Soloist wrote: ↑Sat Feb 03, 2024 9:41 am
JohnHurt wrote: ↑Sat Feb 03, 2024 9:30 am
Soloist wrote: ↑Sat Feb 03, 2024 9:00 am
I can quote it and I will but I suspect you will discount it.
Hos 4:12 My people ask counsel at their stocks, and their staff declareth unto them: for the spirit of whoredoms hath caused them to err, and they have gone a whoring from under their God.
2Ki 17:17 And they caused their sons and their daughters to pass through the fire, and used divination and enchantments, and sold themselves to do evil in the sight of the LORD, to provoke him to anger.
I am sorry, I cannot find water dowsing in any of these passages.
And if holding a stick is "witchcraft", then you need to explain the staff that Moses held.
As I said.
I’ll answer your further questions if you answer my single question.
How do you determine what is witchcraft?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Witchcraft
Wikipedia states that:
Traditionally, "witchcraft" means the use of magic or supernatural powers to inflict harm or misfortune on others, and this remains the most common and widespread meaning.
I don't see where finding water to drink inflicts harm or misfortune on others. That's One.
In the Bible, the word "witch" is found in Exodus 22:18 and other places. It comes from the word "kashaph" Strongs 3784, which Strongs defines as:
a primitive root; properly, to whisper a spell, i.e. to inchant or practise magic:--sorcerer, (use) witch(-craft).
No, I never saw the dowser whisper a spell, nor did I repeat an incantation when the coat hangers moved in my hands. That's two.
Also in the Bible is the famous "witch of Endor" (1 Sam 28:7-25), a woman who was a necromancer that allowed the living to speak with the dead. This is prohibited by God:
Deut 18:(10) There shall not be found among you any one that maketh his son or his daughter to pass through the fire, or that useth divination, or an observer of times, or an enchanter, or a witch,
(11) Or a charmer, or a consulter with familiar spirits, or a wizard, or a necromancer.
(12) For all that do these things are an abomination unto the LORD: and because of these abominations the LORD thy God doth drive them out from before thee.
I never once saw a dowser use any of these prohibited things. Finding water for people to drink has never been prohibited by God. That's three.
The word "divination" in Deut 18:10 is Strongs 7081 "qecem" that Strongs defines as: from 'qacam' (7080); a lot: also divination (including its fee), oracle:--(reward of) divination, divine sentence, witchcraft.
I would suggest that is is casting lots, casting bones, or rolling the dice, and giving an answer in return for a fee.
My dowser never cast a lot, bones, rolled the dice, or even took a fee for his services, so it cannot be "divination". That is four.
Also, Mr. Soloist, remember that I used a coat hanger to find water, and not a wooden stick. So I did not consult a wooden stick to find the water, or even talk to my metal coat hanger. That is five.
So where is it?
Where are the verses in the Bible that tell us not to find water using a metal coat hanger as it comes from the Devil?
And please remember Deuteronomy 4:2:
(2) Ye shall not add unto the word which I command you, neither shall ye diminish ought from it, that ye may keep the commandments of the LORD your God which I command you.
If you are adding your own prejudices to the Bible, then you are teaching something that is outside of Deuteronomy 4:2.
Christ condemned the Pharisees for adding to their "tradition of the elders" that eating with unwashen hands was a religious sin. Mark 7:1-5. It is not a sin at all, it is a doctrine of men.
Christ condemned them for adding this requirement to the word of God by saying:
Mark 7:(7) Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
Adding to the Word of God makes our worship of God vain.
This idea that finding water using a coat hanger is from the devil - this looks to me like it is a commandment of men, and not from God.
But if you have a verse that say otherwise, I am all ears.
Also, if you don't believe in water dowsing, I can accept that position completely. The proof is that dowsing works for a LOT of people, and not whether you believe it or not.
But that is not your position. Your position is that water dowsing is from the devil, and that is something totally different. That statement is hurtful and insulting, and it is not in the Bible.
So go ahead. I have answered your questions. Now answer mine.
Where is finding water with a coat hanger prohibited in the Bible?
Thanks,
John
"He replaced the teachings of Christ with his own opinions, and gave us a religion based on the doctrines of men."