Replying to John Hurt re: Dispensationalism, et al

[JohnHurt]

Yes, and that’s entirely different from babbling nonsense that has no chance at being “interpreted”.

Everybody wants to see a "miracle".

Babbling in nonsense is the easiest "miracle" there is.

When I grew up in the 1970s, the Belmont Church of Christ in Nashville "went off the deep end" with tongues. The minister, Don Finto, would get people to speak in tongues and then have someone "interpret" for them. As a college prank and on a "dare", a young man ran up to the front of the church, and spoke in the goofiest tongues he could manage for 3 minutes, then sat down. Then a young lady got up and "interpreted" that he had said something beautiful.

Tongues like that are not a real miracle, but a really good "crowd pleaser". And crowds really like "miracles".

Miracles do happen, but they need to be in private. When Christ created bread out of 5 barley loaves, they wanted to make Him a king by force. John 6:13-15. That is where public miracles lead.

I have seen people healed privately, and I have been healed in private through the power of prayer. I had joint problems, and I was looking at a knee replacement. I asked for the prayers of the church, and the men of the congregation all put their hands on me and prayed fervently for my healing. I felt partial relief immediately, but then God opened doors for me, and I was shown "by chance" how to find the steps for complete healing. It was simple, but I would have never figured it out on my own. To the world it would be called "coincidence", but to me, I was healed in a private way by a miracle of God. I have never had any problems with my knees since. I give God the glory.

To me, having good health is a miracle. I credit following the dietary food laws of Leviticus 11 as being the most healthy thing I have ever done. God has taken care of me on this, and it has been a real blessing.

And having 6 boys, a good wife, two daughters in law, and we all "get along" and like each other, is the greatest miracle in my life. But these are all "private" miracles that the world cannot see, and God gets the glory.

I don't see what speaking in an unknown tongue in public can accomplish, when you can say the same thing in English without all of the "hoopla".

Speaking in tongues in Acts 2 is not the same as speaking in tongues in 1 Cor 14. Paul has it "all figured out" about "unknown tongues" in 1 Cor 14, but Paul is wrong, yet again. Paul was not with the church in Acts 2, and so he did not witness what actually happened.

Paul's understanding of the purpose of tongues is wrong, and that is what makes his instructions about tongues in 1 Cor 14 wrong as well. There is absolutely no reason to speak in unknown tongues with an "interpreter." Understanding how ridiculous "unknown tongues" is provides another really good reason why the writings of Paul should be avoided.

[gcdonner]

George,

I appreciate your insights.

Looking at "this generation" in Matt 24, from your viewpoint:

Which verses do you think occurred before the Destruction of Jerusalem in AD 70, which were during, and which came after?

I understand verses 15-20 encouraged the followers of Christ to leave Jerusalem for Pella. Is that accurate?

Thanks,

John

It all was fulfilled in "this generation" since that is what Jesus said. Essentially up to and including AD70.
Pella was the destination for many Christians fleeing from Jerusalem according to the Christian historian Eusebius and referenced in Revelation 12.
I agree that verses 15-20 are an encouragement to Jewish Christians to flee the city.

[gcdonner]

Yes, and that’s entirely different from babbling nonsense that has no chance at being “interpreted”.

Everybody wants to see a "miracle".

Babbling in nonsense is the easiest "miracle" there is.

When I grew up in the 1970s, the Belmont Church of Christ in Nashville "went off the deep end" with tongues. The minister, Don Finto, would get people to speak in tongues and then have someone "interpret" for them. As a college prank and on a "dare", a young man ran up to the front of the church, and spoke in the goofiest tongues he could manage for 3 minutes, then sat down. Then a young lady got up and "interpreted" that he had said something beautiful.

Tongues like that are not a real miracle, but a really good "crowd pleaser". And crowds really like "miracles".

Miracles do happen, but they need to be in private. When Christ created bread out of 5 barley loaves, they wanted to make Him a king by force. John 6:13-15. That is where public miracles lead.

I have seen people healed privately, and I have been healed in private through the power of prayer. I had joint problems, and I was looking at a knee replacement. I asked for the prayers of the church, and the men of the congregation all put their hands on me and prayed fervently for my healing. I felt partial relief immediately, but then God opened doors for me, and I was shown "by chance" how to find the steps for complete healing. It was simple, but I would have never figured it out on my own. To the world it would be called "coincidence", but to me, I was healed in a private way by a miracle of God. I have never had any problems with my knees since. I give God the glory.

To me, having good health is a miracle. I credit following the dietary food laws of Leviticus 11 as being the most healthy thing I have ever done. God has taken care of me on this, and it has been a real blessing.

And having 6 boys, a good wife, two daughters in law, and we all "get along" and like each other, is the greatest miracle in my life. But these are all "private" miracles that the world cannot see, and God gets the glory.

I don't see what speaking in an unknown tongue in public can accomplish, when you can say the same thing in English without all of the "hoopla".

Speaking in tongues in Acts 2 is not the same as speaking in tongues in 1 Cor 14. Paul has it "all figured out" about "unknown tongues" in 1 Cor 14, but Paul is wrong, yet again. Paul was not with the church in Acts 2, and so he did not witness what actually happened.

Paul's understanding of the purpose of tongues is wrong, and that is what makes his instructions about tongues in 1 Cor 14 wrong as well. There is absolutely no reason to speak in unknown tongues with an "interpreter." Understanding how ridiculous "unknown tongues" is provides another really good reason why the writings of Paul should be avoided.

I guess you didn't read the story I related...ignorance is not bliss. If you read Paul you would know the benefit of speaking in tongues in a church service, which is not the same as praying in tongues in public and Paul does not condone that. I can agree that much of what passes for speaking in tongues in the modern Charismatic movement is gibberish, but don't throw out the baby with the bath water. There were many false christs in the first century too.