Has anyone claimed that is happening?
When Catholics leave the church…
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Re: When Catholics leave the church…
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Re: When Catholics leave the church…
They do but it is done differently. Catholics have organizations like Opus Dei that attempt to enforce adherence to doctrine amongst those in power in government and business. Especially in overtly Catholic countries such as in Latin America. So it is kind of more like "secret societies" that run things behind the scenes rather than morality police that enforce standards among ordinary people like you would see in Muslim countries or within some conservative churches.
My wife has cousins who are in Opus Dei and in high-ranking positions in government and business in Chile so I've gotten a sense of how that works. They are more interested in controlling policy behind the scenes.
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Re: When Catholics leave the church…
Well, when Sudsy suggested that there "is not a demand that they must live a certain way or they can't be part of that church" there was a guy that claimed what Sudsy said wasn't true, and as an example claimed some churches ostracize anyone who isn't MAGA.
If that's not a claim of political affiliation as a test of membership, then the example cited was irrelevant to the claim being made.
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Re: When Catholics leave the church…
The existence of political divisions within a church and and the ostracizing of members who do not adhere to the dominant political ideology is not the same thing as having an actual political affiliation test for membership.ken_sylvania wrote: ↑Fri Feb 09, 2024 12:06 pmWell, when Sudsy suggested that there "is not a demand that they must live a certain way or they can't be part of that church" there was a guy that claimed what Sudsy said wasn't true, and as an example claimed some churches ostracize anyone who isn't MAGA.
If that's not a claim of political affiliation as a test of membership, then the example cited was irrelevant to the claim being made.
Although there actually are examples of pastors being fired for their politics or for not supporting Trump. So perhaps that is an example of what you are talking about: https://www.reckon.news/news/2021/10/a- ... hings.html
Last edited by Ken on Fri Feb 09, 2024 12:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: When Catholics leave the church…
Then it's not a demand that they must live a certain way or they can't be part of that church. So apparently what Sudsy said was true, after all.Ken wrote: ↑Fri Feb 09, 2024 12:26 pmPolitical divisions within a church and and the ostracizing of members who do not adhere to the dominant political ideology is not the same thing as having an actual political affiliation test for membership.ken_sylvania wrote: ↑Fri Feb 09, 2024 12:06 pmWell, when Sudsy suggested that there "is not a demand that they must live a certain way or they can't be part of that church" there was a guy that claimed what Sudsy said wasn't true, and as an example claimed some churches ostracize anyone who isn't MAGA.
If that's not a claim of political affiliation as a test of membership, then the example cited was irrelevant to the claim being made.
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Re: When Catholics leave the church…
I'm not sure what specific point you think you are arguing with. I was responding to BOTH Goodgirl and Sudsy to make the point that there are, indeed, many "bitter" ex-evangelicals who have been ostracized from their churches over political differences. This has been well documented trend and happening all across the country. Both on right and left.ken_sylvania wrote: ↑Fri Feb 09, 2024 12:27 pmThen it's not a demand that they must live a certain way or they can't be part of that church. So apparently what Sudsy said was true, after all.Ken wrote: ↑Fri Feb 09, 2024 12:26 pmPolitical divisions within a church and and the ostracizing of members who do not adhere to the dominant political ideology is not the same thing as having an actual political affiliation test for membership.ken_sylvania wrote: ↑Fri Feb 09, 2024 12:06 pm
Well, when Sudsy suggested that there "is not a demand that they must live a certain way or they can't be part of that church" there was a guy that claimed what Sudsy said wasn't true, and as an example claimed some churches ostracize anyone who isn't MAGA.
If that's not a claim of political affiliation as a test of membership, then the example cited was irrelevant to the claim being made.
Does it rise to the level of formal excommunication or stripping of membership over political differences. Probably not, at least not commonly. But it is a real thing. And as I pointed out above, there are certainly ministers who have been fired over their lack of support for Trump. Which isn't exactly the same thing as church membership but similar.
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Re: When Catholics leave the church…
In the MB church I attended there was this one fellow that would try to get conversation going on politics and he came across as being very bitter. What I noticed was people would just find reasons to break off conversations with him and either walk away or work hard to change the subject. I was one who tried to just say something like 'we sure live in a crazy world don't we' and then try to change the subject.
I have a Christian neighbour that loves to talk about all the things wrong with this world and I sometimes listen and not interrupt him on whatever his latest concerns are. But then don't let on whether I agree with him or not. Sometimes people just need to vent their bitterness about something of this world and not joining in with them can have a positive impact, in my experience.
I have a Christian neighbour that loves to talk about all the things wrong with this world and I sometimes listen and not interrupt him on whatever his latest concerns are. But then don't let on whether I agree with him or not. Sometimes people just need to vent their bitterness about something of this world and not joining in with them can have a positive impact, in my experience.
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Re: When Catholics leave the church…
Agreed. We have met a number of people who do this. Sometimes they are elderly and need to voice their fears. Sometimes they are angry or negative personalities who are mentally stuck on a single attitude.Sudsy wrote: ↑Fri Feb 09, 2024 1:32 pm In the MB church I attended there was this one fellow that would try to get conversation going on politics and he came across as being very bitter. What I noticed was people would just find reasons to break off conversations with him and either walk away or work hard to change the subject. I was one who tried to just say something like 'we sure live in a crazy world don't we' and then try to change the subject.
I have a Christian neighbour that loves to talk about all the things wrong with this world and I sometimes listen and not interrupt him on whatever his latest concerns are. But then don't let on whether I agree with him or not. Sometimes people just need to vent their bitterness about something of this world and not joining in with them can have a positive impact, in my experience.
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Max (Plain Catholic)
Mt 24:35
Proverbs 18:2 A fool does not delight in understanding but only in revealing his own mind.
1 Corinthians 3:19 For the wisdom of this world is folly with God
Mt 24:35
Proverbs 18:2 A fool does not delight in understanding but only in revealing his own mind.
1 Corinthians 3:19 For the wisdom of this world is folly with God
Re: When Catholics leave the church…
To Judas,
No. I am quite familiar with SSPX, but mo I do not belong.
My Tridentine experience is completely within the Diocesan framework.
I just prefer it to the Novus Ordo Mass. that is a Latin phrase for the post Vatican II mass that translated means banal.
No. I am quite familiar with SSPX, but mo I do not belong.
My Tridentine experience is completely within the Diocesan framework.
I just prefer it to the Novus Ordo Mass. that is a Latin phrase for the post Vatican II mass that translated means banal.
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