Election Investigations

Events occurring and how they relate/affect Anabaptist faith and culture.
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Robert
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Re: Election Investigations

Post by Robert »

Seems I am in the majority.

https://www.rasmussenreports.com/public ... ly_in_2024
A majority of voters expect cheating to influence next year’s presidential election, and see mail-in voting as part of the problem.

The latest Rasmussen Reports national telephone and online survey finds that 56% of Likely U.S. voters believe cheating is likely to affect the outcome of the next presidential election, including 31% who think it’s Very Likely. Thirty-seven percent (37%) say election cheating is unlikely to affect the 2024 outcome, including 16% who consider it Not At All Likely. These findings are almost identical to our September survey.
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Bootstrap
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Re: Election Investigations

Post by Bootstrap »

Robert wrote: Mon Nov 27, 2023 7:42 pm Seems I am in the majority.

https://www.rasmussenreports.com/public ... ly_in_2024
A majority of voters expect cheating to influence next year’s presidential election, and see mail-in voting as part of the problem.

The latest Rasmussen Reports national telephone and online survey finds that 56% of Likely U.S. voters believe cheating is likely to affect the outcome of the next presidential election, including 31% who think it’s Very Likely. Thirty-seven percent (37%) say election cheating is unlikely to affect the 2024 outcome, including 16% who consider it Not At All Likely. These findings are almost identical to our September survey.
Well, one of the candidates is on trial for cheating in the last election. I wouldn't find it surprising if he tried again. That's probably a good reason for making sure the trials go through if we care about cheating in elections.

Can't fix problems if you don't let election investigations happen and follow through on what you find.

Probably better to rely on evidence than on polls for this kind of thing.
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Bootstrap
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Re: Election Investigations

Post by Bootstrap »

Bootstrap wrote: Tue Nov 28, 2023 1:08 pm Probably better to rely on evidence than on polls for this kind of thing.
FWIW:

https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/4 ... egal-poll/
In a recent Fox News poll, a majority of registered voters, 53 percent, said they think Trump “did something illegal” related to “efforts to overturn the 2020 election.”

The survey released Wednesday also found that 20 percent of registered voters think Trump “did something wrong” but “not illegal.” Another 24 percent said the former president “did nothing seriously wrong.”
Again, polls are not a substitute for court cases. We do not conduct polls to decide who is guilty. And we shouldn't.
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Valerie
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Re: Election Investigations

Post by Valerie »

Bootstrap wrote: Tue Nov 28, 2023 2:55 pm
Bootstrap wrote: Tue Nov 28, 2023 1:08 pm Probably better to rely on evidence than on polls for this kind of thing.
FWIW:

https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/4 ... egal-poll/
In a recent Fox News poll, a majority of registered voters, 53 percent, said they think Trump “did something illegal” related to “efforts to overturn the 2020 election.”

The survey released Wednesday also found that 20 percent of registered voters think Trump “did something wrong” but “not illegal.” Another 24 percent said the former president “did nothing seriously wrong.”
Again, polls are not a substitute for court cases. We do not conduct polls to decide who is guilty. And we shouldn't.
I'd like to see a poll about who trusts court cases anymore. I think a lot of people realize judges have their own slant & biases. In fact that was one thing Trump ran on in 2016 wete these so called judges- part of the swamp he wished to drain.

My observation is since the polls show Trump leading all presidential candidates & slightly over Biden too, public opinion must be like a few of us here seem to kean- he had a right to consider this a fraudulant election. No other reason he's doing so well except apparently many thought he did a good job as well.
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Robert
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Re: Election Investigations

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Bootstrap wrote: Tue Nov 28, 2023 1:08 pm Well, one of the candidates is on trial for cheating in the last election. I wouldn't find it surprising if he tried again.
What happened to innocent until proven guilty in a court of law?
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Robert
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Re: Election Investigations

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Bootstrap wrote: Tue Nov 28, 2023 2:55 pm In a recent Fox News poll, a majority of registered voters, 53 percent, said they think Trump “did something illegal” related to “efforts to overturn the 2020 election.”
I personally think he did a lot of things wrong in challenging the elections. I do not think he was wrong in challenging them, but some of the actions taken were quite poor. I am not sure if they were illegal because I do not know all the charges or the laws concerning elections. I have to listen to lawyers who do and listen the the evidence for or against. Not even judges will see the laws the same and will rule differently, so how am I to judge?

I do not see his actions were at such a high level of badness that I would condemn him. I would advise for some different actions, but he never called or asked me.

What bothers me is the level of attack against him when I have seen worse by others and no one does anything to them. That is what bothers me and makes me push back at some of the claims out there. I have heard so many bad claims on other things that turned out to be a total distortion of the facts once it got to court. I just do not trust that what we are hearing is accurate. It has not been for years. Why would all the sudden it become accurate now?
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Josh
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Re: Election Investigations

Post by Josh »

Robert wrote: Tue Nov 28, 2023 8:55 pm
Bootstrap wrote: Tue Nov 28, 2023 1:08 pm Well, one of the candidates is on trial for cheating in the last election. I wouldn't find it surprising if he tried again.
What happened to innocent until proven guilty in a court of law?
There have now been numerous lawsuits (so far, they have been thrown out of court, though) trying to block Trump from being on the ballot under the premise someone who is indicted shouldn't be able to run for President.

It would appear that the liberal left has decided to abandon "innocent until proven guilty". We know from experience that abandoning this cornerstone of liberty and justice means ending up in a world like Stalin's Russia, where one is secretly judged, then summarily executed, often with no idea what one even did wrong.
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Ken
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Re: Election Investigations

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Josh wrote: Tue Nov 28, 2023 10:09 pm
Robert wrote: Tue Nov 28, 2023 8:55 pm
Bootstrap wrote: Tue Nov 28, 2023 1:08 pm Well, one of the candidates is on trial for cheating in the last election. I wouldn't find it surprising if he tried again.
What happened to innocent until proven guilty in a court of law?
There have now been numerous lawsuits (so far, they have been thrown out of court, though) trying to block Trump from being on the ballot under the premise someone who is indicted shouldn't be able to run for President.

It would appear that the liberal left has decided to abandon "innocent until proven guilty". We know from experience that abandoning this cornerstone of liberty and justice means ending up in a world like Stalin's Russia, where one is secretly judged, then summarily executed, often with no idea what one even did wrong.
This is your paragon of democratic values a few days ago on Thanksgiving of all days. And yes, that is all one sentence until he gets down to the third line from the bottom. Someone needs to revoke his semicolon privileges. This is not a well person.

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Robert
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Re: Election Investigations

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Ken, I tend to agree with most of what he posted, except for the name calling. These are political hit jobs trying to drain his resources so it makes it harder for him to campaign. The majority of the US see the same thing. This is why his poll numbers are going up. It is easy to see that these charges, although some may have legitimate basis, are "Trumped up" and are political.

You are welcome to think they are all legitimate, but most Republicans and Independents are seeing it differently.

I am still a Ramaswamy supporter, just vocally not financially. I would rather see him then Trump, but I do not like the political games being played with and through the Justices system, DOJ and FBI. Many people are seeing the same and are starting to support Trump in the hopes that much of the federal control gets dismantled because it is way too strong and too corrupt.

I no longer give the federal government the benefit of the doubt, but distrust anything it does. Once the US government makes an announcement, I now automatically suspect it a lie and they are hiding something. Many others feel the same.

The US does not have, nor ever did have, a Justice system. It has a legal system. Many minorities are now supporting Trump because he has been arrested and has experienced the unfair system. They see him as someone who will try to tear it down because it was unfair to him just like it was unfair to them and their family.

Many of the court cases involving the 2020 election were thrown out because "lack of standing." The courts did not want to be to blame or have to make a decision, so they claimed the people bringing the cases had no "standing" or should have filed before the election. The times they did file before the election, the court said there was no misdoings since the election had not happened yet. So you can't file before the election and you can't file after. Makes it real hard to seek "justice."

It can be hard to step back and look at the system honestly. The reality is the US system of "justice" is anything but that. The federal agencies are corrupt and we are being lied to about many things, wars and finances alike. The emperor has no clothes. Much of what we think we have in the US is a delusion. The government is bankrupt and the politicians only do what they have to to get reelected to keep their power. The system is corrupt and bankrupt. It needs a hard reset.
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Ken
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Re: Election Investigations

Post by Ken »

Robert wrote: Wed Nov 29, 2023 7:51 amKen, I tend to agree with most of what he posted, except for the name calling. These are political hit jobs trying to drain his resources so it makes it harder for him to campaign. The majority of the US see the same thing. This is why his poll numbers are going up. It is easy to see that these charges, although some may have legitimate basis, are "Trumped up" and are political.
So do you disbelieve the evidence against him that has been presented in each of these cases. and that prosecutors are manufacturing false evidence against Trump?

Or do you believe that he shouldn't be held accountable for his actions because....? Because he is rich and powerful and named Trump?
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