% of whom live in Iran) conducted online by Gamaan, a Dutch research group, found a country in religious flux. About half of the respondents said they had lost or changed their religion. Less than a third identified as Shia. If these numbers are even close to correct, Iran is much more diverse than its official census shows.

I see the propaganda mill is firing up to justify going to war with Iran, probably with an excuse of “liberating” them.

[Ken]

Came across this today and found it interesting: https://www.economist.com/middle-east-a ... her-faiths

Disenchanted Iranians are turning to other faiths

For father mansour, Christianity in Iran has all the excitement of the persecuted early church. In homes across the country he delivers his sermons in code, calling Jesus “Jamsheed”. He leads songs of praise in silence. “We lip-synch because we can’t worship out loud,” he says. The risks are great: proselytisation is banned; dozens of missionaries have been jailed. But so too are the spiritual rewards. Local pastors report hundreds of secret churches attracting hundreds of thousands of worshippers. Evangelicals claim Christianity is growing faster in Iran than in any other country.

The spiritual gap between Iran’s Shia ayatollahs and the people they rule is widening. The strictures of the theocracy and the doctrine of Shia supremacy alienate many. So growing numbers of Iranians seem to be leaving religion or experimenting with alternatives to Shiism. Christians, Zoroastrians and Bahais all report soaring interest. Leaders of other forms of Islam speak of popular revivals. “There’s a loyalty change,” says Yaser Mirdamadi, a Shia cleric in exile. “Iranians are turning to other religions because they no longer find satisfaction in the official faith.”

…The repression isn’t working. The state says over 99.5% of Iran’s 82m people are Muslim. But its numbers are not reliable. A poll of more than 50,000 Iranians (about 90% of whom live in Iran) conducted online by Gamaan, a Dutch research group, found a country in religious flux. About half of the respondents said they had lost or changed their religion. Less than a third identified as Shia. If these numbers are even close to correct, Iran is much more diverse than its official census shows.

I see the propaganda mill is firing up to justify going to war with Iran, probably with an excuse of “liberating” them.

So what is your theory Josh. That the article is false propaganda? Or that being a more Christian nation makes it more likely that the US will bomb Iran?