Page 1 of 2
As grace window closes, UMC is 25% smaller
Posted: Sat Jan 13, 2024 4:47 pm
by MaxPC
With the number of exiting churches exceeding expectations, a lifelong United Methodist thinks his denomination will continue to suffer losses for embracing heresy.
United Methodist rules forbid same-sex marriage rites and the ordination of "self-avowed practicing homosexuals," but liberal Methodist churches and regional governing bodies in the U.S. have increasingly been defying those rules.
In 2019, a special legislative gathering voted to strengthen longstanding bans on same-sex marriage and LGBTQ ordination. The votes came from a coalition of conservatives in the U.S. and overseas, and that conference also began offering a five-year window for U.S. churches to leave the denomination under somewhat favorable terms.
Progressive, dissenting congregations were expected to utilize that window, but the vast majority of departing congregations were those dismayed over what they saw as the denomination's failure to discipline those defying church law.
So, for nearly five years, United Methodist congregations that refused to compromise on biblical marriage have been able to leave the denomination and keep their land and buildings if they paid a fee to the UMC. When that grace period ends December 31st, there will no longer be an official way for churches in United Methodism to leave the denomination and keep their property.
Article
Re: As grace window closes, UMC is 25% smaller
Posted: Sat Jan 13, 2024 6:09 pm
by QuietlyListening
I have several family members that are part of the UMC. some churches were given extensions as they are still trying to get something worked out- many are being charged exorbitant figures to keep their building- they were all payed up in 'fees' so to speak and had paid for the church and the conference wasn't supporting them but still having to pay millions to get out.
Being tied to a building is crazy but many are and so are struggling to know what to do- that is if they got the extension. Others just decided to stay and do their own thing.
And I have family on both sides of the issue. Not a subject talked about when together.
Re: As grace window closes, UMC is 25% smaller
Posted: Sat Jan 13, 2024 6:27 pm
by Josh
The two churches that still have members here both went gmc.
The other one has tiny attendance and rumour is the building will be up for sale soon.
Re: As grace window closes, UMC is 25% smaller
Posted: Sat Jan 13, 2024 8:01 pm
by Ken
The Methodist church has its roots in an 18th Century schism from the Church of England. John Wesley was an Anglican cleric who originally wanted to reform the Church of England rather than split from it.
Today it is splitting again over LGBT issues with about 75% sticking with the more LGBT-friendly mainstream church and 25% leaving for the less LGBT-friendly Global Methodist Church. Which strikes me as remarkably similar to the current percentage split in American public opinion towards LGBT rights.
Re: As grace window closes, UMC is 25% smaller
Posted: Sat Jan 13, 2024 8:07 pm
by Soloist
Ken wrote: ↑Sat Jan 13, 2024 8:01 pm
The Methodist church has its roots in an 18th Century schism from the Church of England. John Wesley was an Anglican cleric who originally wanted to reform the Church of England rather than split from it.
Today it is splitting again over LGBT issues with about 75% sticking with the more LGBT-friendly mainstream church and 25% leaving for the less LGBT-friendly Global Methodist Church. Which strikes me as remarkably similar to the current percentage split in American public opinion towards LGBT rights.
That shouldn’t really be any surprise, the Methodist church has been walking with the world just a few years behind for years.
Re: As grace window closes, UMC is 25% smaller
Posted: Sat Jan 13, 2024 10:00 pm
by MaxPC
Soloist wrote: ↑Sat Jan 13, 2024 8:07 pm
That shouldn’t really be any surprise, the Methodist church has been walking with the world just a few years behind for years.
Indeed; we have Methodist friends whose congregation just left UMC and are joining the Biblically adherent Global Methodist Church. They said a number of congregations have joined the Wesleyan MC which also emphasizes Biblical adherence. Both GMC and Wesleyan retain the teaching on Biblical marriage between one man and one woman.
Re: As grace window closes, UMC is 25% smaller
Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2024 7:32 am
by Josh
MaxPC wrote: ↑Sat Jan 13, 2024 10:00 pm
Soloist wrote: ↑Sat Jan 13, 2024 8:07 pm
That shouldn’t really be any surprise, the Methodist church has been walking with the world just a few years behind for years.
Indeed; we have Methodist friends whose congregation just left UMC and are joining the Biblically adherent Global Methodist Church. They said a number of congregations have joined the Wesleyan MC which also emphasizes Biblical adherence. Both GMC and Wesleyan retain the teaching on Biblical marriage between one man and one woman.
I live in what is basically the centre of Wesleyan holiness churches, and so far not a single formerly-UMC church has decided to go that route. They’ve either become independent churches or gone with GMC.
My local UMC church (in a town of 50 or so inhabitants) is now just Anytown Community Church. The bigger church in the nearest sizeable town is just Anytown Methodist Church - they didn’t change their name.
25 miles away, the Wesleyan Holiness seminary/college and churches keep plugging away. But I have seen no forging of connections between former UMC and even groups like Free Methodists. Basically, GMC is a good bit more liberal than Holiness groups or even Free Methodists. I suspect the women pastors issue is one of the main issues.
Re: As grace window closes, UMC is 25% smaller
Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2024 8:29 am
by Neto
My sons have a friend whose wife is the pastor in a church here nearby, and if this is the same denomination, the thing that prevented the entire group from going liberal on this is that they operate as an international group, and the member congregations in African countries are still holding the line Biblically (at least on this particular issue), and they are by far the majority. It has been going on for years, with the US leaders becoming more and more defiant. The ability for a congregation to leave the larger US group w/o loosing their building is, as I understand, the result of a pretty recent compromise.
This is a problem for any conservative congregation that is a member of a largely liberal denomination where the property is all owned by the organization, and not the congregation that in general actually paid for it.
Re: As grace window closes, UMC is 25% smaller
Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2024 9:21 am
by Josh
The liberals gamed the system and gave American churches more votes per church/member than the Africans have. Quite convenient.
Re: As grace window closes, UMC is 25% smaller
Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2024 1:32 pm
by Ken
Josh wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2024 9:21 am
The liberals gamed the system and gave American churches more votes per church/member than the Africans have. Quite convenient.
The article posted by MaxPC says the EXACT OPPOSITE:
In 2019, a special legislative gathering voted to strengthen longstanding bans on same-sex marriage and LGBTQ ordination. The votes came from a coalition of conservatives in the U.S. and overseas, and that conference also began offering a five-year window for U.S. churches to leave the denomination under somewhat favorable terms.
Progressive, dissenting congregations were expected to utilize that window, but the vast majority of departing congregations were those dismayed over what they saw as the denomination's failure to discipline those defying church law.
So, for nearly five years, United Methodist congregations that refused to compromise on biblical marriage have been able to leave the denomination and keep their land and buildings if they paid a fee to the UMC. When that grace period ends December 31st, there will no longer be an official way for churches in United Methodism to leave the denomination and keep their property.