Trump Budget Swaps Food Stamps for '100 Percent American' Food

[Josh]

That's a good point. And it especially affects access to fruit and vegetables, the shelf-stable stuff is easy to find in these areas, though the prices are marked up way too high.

The farmers market I used to go to in eastern Cleveland had rock bottom prices, excellent quality produce, poor sales, and was walking distance from many SNAP customers.

Perhaps there’s something bigger at play here.

[Bootstrap]

I want to ask an honest question of those who seem militantly opposed to this:

Are you sure you don’t have some anti-Trump bias leaking through?

I don't think I'm "militantly opposed" to this, I'm still trying to understand what it would mean and how it would compare to other ways of providing the same idea. I don't think we've been discussing Trump in this thread, and I don't think we should discuss this as a Trump popularity contest.

That cuts both ways. Let's not dismiss something because Trump proposed it, but let's not say it must not be criticized because Trump proposed it either. Let's just discuss the issue.

What actions from his administrstion’s USDA and HHS would please you?

That's a broad question, let me limit it to SNAP. I would like to see clearly stated goals for the program and a plan that meets those goals. I would like to understand what alternatives were considered and why this is the best approach. To me, "best" means that it provides for poor people well, seeks to build independence rather than dependency over time, considers cost and efficiency, avoids potential fraud, etc.

If the government wants to send out boxes, I wonder if the government can do logistics cheaper than private industry, and whether we should allow all companies to provide these services on equal footing, e.g. Walmart, Amazon, Aldi, etc.

That kind of stuff might come out in the coming weeks, or perhaps we will find that the proposal is not that well thought out. It's too early to tell. This proposal will be considered by Congress, it may or may not be adopted.

[mike]

I just realized that the USDA must keep track of what SNAP money is spent on. Here's where you can find that:

Foods Typically Purchased by Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program (SNAP) Households

It also compares their spending to non-SNAP households, so it's a very useful summary. Looks like vegetables are the #3 item for SNAP spending, but sweetened beverages are #2. Banning pop sounds like a great idea. Beyond that, spending is less different than I would have thought, SNAP households do not spend more money on candy, for instance.

• About 40 cents of every food purchase dollar was spent on basic items like meat, fruits, vegetables, milk, eggs, and bread.
• Another 20 cents was spent on sweetened drinks, desserts, salty snacks, candy, and sugar.
• The remaining 40 cents was spent on a variety of items such as cereal, prepared foods, other dairy products, rice, beans, and other cooking ingredients.
• The top 10 summary categories (Table 1) and top 7 commodities by expenditure were the same for SNAP and non-SNAP households, although ranked in slightly different orders.

The USDA doesn't keep track. This data is from 2011 Point of Sale data from a single grocery retailer.

But this is quite interesting. A primary question that comes from this is whether there should be any expectation that SNAP beneficiaries make different food choices than the other food purchasers? If not, then let them spend their benefits how they wish. If there is, then the question is what is the best way of controlling their food choices?

Also, some of this discussion makes the new SNAP acronym a bit interesting. "Food Stamps" really describes the current program much better than "Supplemental Nutrion Assistance Program." Because the benefits can be used for anything food, and there is zero attempt by the government to influence the nutritional value of the food benefits. If anything, an attempt to influence food choices, whether it be eliminating soda or direct delivery of food staples, would make the acronym more accurate.

[GaryK]

We have been working with a family of 5 that gets around $900.00/month in food money. The wife complained once that she was so ready to get her next month's amount because they were tired of eating chicken every night for dinner. She also once complained that they had to eat pork 3 evenings in a row because they didn't have anything else.

Last year she began working one day per week for a family in our church who run a bakery/coffee shoppe, working about 4 hours per week. Her monthly take home pay averaged less than $150.00. When she went to reapply for her food benefits she discovered they were going to cut the amount by $200.00.

Meanwhile, the family in our church she worked for has been struggling to make ends meet with 9 in the family and for a time were doing without meat in their diet.

Looking at all this it doesn't take a genius to figure out that something is in serious need of reform and I'm happy to see that the conversation is taking place.

[Josh]

The thread title has “Trump” in it, the people opposed are the typical anti-Trump wing, the people in favour are the typical pro-right-wing.

Come on Boot. We can all do better than this.

[Bootstrap]

The thread title has “Trump” in it, the people opposed are the typical anti-Trump wing, the people in favour are the typical pro-right-wing.

Come on Boot. We can all do better than this.

We actually are doing better than that.

Pay attention to what people are actually saying in their posts. Please don't pretend that nobody is capable of rational thought and discussion. Please don't drag this thread down into a partisan feud. People are coming up with thoughts that run in a variety of directions and responding to each other well in this thread. I'd like to see more threads like this one.

[ohio jones]

If the government wants to send out boxes, I wonder if the government can do logistics cheaper than private industry, and whether we should allow all companies to provide these services on equal footing, e.g. Walmart, Amazon, Aldi, etc.

Well, the government does have a fleet of military drones that could be repurposed, instead of subcontracting the deliveries to Amazon Prime Air.

[Bootstrap]

The USDA doesn't keep track. This data is from 2011 Point of Sale data from a single grocery retailer.

Ooops, I should have read that more carefully - thanks for the correction!

But this is quite interesting. A primary question that comes from this is whether there should be any expectation that SNAP beneficiaries make different food choices than the other food purchasers? If not, then let them spend their benefits how they wish. If there is, then the question is what is the best way of controlling their food choices?

If this store is representative (and I don't know if it is), then the single biggest issue is sugary drinks which are really bad for you, and I would rather not pay for that as a taxpayer. Especially if I might have to pay for it a second time when someone gets Type 2 Diabetes or other obesity-related or sugar-related illnesses.

Gary's post brings up another issue - meat and some other things are expensive choices if you are poor, but they are deeply embedded in parts of our culture. I don't eat much meat, and I'd rather not pay someone else to eat more meat than I do, but I don't know how realistic it is to expect poor people to learn how to cook Indian and Mexican foods with rice and beans and such. Actually, the Latin American population does quite well at that, I would be surprised if their SNAP benefits were going toward as much meat as the general population.

[Valerie]

We have been working with a family of 5 that gets around $900.00/month in food money. The wife complained once that she was so ready to get her next month's amount because they were tired of eating chicken every night for dinner. She also once complained that they had to eat pork 3 evenings in a row because they didn't have anything else.

Last year she began working one day per week for a family in our church who run a bakery/coffee shoppe, working about 4 hours per week. Her monthly take home pay averaged less than $150.00. When she went to reapply for her food benefits she discovered they were going to cut the amount by $200.00.

Meanwhile, the family in our church she worked for has been struggling to make ends meet with 9 in the family and for a time were doing without meat in their diet.

Looking at all this it doesn't take a genius to figure out that something is in serious need of reform and I'm happy to see that the conversation is taking place.

My Dad grew up extremely poor- there was no assistance at the time- fortunately a friend's family fed him quite a bit-
My Mother's family was also poor for a period of time. They ate beans for supper every night. Mom said when they finally had enough money to buy a chicken for supper, she cried because she was used to (and missed) the beans-

By the way- where I work is in a pretty good area, income wise- I guess I was taken aback that so many people use the Ohio EBT card- (when they go to pay they either show it to me or they have to divide what it DOES cover, from what it doesn't and pay the rest another way). As far as the difference between what people buy who aren't using the EBT card/program and those who DO need the assistance- I have come to the conclusion (sadly) that most people, at least in my area- eat a bunch of JUNK food, chips, candy, frozen dinners, ice cream & LOTS of soda pop!!- THIS also surprised me because it's a fairly nice area so you kind of assume more educated people, make better food choices just because that information is out there and present-
So it seems from where I stand (scan) I almost picture people buying their food and then returning to the prescription counter for all the ailments that the way we eat (in general) cause. I had a lady unloading her food & saying "I was just diagnosed with diabetes and here i am buying all these cookies". Well she came to the wrong cashier having seen how diabetes affected my husband who had it 28 years with Loads of consequences- I really didn't mean to lecture her but I guess I sort of did in love and care for her to take this SERIOUS- (she said no one ever talked to her like this before) and what was sad too, is after all that she said she is a nurse. Anyway- point being- I see MOST people mix fruits and vegetables with a whole lotta JUNK FOOD and find it very sad.

[mike]

A primary question that comes from this is whether there should be any expectation that SNAP beneficiaries make different food choices than the other food purchasers? If not, then let them spend their benefits how they wish. If there is, then the question is what is the best way of controlling their food choices?

If this store is representative (and I don't know if it is), then the single biggest issue is sugary drinks which are really bad for you, and I would rather not pay for that as a taxpayer. Especially if I might have to pay for it a second time when someone gets Type 2 Diabetes or other obesity-related or sugar-related illnesses.

Gary's post brings up another issue - meat and some other things are expensive choices if you are poor, but they are deeply embedded in parts of our culture. I don't eat much meat, and I'd rather not pay someone else to eat more meat than I do, but I don't know how realistic it is to expect poor people to learn how to cook Indian and Mexican foods with rice and beans and such. Actually, the Latin American population does quite well at that, I would be surprised if their SNAP benefits were going toward as much meat as the general population.

How would you answer the question, Should there be any expectation that SNAP beneficiaries make different food choices than other food purchasers?